Nobby's S-650

Discussion in 'Red Sea Max Owners Club' started by Nobbygas, Oct 14, 2016.

  1. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Time to start the thread I think. First off though, a little background.

    I started off originally with freshwater tanks, and eventually moved to the salty side with just a small 60l nano. I then had a small upgrade to a 112l, but it is just a basic tank, with stuff hanging over the edges, surface skimmer, protein skimmer, powerheads, ATO sensor, and no sump. You get the drift.
    My upgrade path hit the rocks a few years back when my youngest son arrived. Now though, everything has settled down, so it's time to go bigger.

    I've ordered an RSM S-650 in white which is due to arrive next week. Why the RSM? Well, I've read so many threads on this and other forums, and I know some will say that it's overpriced, or it's better to get a custom build, but for me there are several factors as to why I choose the RSM.
    First, there is She Who Casts No Shadow. She doesn't want wires/cables and stuff hanging around. For her it has to look neat and tidy, as it will be a feature in the living room. This tank does look good.
    Next, it's the easier route for me. I live in Germany, and I don't speak the language too well, therefore it's not easy to join say a Local Reefers Club, plus I don't have any friends who keep fish, so basically I really do rely on the Internet for tips/videos and information. My plan is to try and keep things as simple as possible.
    The final reason was that my LFS was offering a 20% discount on all aquariums, so 20% off a S-650 is quite a sum.
    I will use the stock skimmer, the stock pumps etc on the RSM. Maybe in time I may change some of the equipment, who knows. The RSM is a leap into the dark for me though, as I've never ran a system with a sump before, so it's a pretty steep learning curve [​IMG] Once the tank is stabilized, I intend to use the Triton Method using the Core7 "Reef Supplements". With this there is no need for an Algae Bed. Hopefully the Reactor with Rhowphos, the Activated Carbon and the Skimmer will be enough to cope with the nutrient export........if not, then it's 'adapt, improvise & overcome' ! First though, I'll get the tank up and running with some fish and corals.

    I intend to start the tank with Base Rock and not Live Rock. I've weighed-up all the pros and cons and decided that I don't want to import any nasties (if I can help it). In particular, Apstasia. I hate the bloody stuff ! I have it in my current small tank, and no matter what I do I can't seem to get rid of it. Plus, it's easier to aquascape the Base Rock, and it's a lot cheaper!
    I'll also use some ATM Colony to kick-start everything. Interesting though, it doesn't seem to be available in Germany! So like many things, I'll just order it from the UK. I also intend to get a D-D FMR65 Reactor to run Rhowphos, but once again this doesn't appear to be on sale over here (or it's called something else). I'll just order one from the UK.

    My current tank will remain (it's in my Man Cave upstairs) and I'll use it as a Quarantine Tank.
    The space has been created in the garage for when it's delivered, which should be sometime next week.
    Then I can take my time to build it. I've already got three strong friends lined-up to carry the tank into the house and place it onto the base. The main problem being there are eight steps to get up and into the front door.
    The RO production will take time. I've only got a smallish RO System which produces about 90l a day and I've only got containers that will hold about 100l in total, but as we all know in this hobby, no rush.
    I won't transfer anything over from my current tank except a couple of fish, so there is no time pressure for the initial build and start-up, nor is there any space pressure in the house, you know, having to remove an old tank so the new one can take it's place.

    Things to buy:-

    60Kg Base Rock
    70Kg Substrate (not fine stuff as I don't want it blowing all over the place)
    4 Channel Doser - Jeboa?
    D-D Reactor base unit
    Eheim 600 pump for the Reactor
    ATM Colony
    30Kg Salt
    2 x 300w Heaters
    White Egg Crate
    New Test kits

    If you see a flaw in any of my plans, then any advice is more than welcome [​IMG]
     
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  2. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Hi Nobbygas and welcome!

    I also set up my new Max S 650 in June 2016 - they are stunning - i have the black one.

    For a 2 months before I upgraded i had a Max E260 which like you didn't have a sump like the 650 but the sump in the 650 is loads better and very easy to maintain. I do most of my water change from the left hand compartment of the sump by turning of the main pump but that's another story.

    I was/am a complete Aquarium newbie, so have trusted in Red Sea for everything and they have been very helpful when needed (as well as everyone on this site). So I use all their products, reef foundations etc - yes they are not the cheapest, but i trust them and that makes me happy so..

    As far as sand I went for the Red Sea Pink Live Sand (its not pink before you ask) but its a slightly bigger grain and doesn't blow around - i think if you read the write ups you wont get any nasties in it. I also have some larger crushed coral for a few of the sides were the flow tends to move it around.

    I don't run any reactors and am following the Red Sea Reef Care program and so far its all working well. I don't have any additional equipment in the sump other than I have just installed the JBL UVC 36w steriliser as all the nutrient control etc is done by the various aspects of the Reef Care program. I just have the normal carbon, filters etc that come with the tank.

    I also use all the Red Sea Test kits as they are very accurate and needed if you follow their program

    I dose NoPox as part of the program for the nutrient control and its currently running around 1.5 Nitrate and 0.6 phosphate which is targeted as the Red Sea Acceleration growth parameters.

    You maybe need slightly more live rock maybe around 75-80kg I think is the rough guide at 2Kg
    per gallon - the actual tank volume is 150 gallon plus the sump at 25 gallon

    On the doser i purchased the Kamoer 4 channel on recommendation from the guys on here - i haven't set it up yet as I'm still manually dosing the buffers until i feel comfortable to go automatic which is the next stage for me. Its more expensive but.

    On the heaters I went for 2 x 200w Eheim heaters simply for redundancy. I did originally look at 250 and 300w versions but the problem is in the event of them getting stuck in the 'on' position as part of a failure they could increase the tank temperature to unacceptable levels quiet easily on their own whereas the 200w i felt was a bit safer.

    I also used ATM Colony when I set my tank up and worked very well and I haven't had any issues with it.

    A tip with the C Skimm 1800 is when you set it up, you will connect a green tube from the pipework that it connected to the main system pump. Basically this feeds the skimmer from the main pump. There is a red valve to control flow to the skimmer and you want to set this about 1/3 open only to start with. I originally had mine fully open for a month or so until I spoke with Red Sea and had a hell of a job controlling the skimmer. It does actually say something in the instructions but very easy to miss this. If you have it fully open the flow is far to strong for the skimmer to cope with.

    Another tip on the skimmer it to remember that it will only produce waste when their is stuff in the water so sometimes it may look like it isn't doing anything. The tip from Red Sea was to set the skimmer about 2-3 hours after feeding and then leave it alone. You do need to tweek it sometimes but I spent weeks turning it up (then overskim) and then down and up, down......

    Also while you are waiting for delivery watch the installation/build videos on the Red Sea web site as they are very helpful as they go through each of the stages and just take your time. Double check every part of the frame before you screw it together and be careful if you are using a power screwdriver to have the torque setting correct otherwise you will take the screw heads off easily (like I did!)

    I have a bit of Aiptasia but use (yes you guessed!) Red Sea Aiptasia X for it - kills them although you sometimes get a new one pop up but keeps them under control. I also have a couple of shrimps (think they are peppermint) which are supposed to eat it but not sure mine do although the LFS says give them time as only been in for around 6 weeks.

    One big tip which I have mentioned on other threads is be prepared for the weight of this beast - it is very very heavy and you will struggle even with 4 to lift and move it - do not underestimate this. I used a soft padded towel to drag it along the floor once inside as we have hard flooring and although I'm not recommending this it works!

    Anyway the set up of the tank is still fresh in my mind so if you need any help or advice drop me a line.
     
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  3. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Shaun,

    Thanks very much for the reply. Yes, I've watched the videos a few times now, and I'll probably watch them again!
    You are probably right on the heaters, and 2 x 300w is probably overkill.
     
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  4. nanoreefing4fun

    nanoreefing4fun Well-Known Member
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    Cheers for starting a tank thread, be sure to post lots of pics so we can follow along and great 1st post ! :clink:
     
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  5. melvis

    melvis Well-Known Member

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    Cracking first post, and great load of advice from SPR too. That's what makes RS a great site. Will be following your journey as this is the tank I'm hoping to get when I finally move house. Good luck and post pics when you can! :)
     
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  6. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    I've just noticed you mention 70kg of substrate and I assume you mean sand.

    Just a quick tip if helpful. When you build your rock structure you need to place the rock directly on the glass bottom so that if anything starts digging, which they will, you won't suffer a rockslide through the side of the tank which would not be good.

    I mention above because in my 650 I only used around 35-40kg of Red Sea live sand. I purchased 4 x 10kg bags from eBay but because you are actually only putting sand around the rocks and not under them you don't need to cover the entire bottom of the tank so the overall volume of sand needed is much less. My sand bed is around 2 inches deep but of course it depends what you want and how much live rock you are putting in. If you put 70kg of sand in it will be very deep, but maybe that's what you want. I know there are options of shallow or deep sand beds which do different biological things.

    I read all about this when waiting for the tank and I am glad I did it. I have a pair of blue throat triggers which live under rocks on one side of the tank amongst other fish and if the rocks had been sat on sand it would all have moved and possibly collapsed.

    I just thought I'd mention this as it's not cheap and you don't want to be wasting it.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 15, 2016
  7. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Here is where the tank will go. The width of the wall at the back is 2m.
    Thanks for the advice. I came up with 70kg by using an online caculator. I intend to put some egg crate under where the rocks will go. I'll buy 40 or 50kg to start. I can always add more.
     
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  8. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    This is where the tank will go. The back wall (with the mirror on) is 2m wide. The tank is 160cm, leaving a gap on the right hand side of 40cm. Red Sea recommend a gap of 60cm, but I have tested it and 40cm will be enough room. The small wall on the right side is 85cms, so with the 70cm of the tank plus the 15cm gap at the back it should be a perfect fit.

    Agh, how do I display photos on here?
     

    Attached Files:

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  9. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    I use Tapatalk to upload photos as easier but each to their own.

    You need to make sure there is a 6 inch gap at least, at the rear of the tank. You also need to be able to access the flow valve which is located at the back rear right hand side of the tank as this needs adjusting on a regular basis to control the water down flow and to maintain its silence. Also the 6 inches and access is to ensure you can maintain and if necessary replace the valve if needed. This is actually mentioned in one of the Red Sea videos, probably the first one from memory.

    You need to be able to get down the side of the tank were your small wall is on the right hand side and reach your hand/arm behind the tank. THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT as you will find once the tank is built and in operation
     
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  10. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    So, delivery is expected either this Thursday or Friday. The space has been cleared in the garage.
    I've ordered the ATM Colony and the D-D FM65 Fluidised Reactor. I will be buying an Eheim 600 pump for the reactor. I've read a lot of reports that the pump that you can get with the reactor is not the quietest, so I've ordered just the reactor without a pump.
    I've decided to go for the Red Sea Pink Sand, as the bigger grain size will reduce the amount of sand blown around.
    I was thinking of putting some egg crate under the rocks, but does anyone have any other ideas?
     
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  11. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Just 'carefully' put it straight onto the glass bottom - you don't need egg crate and then it won't move anywhere when you get critters digging

    What I did just in case I 'slipped/dropped' anything' I put a thin layer of the sand on the bottom and then 'wiggled' the base rocks into place. The sand then gives a bit of cushioning in case slipping

    Also learning from my own stupidity - be very careful of the LED strip above the tank when putting in the live rock/rock. The rock is very rough and I only caught the LED strip with a glancing blow and it made a 8 inch white scratch (my 650 is black) on it! I was gutted as it was the last piece of rock but I managed to cover it with a black felt tip pen and you can't see it now. Phew!
     
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  12. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Aha....Is there a set number of posts I must achieve before I'm allowed to upload photos?
     
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  13. nanoreefing4fun

    nanoreefing4fun Well-Known Member
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    no ... ? ^ if you get an error post it & I will try to help ! :)
     
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  14. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    I did try and post a photo earlier in this thread, but it just came up as an 'attached file'. I used the 'Upload a File' option.
     
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  15. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Another question (if you don't mind), but where would I connect a UV sterilizer on the S-650?
     
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  16. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Well i am no engineer but my JBL UVC 36w is attached to the side of the cabinet as below

    Its feed from a separate pump in the left hand side of the sump and running at around 200l/h as the flow should be at between 100-1000 max.

    The outlet pipe goes around the back of the sump and into the main pump chamber. The pipe was a bit long and i also wanted to make sure it didnt come out.

    PS if your wondering what the little mirror at the side of the UVC is its so i can see the power light!

    If you wanted to I suppose you could connect the UVC and feed it from the spare valve on the main pump connection (for the chiller etc) but I wanted to keep it simple as will turn it off if I am away. It's outside the sump/tank so any leeks on the connections could be bad news!

    IMG_2756.JPG IMG_2759.JPG


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    #16
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2016
  17. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    You've got the 36w unit. Is that the right size for the S-650, or can I get away with a smaller one? It's a bit of a beast isn't it !
    I can't mount it on the outside, otherwise She Who Casts No Shadow would have a fit.
     
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  18. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    Things are quietly moving along. The tank arrived at the shop today from the distribution place in France. I expect delivery either tomorrow (Friday) or Saturday.
    In the meantime, I've been out to spend my pocket money.
    I bought an ATI DP6 Doser, which is basically the Jeboa six-channel doser. I only really need four channels for Triton, but the cost of the six channel doser (about 103 quid) meant that I can leave the spare two channels as redundancy for now, or in the future I may need more than four.
    Also got 50Kg Red Sea Live Pink Sand, 30Kg Red Sea Salt, 2 x 200w heaters, an Eheim 600 pump for the Reactor and various test kits.
    I'll see if the 50Kg sand is enough, if not I'll just get some more.
    Only the Base Rock and the UV Filter left to buy, and I'm ready to rock 'n roll ! Other bits and pieces still required, but they're not necessary for the start-up.
     
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  19. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    It's the right size but if you look on the JBL website it shows the capacity of each. There is not much difference in price so I tend to always buy the best in the first place anyway. The point with these is the contact time with the water and the power so you need to make sure it's big enough or no point having one.

    The UVC is mounted inside the cabinet on the left hand side of the sump and is a perfect fit. You can't see it when the doors are shut. I put it there as you need easy access for changing the bulbs and as I said it's a perfect fit.

    One of the points of these big beautiful tanks is that they are a stunning piece of furniture and I would agree with 'she' that you don't want wires and pumps hanging out of every corner. In mine unless it's hidden inside or out of site is won't be going in.

    On your salt if your keeping corals you really want the Red Sea Coral Pro version rather than the standard salt.

    PS I went for the JBL because both my LFS recommended them but there are loads of different manufacturers but it's a bit of a mine field which is why I went with the LFS's.
     
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  20. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Active Member

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    I did take the 36w out of the box to have a look, and at first I thought it was a rocket launcher ! That is why I didn't buy it then and there,. I wanted to check first that the 36w was the correct one, and that it would fit inside the cabinet!
    I agree with you regarding the size. It's better than have something that can cope with a larger capacity rather than something that will struggle to keep up, especially when the cost difference is minimal.
    The salt is the Coral Pro.
    Can I ask why you didn't place it in the sump? I'm a bit nervous of leaving it outside the sump.
     
    #20
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