So What's The Deal With These LEDs?

chipmunkofdoom2

Well-Known Member
A good question, I'm glad you asked. Well, technically, I asked myself, but many people out there are hearing more and more and more about LEDs and starting to wonder if they're right for their tank. The good news is for MOST hobbyists and MOST tanks, LEDs are a great lighting solution. You'll notice I placed emphasis on the word most.. unfortunately, LEDs just don't work in some tanks. Unless you have a very large tank that's very deep, you won't have to worry about this though. Read on!

*DISCLAIMER* - This guide is meant to give a brief overview LEDs, the technology behind them and how we can make them work for our aquariums. It is not a chemistry class. If I don't properly articulate the behavior of electrons according to the Valence Bond theory, sorry.. I'm no chemistry nerd, but I know LEDs, and all examples and oversimplifications are meant to illustrate the differences between technologies. Also, I have NO affiliation with LED manufacturers or any LED lighting companies. I simply am a science geek and love technology. And aquariums :)


HISTORY

LEDs first became a viable technology in 1962. It's important to note that viable in this case means a very low powered red LED, but at that point scientists had officially figured out how to make an LED. The technology has come a long way and instead of a dim red glow, we now have dazzling, powerfully bright diodes. It truly is an example of better living through chemistry!

Most light sources function by using electricity to heat gas or electrify it in such a way that light is emitted. Fluorescent lights, for example (T5s, PCs) contain gasses that when exposed to electricity emit light. MH and HPS bulbs operate by arcing electricity through a mixture of high pressure gasses and salts to produce light. LEDs are totally different. LEDs are more closely related to the microchips in the computer you're reading this on than current lighting technologies.

LED stands for Light Emitting Diode (duh!). A diode is typically any electronic component that has 2 leads and conducts electricity, although in most cases (including that of LEDs) the diode is actually a semiconducting diode. We can go into all sorts of interesting info about how semiconductors work, but the bottom line is they control the flow of electrons. It is worth mentioning that everything we use electronic today owes its existence to transistors and semiconductors. Without them we would not have the technology we do today. At any rate, the semiconducting diode found in LEDs creates light in the same way a bridge would allow a hiker to cross a span, interestingly enough. In the case of an LED, instead of a bridge spanning two cliff edges, imagine a giant egg crate between two spans that electrons desperately want to get across. The egg crate (our semiconducting material) has slots where electrons can fit in. Once all the holes in the egg crate are filled with electrons, the rest of the electrons can pass right over and continue on their way. The interesting side effect of this "egg crate" filling with electrons and allowing other electrons to pass is that due to the chemical compounds used to make the semiconductor (egg crate), when the semiconductor is full of electrons, it emits photons! Wohoo!


AQUARIUM USE

Alright, so now that I've bored you with some science I'll get back to the point of using LEDs for aquarium use. The first LEDs used for aquariums were produced by a company called PFO, a fixture called the Solaris in fact. This light was on the cutting edge of technology. The high powered LEDs it was using were essentially almost prototypes. They were expensive (unconfirmed sources have quoted over $10 a piece), the circuitry used to create all the neat effects was under-designed and problematic for many (and the topic of a patent infringement lawsuit that PFO is probably still fighting today), and worst of all, they were expensive. Beyond prohibitively so. Since they were so bleeding edge, they were costly to make, costly to sell, and broke down a lot. Whether it was the patent lawsuit, poor design, the technology wasn't ready, or maybe a mixture of everything, PFO closed down shop and any remaining Solaris units are without support, and eventually will likely break down. We've had a big drought over the past few years, but a few manufacturers are getting their toes wet again with the LED technology.


WHAT'S THE BIG FUSS?

Okay, you're thinking to yourself, so a lighting company went out of business a few years ago.. what does that have to do with today? Unfortunately, though LED units made today don't have the same design or cost problems, they are still misunderstood and misrepresented, so people are still getting burned because they don't know how to make informed purchasing decisions. One of the biggest issues is that no matter how great they were, there was a little snake-oiling that went on with the early LED contenders (the Solaris included). The resellers tended to give it a little more praise than it deserved, mostly to justify the outrageous price tag. Sure, it was a good unit, but many were painting it as the be all, end all for aquarium lighting. That was just not so, unfortunately. Technical issues aside, the early models used early LEDs, nowhere near as powerful as today's. Then, there was a nasty rumor that this unit would blow MH lighting out of the water as far as PAR is concerned. Even today's units don't "blow MH out of the water". When used correctly (and we'll discuss that later), they match the PAR output and can exceed it while using much less electricity. I would consider that pretty darn amazing, when you think about doing the same with much less energy and heat, but unfortunately, the average consumer doesn't agree.


THE ELECTRIC CAR

Wait, so what do electric cars have to do with LEDs? Well, not much from a technology standpoint, but everything when you look at consumer purchasing habits. General Motors produced an electric car a decade or so ago called the GM EV1. There was a documentary made about this car ("Who Killed The Electric Car?"). The movie chronicles the rise and fall of this electric car with all the conspiracy theories to boot, and environmental activists claiming it was an inside job by the corporations and the oil companies. While I agree a little, the truth is probably somewhere in between. The bottom line of the movie was while the car was a great electric vehicle, the consumer didn't feel like they were getting their money's worth. Sure, it ran on electricity and could have ended our dependance on oil, but it was expensive, it needed a while to charge up, there were limiting charging stations, and the overall problem of range was still a huge issue.

When you ask the consumer to pay more, their expectation is they're going to get more. Unfortunately with LEDs and electric cars alike, this just isn't so. You're not paying more for more performance, you're paying more for more technology to get the same performance for less (less heat, electricity, running expense, etc). So, to sum up my long winded ramblings, I have devised one simple rule that you will have to understand and truly believe in order to appreciate and make LEDs work for you:

Thou shall not pay more for LEDs than conventional lighting technology and expect more performance. Thou shall not get more. Thou shall not pass go, thou shall not collect $200 if thou does not understand this commandment!

We will go over the perks of LEDs soon, but understand that you are not getting an exponentially more powerful light by paying more. You're getting the same power, but smaller, leaner, cooler running and longer running. If you're okay with this notion, then read on!


THE PERKS

Okay, so you're willing to ditch the T5/MH setup and shell out some cash for LEDs (or at least are toying with the notion). What will your hard earned dollars get you?

Efficiency - due to the nature of semiconductors and electronics in general, efficiency is the name of the game and only gets better with time. When you buy LEDs, you'll usually get about the same PAR as MH with sometimes as much as half the power usage.

Cool and Quiet - Other lighting technologies radiate heat out with the light they produce, especially with MH. You'll need a chiller and fans to keep a setup with multiple MH pendants cool. Not so with LEDs. LEDs are essentially computer chips (semiconductors), so like all semiconductors, they emit heat from the circuits inside. In LED setups, the heat is pulled off the back of the diode and into a heatsink, meaning that you feel no appreciable heat coming off the front of the unit. So, less electricity used (from efficiency and saying goodbye to that chiller), less heat, and less noise (a few quite PC-grade fans and getting rid of that chiller :)) all make the LEDs a quieter, more peaceful solution.

Life span - The figure varies, but most would generally agree you should replace your PC/MH/T5 bulbs every 6 to 18 months, depending on your tastes, corals, setup, etc. LEDs have no listed MTBF (most are replaced well before they fail). Those that do have a listed life expectancy, like the Cree X-RE, are rated at 50,000 hours. At 8 hours a day, that's over 17 years. During that lifetime you can expect the output of the LEDs to have decayed by around 50%, but there is no measurable shift in the color spectrum due to aging phosphors or gasses. So if you're PaulB, you would have replaced your LEDs twice now, but his tank is 40 years old. Most tanks don't hold a candle to his in terms of age :)

So, you'll see that while you need to shell out much more to initially cover your tank, your investment will save you operating costs (electricity, possible cessation of chilling equipment), you'll have 17 years of no bulb changes, and you'll get a powerful lighting system to boot. Heck, most decent lights these days come with lots of nifty dimming and scheduling functionality, so you may even get more.


SO WHAT'S THE CATCH?

I know it sounds too good to be true... and in a way it is. The catch is the price. The best LED unit out there today, the AI Sol, is a hefty sum (if you can get your hands on one). Not to mention you'll need more LEDs to cover your tank than you would MH pendants since LEDs essentially produce a spotlight and don't light evenly. As I said before, LEDs are not for everyone. They will work in almost all situations if you put enough money and engineering into the solution, but that's just getting the to work well. They won't work WELL for everyone, but they work well for most.


I'M SOLD!

Okay okay, don't go rushing to the LFS or your favorite reef supply site just yet. There are a few things you must know before shelling out some cash for an LED fixture.

- LED wattage: just as all semiconducting electronics are created with different capacity and functionality, so are LEDs. Even systems branded as reef capable won't necessarily cut it. You need to see AT LEAST 3W LEDs for the system to be any good. THIS IS A STRICT, NO COMPROMISE RULE. THE UNIT YOU BUY MUST HAVE 3W LEDs TO BE VIABLE FOR ALL THE HIGH-DEMAND SPSs AND OTHER INVERTS WE WANT TO KEEP IN THIS HOBBY! Anything less will still work, but penetration, coverage and intensity will suffer. 1W units are great replacements for PCs, and since the biggest problem with PCs tends to be bulb costs and inefficiency, I feel these 1W LED units have a niche to fill.. it is not, however, over your SPS dominated reef with a BTA. 2Ws are better, but I still lump them in with the 1Ws. If you want all the great things you hear intensity wise about LEDs, you MUST get a unit made with 3W LEDs.

Not all manufacturers list LED wattage for one reason or another. This isn't necessarily a deal breaker, but you have to see some reliable PAR readings and do some comparison to see what kind of light you'll be getting out of them, as well as how deep you can expect the light to go before fading out. If you can't find PAR readings or LED wattages, move on.

- Optics: LEDs lack penetrating power. Thankfully, the innovators over at the various manufacturers have started making focusing optics available for their LEDs, essentially making the light stronger, albeit in a smaller area. Almost all tanks over 12" need optics to make the LEDs penetrate the water. After checking that the unit has 3W LEDs, make sure it has some sort of optics. The downside is you need more LEDs of each color to cover the same area and blend well, as well as ensure there are no dark spots. Most manufacturers take this into account, so you really only have to worry about this if your DIY-ing. For deeper tanks, you need even more narrow optics to penetrate the water, meaning there's less spread and yet again, more LEDs are needed for blending and proper coloration. That's why for deeper tanks, it's very difficult to get LEDs to work. I would recommend you carefully research your options if your tank is greater than 24" deep. Talk to the manufacturer and retailer and try to get some info about how the unit you want performs under conditions like those found in your tank, or don't buy.

- Coverage: LEDs are essentially little spotlights, so they don't throw out light in all directions like MH and T5s. They light a small area very well, but unfortunately if you see any PAR graphs, you'll likely also see how steeply the PAR drops off after you move out from under the light source. For some people, this is okay. They have 2 or 3 pendant-style LED lamps and create bright showcase areas underneath them and leave the darker areas unpopulated. Could you light an entire tank so that you could put corals anywhere? Sure! Be prepared to pay for it though. You need lots of LEDs to cover an entire tank, moreso if you have a deep tank (narrower optics need more coverage). If you want your entire tank to be as bright as day, LEDs might not be for you. If you are worried about dark spots possibly meaning your corals aren't getting enough light, never fear. LEDs are great at creating small, intensely lit areas. The dark corners are no indication of LED performance.

- Cheap fixtures: If you see a cheap LED light that you're considering getting, steer clear. There's a principle that you get what you pay for, and while this is a little different, the same idea holds true. The Law of Conservation of Mass states that mass cannot be created or destroyed, it can only change forms. In other words, you can't get something out of nothing. The same is true with LEDs. Any LED unit you see claiming MH equivalence for comparable or cheaper prices than MH units has to be a fake. There is no magic in how LEDs work. They work by using high tech diodes, which cost a lot of money to make well. The technology to make these LEDs costs money, as does the labor that goes into meticulously creating these semiconductors, as do the pure metals needed to create a solid diode. You simply can't get the technology to make MH PAR by paying the same as you would for an actual MH light. You would have to have cheap parts (which high quality units that actually make MH PAR don't have) or you need to have magic. Either way, you just can't get better technology for the same price. Maybe some day you'll be able to replace that old MH pendant with an LED light for the same price. Unfortunately it is not this day, nor tomorrow, nor even probably this decade.


To sum it all up, LEDs are a great light source for aquariums today. We now have affordable, powerful lights like the AI Sol that make LED lighting for Joe Average possible. As much as I love LEDs though, they are not for everyone. You MUST do your homework to ensure you're getting a unit that will work for you.. search on forums, talk to retailers, call manufacturers, whatever you must do. An uninformed buyer will get taken advantage of every time. In addition, you also need to understand that you're paying much more for LEDs, but the performance will be the same. The reason you pay more is because you get technology that will make the LEDs cheaper to own and operate. I've had LEDs over my pico for over a year now, and BigAl has even killed an SPS with his LED light.. these are just a few examples, and there are many more out there, but my point is that LEDs work. They work rather well. You just have to do your homework. When you're buying a light that can last you over a decade, who wouldn't?

Please post any questions, comments or concerns :hallo:
 

PIMPALA

Well-Known Member
you just can't get better technology for the same price. Maybe some day you'll be able to replace that old MH pendant with an LED light for the same price. Unfortunately it is not this day, nor tomorrow, nor even probably this decade.



this is the only part of your post i disagree with.

why I say that, is the fixtures I am currently running, retail at just over $200 per unit. I'm running 3 units over my 48x24x30, 150 gallon display, and my 3 watt CREE units with optics, have absolutely no problem penetrating to the bottom. they are almost a foot off of the water surface, and while there are a couple of very small darker shaded areas, its not much different from when i had a 6 bulb T5 unit over it. (not bad for a tank thats 24" front to back, and my units had to be mounted front to back)

i had priced some decent (mogul) pendants before i bought the LEDs, and the reflectors, bulbs, and ballasts (was only going to run 2x250w) were going to cost more than the 3 LED units i purchased. now... i really could have used 4 LED units over my tank, and i may add another once my canopy is built, but even then, the initial investment isnt much more than the mogul halides, and once the first 9 months are up and the bulbs on the MH need replaced, I would be far cheaper with the LED units, not even including the saved energy costs from wattage, and cooling.


that being said, I know that I didnt buy the most expensive units out there, but i spent less than $700 with shipping to light my tank with LEDs, and I absolutely love them, as do all of my corals.


with these newer units being produced, and new companies coming on board with 3 and 5 watt LEDs on a monthly basis, I'm betting that one will be able to light a 6 foot tank (say a 125G) with decent LED units, for under $500 before the end of 2012. Maybe less. Technology moves WAY too fast.
 

PSU4ME

JoePa lives on!!!
Staff member
PREMIUM
Great information........the only thing I would add is that it sucks trying to get a good picture of your corals under LED's!
 

Robzilla

Active Member
Great article!!! Very well articulated and many points that are spot on, but I must agree with PIMPALA's issue as I have the same lights and feel they have made quite the difference for less.

And as PSU4ME stated, we need some research into LED photography!

It is also important for people thinking about LEDs to realize there is a difference between visible light and light energy. LEDs will definitely give off a different look and it takes some getting used to when you have been using lights that bleed light. They may appear darker but that is because they point straight down and do not spill light out of the side of the tank. VERY important to light acclimate your tank as it is easy to burn your corals if you just crank them up to 100% power.
 

chipmunkofdoom2

Well-Known Member
that being said, I know that I didnt buy the most expensive units out there, but i spent less than $700 with shipping to light my tank with LEDs, and I absolutely love them, as do all of my corals.

That's great to hear. I wasn't aware of any units out there this cheap. It's hard enough to find any lights with Crees, let alone optics, let alone for a fair price. Any links or more info to the units you bought?

I think you're absolutely right though, the technology is moving fast. Maybe this decade was a little bit of an overshot, and hopefully things will keep getting cheaper. I just wanted to be sure that people understood that LEDs are great, but unfortunately there's still a bit of over-selling that goes on with LED fixtures. You have to consider features and specs before price, regardless of what the manufacturer claims their product will do.

It is also important for people thinking about LEDs to realize there is a difference between visible light and light energy. LEDs will definitely give off a different look and it takes some getting used to when you have been using lights that bleed light. They may appear darker but that is because they point straight down and do not spill light out of the side of the tank. VERY important to light acclimate your tank as it is easy to burn your corals if you just crank them up to 100% power.

Thanks for the contribution Rob, you're absolutely correct.. That's something I should have put in the initial article. LEDs are going to look different because they're totally different from every other aquarium light out there. The mechanism of creating light is completely new.

Thanks to everyone for stopping by and taking the time to read. Again, the general idea I wanted to get across was that it's important to know what you're buying, and also that you're not getting cheated.. LEDs might not be cheap, but you're getting a lot for what you pay for, even if it doesn't seem like it.
 

PIMPALA

Well-Known Member
That's great to hear. I wasn't aware of any units out there this cheap. It's hard enough to find any lights with Crees, let alone optics, let alone for a fair price. Any links or more info to the units you bought?

I think you're absolutely right though, the technology is moving fast. Maybe this decade was a little bit of an overshot, and hopefully things will keep getting cheaper. I just wanted to be sure that people understood that LEDs are great, but unfortunately there's still a bit of over-selling that goes on with LED fixtures. You have to consider features and specs before price, regardless of what the manufacturer claims their product will do.



My lights (and others on this forum have ordered them since I made my build thread) came from Eshine systems in China. Laura Kong is my customer service, and information rep (and she is also a member on here as well) and the lights retail for around $200 each. They are also coming out with a 120W unit that supposedly has a digital timer/dimmable controller built in. they are developing new products all the time, and making current products better.

here is a link to one page where you can contact them:

Dimmable CREE 3W LED Aquarium Lighting System for 180 gallon reef tank products, buy Dimmable CREE 3W LED Aquarium Lighting System for 180 gallon reef tank products from alibaba.com


her direct email for any questions is: laura.eshine@gmail.com




if you notice, these are the EXACT same units that OCReef is selling for $499 each

OCReef XP-E 60 Watt CREE LED Aquarium Light - 3reef Forums

Home Page
 

Robzilla

Active Member
^(on the OCReef link) Wow that is shady..."$50 off because I like that you have a frag tank"?!?!?!?! I guess it is easy if you mark something up that much.
 

nanoreefing4fun

Well-Known Member
RS STAFF
on cree link above...

it says... "On our PAR tests it out performed well over 10 times the reading of our comparable 250 watt MH lamp" ??? and at $379


just when I was getting this straight in my brain...
Any LED unit you see claiming MH equivalence for comparable or cheaper prices than MH units has to be a fake. There is no magic in how LEDs work
 

Robzilla

Active Member
on cree link above...

it says... "On our PAR tests it out performed well over 10 times the reading of our comparable 250 watt MH lamp" ??? and at $379


just when I was getting this straight in my brain...

I understand the confusion. It seems like there is always an exception somewhere these days and Jason and I have had great luck with these units. If you check out the latest pics in my tank thread you will see these lights at 30% power....def MH worthy.
 

nanoreefing4fun

Well-Known Member
RS STAFF
Does look nice ! was just 10 x MH part that confused me... at $379... I am sure all tanks will be using leds one day... and seems that day is closer than every now

IMAG0186.jpg
 

chipmunkofdoom2

Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the replies everyone, we've got some good discussion going on which was the goal :)

Jason, that light makes sense and looks legit. I can't say they have 10x the power of MH (the Crees are good, but not that good..), but I can say they have all the right parts. that's the good thing about knowing what makes an LED light good, if you can find all the right quality parts, you can dig through the marketing (10x MH intensity...) and know that you'll still have a decent light. I'd be sure to pay with Paypal so you can have easy conflict resolution should anything go wrong, but the Chinese efficiencies at market seem to make that price point possible.

Now, I'm not nit-picking that light as I've never used one (and will even admit it's attractive to me, quite the solid price point), but one thing you have to be sure to look out for is technical support. With a T5 or MH setup, if your ballast burns out or you have end-cap issues, you can easily find replacement parts that are standardized, so if warranty service is difficult to get or your unit is out of warranty, you can easily replace the ballast or reflectors or what have you. With LED systems, a lot of the technology is unit specific, so if you can't get warranty service or replacement parts from the manufacturer, your unit might be dead in the water. This type of information is still difficult to find, with the only manufacturer making ANY headway in this area being Aquaillumination with the Sol, but it's something to at least keep in mind.

At any rate, great discussion going on here, keep the conversation coming... and respectful :)
 

PIMPALA

Well-Known Member
I agree on the parts and fixing stuff at home thing... but just for reference on Eshine's warranty... I had a ballast that was acting funny. I emailed Laura, and she walked me thru a trouble shooting easy step list, and within 4 days, i had a replacement ballast on my door step.

I also agree that 10x a 250w MH is a hilarious stretch of the imagination. But saying its double, is not out of range. I one next to my 250w, and it was absolutely twice as bright, no questions asked.
 
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