StevesLEDs
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Jeff
Jeff
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So What's The Deal With These LEDs?
- Thread starter chipmunkofdoom2
- Start date
The specs look OK for what your getting, and it is cheep, but I see two red flags. It's made on China, and it only seems to be sold on Ebay and similar sites. You know the old saying, "if it sounds too good to be true...".
StevesLEDs
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Something tells me you will have warranty issues, and even if you don't, you'll have a 120 day turnaround time 
Jeff
Jeff
cracker
Well-Known Member
Agreed on the get what You pay for !! I'm still using MH lighting. I need to move on to new technology! Folks I don't know anything about led lighting. My tank is 6 ft long the top has 3 sections separated by the top braces. Each section is about 20 by 20. It's a good 28 inches from the top to bottom ( sandbed etc). I don't want diy fixtures. My certified electrician buddy has melted 2 already! Steve I'd be willing to work with You just don't know where to start. Please keep in mind I remember when LED was untested technology! Does that make me old? LOL
StevesLEDs
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Cracker- No worries, LEDs are much more simple nowadays. The most difficult part is choosing the LED combination which yields the correct spectrum for your specific corals. That's something that Steve's LEDs has spend the past 5 years and tens of thousands of dollars on testing and we have settled on a handful of LED combinations that make corals both look great and grow fast. You simply tell us how "blue" you want your aquarium, and we do the rest. You can also tell us what specific bulbs you have, and we can match that and get you an identical color. Of course, the LEDs will be much brighter than the MH lights though.
When switching from MH, you will have some serious energy savings. Not only will LEDs use about 5 times less electricity, they don't heat up the room they are in, saving you from having to run that central A/C as much. Furthermore, if you have a chiller, you won't need to run that anymore either.
It sounds like your aquarium is pretty standard, in the 210 gallon - 240 gallon range. We actually have a fixture that is designed specifically for that aquarium, around those dual top braces, so that you won't lose any light. We can also adjust the light however else you require, and we don't charge extra.
Shoot me an email at TechSupport@StevesLEDs.com and I'll walk you through the process.
Jeff
When switching from MH, you will have some serious energy savings. Not only will LEDs use about 5 times less electricity, they don't heat up the room they are in, saving you from having to run that central A/C as much. Furthermore, if you have a chiller, you won't need to run that anymore either.
It sounds like your aquarium is pretty standard, in the 210 gallon - 240 gallon range. We actually have a fixture that is designed specifically for that aquarium, around those dual top braces, so that you won't lose any light. We can also adjust the light however else you require, and we don't charge extra.
Shoot me an email at TechSupport@StevesLEDs.com and I'll walk you through the process.
Jeff
StirCrayzy
Well-Known Member
I could start an aquarium lighting business then write off my thousands of $$ as "testing", very clever Steve &Jeff
StevesLEDs
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We do whatever it takes! Sounds like you have the right idea too. Its not has hard as it sounds to spend big bucks on the aquariums, or maybe it is too easy. At any rate, I have seen some LED combinations that look really great on paper, but once you plug it up over an aquarium, it looks absolutely repulsive. We have found only a few combinations that actually look great AND grow coral well, but dozens that look terrible and that gets expensive, fast.
Jeff
Jeff
I came across this new article on leds & though I would share it here... I am still learning about leds & I readily admit a lot of this is above my head, but this article was just published & seemed very detailed, if interested give it a look & let me know what you think of it... 
http://aquarium-digest.com/tag/best-led-reef-lights/
I am in the process of converting my T5s (6 x 39 watt bulb unit) to StevesLEDs 56 Luxeon ES LEDs along with a Typhon controller and accessories like an Advanced Moonlighting System. Will be reviewing one up & running... I am hoping my corals will like my new leds even better than my T5 which I have had great success with, except for many sps corals, my T5s just did okay with the easiest of sps corals. My new leds are said to produce more than twice the light as my current T5s. My tank has always been mainly lps corals and soft corals, looking forward to trying some sps corals again that my T5s struggled with.
also considering trying my 1st nem
http://aquarium-digest.com/tag/best-led-reef-lights/
- Overview
- Current Reduction vs. Pulse Width Modulation
- Kelvin Color & Spectrum Basics
- Relative Quantum Efficiency
- RGB Features
- Watt per Gallon?
- Emitter Combinations versus Specimen Placement
- Additional Benefits of LED Lighting
- LED Light Comparisons/Tests
- Further LED Fixture Emitter Information, Myths
- LED Cautions
- DIY LED Light Fixtures
- Basic Mounting Suggestion
- T5 to LED Comparison
- Proper LED Ventilation
- LED Summary
- LED News, Developments
- References
I am in the process of converting my T5s (6 x 39 watt bulb unit) to StevesLEDs 56 Luxeon ES LEDs along with a Typhon controller and accessories like an Advanced Moonlighting System. Will be reviewing one up & running... I am hoping my corals will like my new leds even better than my T5 which I have had great success with, except for many sps corals, my T5s just did okay with the easiest of sps corals. My new leds are said to produce more than twice the light as my current T5s. My tank has always been mainly lps corals and soft corals, looking forward to trying some sps corals again that my T5s struggled with.
also considering trying my 1st nem
StirCrayzy
Well-Known Member
Boy that's gonna take me all week to read, but looks very thorough so far.
In general I get the impression that it follows the majority of LED debate / research. There's a lot of nitpicking and over-analysis of minute details that actual anecdotal experiences ,I've read here and on the web, seem to nullify.
Exclusion of course goes to the cheaper diodes used in certain "Chinese" fixtures that give less than stellar results, but also usually are paired with equally inferior supporting equipment. The common link I continue to see, is that as long as the luminous output is up to snuff, (ie. 3w + rated) there is more than enough usable light for photosynthetic SPS growth . Granted, most vendors marketing to us reefkeepers are already properly selecting successful wavelength diodes to offer us.
Examples can be found without looking far...
Bottom line is both of these guys have tanks with copious amounts of SPS that make you drool and dream what your tank could look like with HALF of the growth and color they show.
Plus I hear they both look even better in person ! How sweet is that !
So I think it's interesting what can be found through the latest research, and I enjoy reading it, but I think everything is quickly and simply summed up by seeing success come in so many unique variations of LED setups, both commercial & DIY.
In general I get the impression that it follows the majority of LED debate / research. There's a lot of nitpicking and over-analysis of minute details that actual anecdotal experiences ,I've read here and on the web, seem to nullify.
Exclusion of course goes to the cheaper diodes used in certain "Chinese" fixtures that give less than stellar results, but also usually are paired with equally inferior supporting equipment. The common link I continue to see, is that as long as the luminous output is up to snuff, (ie. 3w + rated) there is more than enough usable light for photosynthetic SPS growth . Granted, most vendors marketing to us reefkeepers are already properly selecting successful wavelength diodes to offer us.
Examples can be found without looking far...
- Reggie @reeferman, has DIY'd a standard 3w Cree array of - simple cool white & Royal blue.(correct me if these have been upgraded since last I checked)
- Bryan @PSU4ME has high end Radions.
Bottom line is both of these guys have tanks with copious amounts of SPS that make you drool and dream what your tank could look like with HALF of the growth and color they show.
Plus I hear they both look even better in person ! How sweet is that !
So I think it's interesting what can be found through the latest research, and I enjoy reading it, but I think everything is quickly and simply summed up by seeing success come in so many unique variations of LED setups, both commercial & DIY.
StevesLEDs
RS Sponsor
Josh,
Good input. It's all about the right balance and getting the right brand where you get your money's worth of performance out of the product. I know with many manufacturer's of LED products, you are paying for the brand, or sleek looks, vs actual performance - and on the other hand, there are super cheap brands (chinese ebay fixtures) that boast great initial numbers, only to have the LEDs degrade in less than 1 year.
Then you have the customer oriented brands who are aquarists themselves (where it's not about making the most money possible), who get you the the best components, at a great price, and those lights actually perform better than the rest
Jeff
Good input. It's all about the right balance and getting the right brand where you get your money's worth of performance out of the product. I know with many manufacturer's of LED products, you are paying for the brand, or sleek looks, vs actual performance - and on the other hand, there are super cheap brands (chinese ebay fixtures) that boast great initial numbers, only to have the LEDs degrade in less than 1 year.
Then you have the customer oriented brands who are aquarists themselves (where it's not about making the most money possible), who get you the the best components, at a great price, and those lights actually perform better than the rest
Jeff
Adding this post here so I can find it again 
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/...-led-par-value-in-rsm-250.88359/#post-1299777
One extract on measuring leds output, I found very helpful...
Here's a bit of information that we have found regarding the PAR readings in our RSM250 LED upgrade.
Background: Photosynthetic Active Radiation (PAR). This is measured in units of micro-mol per meter squared per second (umol/m2/s), a measure of energy output, within the wavelengths of 400nm-800nm, which is traditionally called Photosynthetic Photon Flux Density (PPFD, but we won't use that latter term here, but just know they are one in the same).
PAR meters, which use quantum sensors (all PAR meters use quantum sensors) are not an accurate way to measure the PAR output of LEDs. Measuring PAR for LEDs is a bit more difficult than measuring broad spectrum lighting such as MH, T5, HPS, for which the PAR meter sensor was designed. A standard PAR meter works great for those broad spectrum sources, but not for narrow spectrum LEDs. (Yes full spectrum LEDs still are narrow spectrum, because they have bands near all of the phtosynthetic peaks on coral chlorophyll, which is why they are more efficient when trying to hit target wavelengths (think rifle bullet vs shotgun) and LEDs grow corals better).
A properly designed marine LED system uses LEDs with wavelengths that are aimed at very narrow and specific coral zooxanthellae's photosynthetic peaks in massive amounts - this quickly saturates a standard PAR meter's sensor. When the sensor is saturated, it cannot read that amount of light once it passes the saturation threshold, so the sensor retards the reading to a lesser false value.
The proper tool for measurement would be the radio-spectrometer. This type of tool reads specific bands and reports specific intensity readings for each wavelength. Whereas a PAR meter will simply output one value for the entire visible light spectrum and you are not sure which wavelength has the most intensity, and which wavelengths are are saturated.
When running a radio-spectrometer side by side with a relatively high end PAR meter, we have found that PAR meters are consistently reading about 30% lower than the actual value in the 445nm range (that's royal blue, or 20,000-24,000K actinic blue folks!), the most important range for coral since that's where the primary alpha (α) photosynthetic peak lays. It also gets saturated in the 460nm (regular cool blue), 430nm (violet) and 520nm (green) wavelengths as well, but to a lesser degree of about 12% reduction. We found negligible saturation (<5%) in the amber (600-700nm) and red (640-680nm) ranges too. These tests were performed on the Philips Luxeon Rebel and Philips Luxeon ES series LEDs. We can expect other high-end LEDs to perform similarly, whereas the no-name chinese LEDs (Epistar, Bridgelux, etc) perform at about 50%, or half as well, or about half as efficient dependent on the individual LED.
That said, marine aquarium LED systems have a dominate ratio of blue 445nm wavelengths to other wavelengths by a factor of at least 2:1, and in some cases around 3:1 depending on the LED combination you have and how many royal blues there are compared to other colored LEDs. From this, we can deduce a relatively safe offset when using PAR meters, of approximately 23% (approximation of the average of the differences in the primary proportions of PAR meter saturation reduction values listed in the previous paragraph). That means, we can relatively accurately use a PAR meter to measure the output of LEDs, by simply adding this otherwise unread amount of PAR (due to that sensor saturation) - a factor of +23% to the PAR reading.
Example: (2 assumptions : 1) let us assume the water is 100% clear, because that's a whole other story on PAR readings, 2) let us assume the PAR meter sensor is set at 12" below the light source.) The PAR meter "Meter Reads" values below are imaginary numbers to be used exclusively for this example.
Metal Halide (broad spectrum source)-
Meter Reads : reads 350 umol/m2/s (that's what we call "350 PAR")
Actual PAR value: it is spot on at 350 umol/m2/s
T5 (broad spectrum source)-
Meter Reads: Reads 350 umol/m2/s
Actual PAR Value: it is spot on at 350 umol/m2/s
LEDs (narrow spectrum source)-
Meter Reads: Reads 350 umol/m2/s
Actual PAR Value: we need to first account for our factor of 23% for PAR meter saturation to calculate the exact value (when using Luxeon LEDs):
350 umol/m2/s X (23%) = 80.50 umol/m2/s.
Now that we have that missing 23% value, we add it on to the original meter's value.
350 umol/m2/s + 80.50 umol/m2/s = 430.50 umol/m2/s
So based on the values read on the first post on this thread, you can add an additional 23% for a surprisingly accurate readout of actual PAR values, and you can then see that you can grow darn near any coral from any ocean, placed pretty much anywhere in the aquarium. The test to calculate the offset was considered a premium sensor, so it is likely more accurate and has a higher saturation tolerance than a lower quality meter, so the calculated value of 23% could be as high as 45%, depending on the quality level of the quantum sensor your PAR meter is using.
Let me know if anyone has additional questions, I'll be glad to explain.
Thanks,
Jeff
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/...-led-par-value-in-rsm-250.88359/#post-1299777
One extract on measuring leds output, I found very helpful...
Here's a bit of information that we have found regarding the PAR readings in our RSM250 LED upgrade.
Background: Photosynthetic Active Radiation (PAR). This is measured in units of micro-mol per meter squared per second (umol/m2/s), a measure of energy output, within the wavelengths of 400nm-800nm, which is traditionally called Photosynthetic Photon Flux Density (PPFD, but we won't use that latter term here, but just know they are one in the same).
PAR meters, which use quantum sensors (all PAR meters use quantum sensors) are not an accurate way to measure the PAR output of LEDs. Measuring PAR for LEDs is a bit more difficult than measuring broad spectrum lighting such as MH, T5, HPS, for which the PAR meter sensor was designed. A standard PAR meter works great for those broad spectrum sources, but not for narrow spectrum LEDs. (Yes full spectrum LEDs still are narrow spectrum, because they have bands near all of the phtosynthetic peaks on coral chlorophyll, which is why they are more efficient when trying to hit target wavelengths (think rifle bullet vs shotgun) and LEDs grow corals better).
A properly designed marine LED system uses LEDs with wavelengths that are aimed at very narrow and specific coral zooxanthellae's photosynthetic peaks in massive amounts - this quickly saturates a standard PAR meter's sensor. When the sensor is saturated, it cannot read that amount of light once it passes the saturation threshold, so the sensor retards the reading to a lesser false value.
The proper tool for measurement would be the radio-spectrometer. This type of tool reads specific bands and reports specific intensity readings for each wavelength. Whereas a PAR meter will simply output one value for the entire visible light spectrum and you are not sure which wavelength has the most intensity, and which wavelengths are are saturated.
When running a radio-spectrometer side by side with a relatively high end PAR meter, we have found that PAR meters are consistently reading about 30% lower than the actual value in the 445nm range (that's royal blue, or 20,000-24,000K actinic blue folks!), the most important range for coral since that's where the primary alpha (α) photosynthetic peak lays. It also gets saturated in the 460nm (regular cool blue), 430nm (violet) and 520nm (green) wavelengths as well, but to a lesser degree of about 12% reduction. We found negligible saturation (<5%) in the amber (600-700nm) and red (640-680nm) ranges too. These tests were performed on the Philips Luxeon Rebel and Philips Luxeon ES series LEDs. We can expect other high-end LEDs to perform similarly, whereas the no-name chinese LEDs (Epistar, Bridgelux, etc) perform at about 50%, or half as well, or about half as efficient dependent on the individual LED.
That said, marine aquarium LED systems have a dominate ratio of blue 445nm wavelengths to other wavelengths by a factor of at least 2:1, and in some cases around 3:1 depending on the LED combination you have and how many royal blues there are compared to other colored LEDs. From this, we can deduce a relatively safe offset when using PAR meters, of approximately 23% (approximation of the average of the differences in the primary proportions of PAR meter saturation reduction values listed in the previous paragraph). That means, we can relatively accurately use a PAR meter to measure the output of LEDs, by simply adding this otherwise unread amount of PAR (due to that sensor saturation) - a factor of +23% to the PAR reading.
Example: (2 assumptions : 1) let us assume the water is 100% clear, because that's a whole other story on PAR readings, 2) let us assume the PAR meter sensor is set at 12" below the light source.) The PAR meter "Meter Reads" values below are imaginary numbers to be used exclusively for this example.
Metal Halide (broad spectrum source)-
Meter Reads : reads 350 umol/m2/s (that's what we call "350 PAR")
Actual PAR value: it is spot on at 350 umol/m2/s
T5 (broad spectrum source)-
Meter Reads: Reads 350 umol/m2/s
Actual PAR Value: it is spot on at 350 umol/m2/s
LEDs (narrow spectrum source)-
Meter Reads: Reads 350 umol/m2/s
Actual PAR Value: we need to first account for our factor of 23% for PAR meter saturation to calculate the exact value (when using Luxeon LEDs):
350 umol/m2/s X (23%) = 80.50 umol/m2/s.
Now that we have that missing 23% value, we add it on to the original meter's value.
350 umol/m2/s + 80.50 umol/m2/s = 430.50 umol/m2/s
So based on the values read on the first post on this thread, you can add an additional 23% for a surprisingly accurate readout of actual PAR values, and you can then see that you can grow darn near any coral from any ocean, placed pretty much anywhere in the aquarium. The test to calculate the offset was considered a premium sensor, so it is likely more accurate and has a higher saturation tolerance than a lower quality meter, so the calculated value of 23% could be as high as 45%, depending on the quality level of the quantum sensor your PAR meter is using.
Let me know if anyone has additional questions, I'll be glad to explain.
Thanks,
Jeff