Help with salt water mixing

[Friendly Fire]

I've been filling 3-5 buckets with RODI and then adding API proper ph. Then I take one of the buckets and mix in my salt. I add a power head and heater and allow it to mix for three to five days. When I take the SW to do my water changes there is tons of white debris in the buckets and it collects all over the heater and power head. Is this normal? Am I doing something wrong? Eventually I am going to upgrade my setup with a trash can but until then how can I do this better? Also after SW and RODI is in the buckets can I put the kids on them without circulation? I worry about stagnate water issues. Thanks guys for the help.

 

[lbiminiblue]

I've been filling 3-5 buckets with RODI and then adding API proper ph. Then I take one of the buckets and mix in my salt. I add a power head and heater and allow it to mix for three to five days. When I take the SW to do my water changes there is tons of white debris in the buckets and it collects all over the heater and power head. Is this normal? Am I doing something wrong? Eventually I am going to upgrade my setup with a trash can but until then how can I do this better? Also after SW and RODI is in the buckets can I put the kids on them without circulation? I worry about stagnate water issues. Thanks guys for the help.

I think i've heard of that white scum before, but can't recall what it is. I'll look through my books.

 

[whippetguy]

What brand of salt are you using? Not sure why you're adding the API pH prior to mixing?

 

[saltfan]

The white debris all over is from the API proper PH. Mix a batch without and you will see.

 

[Steve L]

I had this exact same thing happen just last week for the first time ever. I figured I got a bad batch of salt or something. I use Coralife and have never had a problem before. I always mix in a 15 gal glass aquarium with a heater and power head. By day 2 when I noticed the water just wasn't as clear as usual I ran my finger across the inside of the tank and there was a white film. When I dumped the water, everything in the tank including the heater and power head was covered with the same white crud. When I washed out the tank some of the white would not come off and was stuck to the glass like hard water mineral deposits. Really strange stuff.

 

[Gasturbineguy]

Sounds like Ca precipitate. Check the below link for some more "geeky" info if you're bored.

http://www.theaquariumsolution.us/cloudy-h2o-salt-mix

 

[Friendly Fire]

What brand of salt are you using? Not sure why you're adding the API pH prior to mixing?

I'm using instant oceans sea salt. I've been mixing the proper PH prior to mixing the sea salt because it was easier to just buffer all the buckets and then that way if I used one of the for top offs it was already to go. I have a suspicion that the PH is too high to dissolve the CA completely but I'm not sure. I'm going to read the link that was posted and see if that provides any more clues. Is it bad practice to PH the water before mixing the salt?

 

[Gasturbineguy]

No need to buffer your RO/DI water. The salt mixes today are designed for a lower pH found in our RO water, they mix really well with a few tricks followed.

Also, you mention top off? Do you top off for evaporation with salt water or? Top off water should be RO water as well, just checking so forgive my asking

I'm using instant oceans sea salt. I've been mixing the proper PH prior to mixing the sea salt because it was easier to just buffer all the buckets and then that way if I used one of the for top offs it was already to go. I have a suspicion that the PH is too high to dissolve the CA completely but I'm not sure. I'm going to read the link that was posted and see if that provides any more clues. Is it bad practice to PH the water before mixing the salt?

 

[Friendly Fire]

No problem, I top off with RODI water. You are suppose to buffer the RODI before you top off your system right?

 

[Gasturbineguy]

You could add it, wouldn't hurt. I never have. As your top off water absorbs oxygen the pH settles out. It's worst straight out of the RO resin bed, we use industrial systems at work and our pH is at or below 6 out of the resin beds but rises pretty quick.

No problem, I top off with RODI water. You are suppose to buffer the RODI before you top off your system right?

 

[Friendly Fire]

So if you add the RO water without buffering won't it quickly make the DT water more acidic? I haven't check but I just figured if you add water that has a PH equal or less than 7 to water that is 8.2 in the DT that it would lower the PH of the DT. Sorry for the noob questions and reasoning. I'm really just trying to figure this whole thing out.

 

[Gasturbineguy]

Honest questions, tough to answer without getting too dorky. Just think of it this way. When evaporation occurs, concentrations take place. Not much as to notice (like pH rising a lot) but top off water of 6-7pH or so wouldn't be noticed unless you dumped a large proportion of it in, like a gallon of RO water into a 10 gallon nano where 1 gallon of water had evaporated. There are reduction calculations and powers of concentration formulas etc.... but that's way too much to know for this , needless to say you'll never let so much evaporation take place that dumping in lower pH make up will mater.

I do calcs like that for large cooling towers where we evaporate 20-30k gallons an hour in the summer. The chemistry goes to hell real quick lol. Good luck!

So if you add the RO water without buffering won't it quickly make the DT water more acidic? I haven't check but I just figured if you add water that has a PH equal or less than 7 to water that is 8.2 in the DT that it would lower the PH of the DT. Sorry for the noob questions and reasoning. I'm really just trying to figure this whole thing out.

 

[whippetguy]

I've never buffer my top off water and my pH seems to be stable other than the day/night fluctuation. Don't apologize for asking questions. We were all newbs at one point. I'm sure there are others with the same exact question but don't ask.

There are several salt brands that tend to leave a residue in your mixing container. From watching posts over the past few years, Instant Ocean is one of them. I don't think it's bad for the water you use, but just something that most who use it, live with. Red Sea Coral Pro has been known to leave a residue if mixed at warmer than room temperature. You might want to try mixing yours up, then bringing it to tank temperature right before adding it. Actually, depending on how much of a water change you're doing and the volume of the tank, you might not want to mess with bringing the temperature up. I change about 5-10% weekly and don't bother with heating the new water. It's not going to affect the tank enough to make a difference.

As Gasturbineguy mentioned, you may also be having some calcium precipitation that's causing the film.

 

[Friendly Fire]

Good to know. I can stop wasting money on the loads of buffer I've been buying. Now I just have to mix up a batch without the buffer and see if I can get rid of all the white scum.

 

[kyle4201]

I have a 50 gallon reservoir and mix 30 gallons at a time with Reef crystals. Once in awhile I get a little tiny bit of brown bubbles come on top of my mixing bucket but other than that I never buffer anything and my parameters are always spot on. I've almost stoped testing more than once a month because nothing ever changes

 

[Friendly Fire]

While we're on the topic, what do you guys use to PH your SW with? Is API proper PH a standard product that is recommended or do most of you just raise your PH with baking soda or "baked" backing soda and use a PH meter. I was actually looking into a PH meter so that I can get things right for dips and QT procedures. But don't want to spend money in places that are unnecessary.

 

[mikecc]

and then adding API proper ph.

That's as far as I needed to read.

 

[Gasturbineguy]

lol @

That's as far as I needed to read.

Friendly, there is really very few times you'll ever need to worry about pH (like if running kalk). As long as you have a skimmer, your oxygen will be great so no pH issues there. And the salt mix along with all that LR or substrate will buffer any swings. SW tanks are really easy in that regard. It's some odd chemistry but that tank will want to remain steady around 8. Kind of a chemical equilibrium. Now if you're coming from fresh water, I feel that pain. I have issues with mine since I can't use tap water. I need to over treat RO water to make it work.

If pH goes low at night some guys run their fuge on a reverse light cycle, again, the o2 from the macro bumps pH. But only slightly like .2 or .4 max.

You gotta be a smart guy for thinking this much on it lol.... You're gonna have a kick ass tank I bet

 

[Friendly Fire]

We'll that solved the problem. PH seems to have been the culprit with the white sludge. Thanks to everyone for the encouraging comments and help with fixing my problem. Really appreciate all the feedback and suggests.

 

[Choff]

Gas turbine is dead on and clearly knows more than I. The only thing I will add about ph from my own experience was watching my ph drop from a stable 8.2 to 7.9. The cause? We closed all the windows in the summer to turn on the AC. The co2 levels in the house shot up driving my tank ph down. Opened a window and ph went right back up over night. I was blown away. I have watched this cycle happen a few times. I monitor my ph with an apex probe, not spot measures. I'm going to run an outside line to my skimmer to eliminate this problem.

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