reefmadness
Member
has anyone checked out the ecoray 60 leds they say euivalent to 2 250 w mh check it out and lemme know
Want your opinion on LED lighting!
- Thread starter MIG1969
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ArtemisGoldfish
New Member
For what its worth, I use LED fixtures for my Aeroponics setup. Each panel is 28 watts. The growth is very prolific. I took two of the panels and they now fuel my algae scrubber.
It's not an issue of wattage so much as it is the PAR at varying depths. The issue with water is the refraction and diffraction which greatly reduces the intensity of the light and the PAR as well.
380 to 700 is the best range for a reef tank (mostly UV & Blue with a little red).
Make sure to to account for all of these parameters when you plan out your lighting.
It's not an issue of wattage so much as it is the PAR at varying depths. The issue with water is the refraction and diffraction which greatly reduces the intensity of the light and the PAR as well.
380 to 700 is the best range for a reef tank (mostly UV & Blue with a little red).
Make sure to to account for all of these parameters when you plan out your lighting.
Very well put. PAR is ultimately what we need to see for it to benefit the coral at all.
Beychev
Member
I got the LED lighting on my JBJ and though it's not exactly the same thing as a fixture that is separate from the tank I have to say that I absolutely love them!
They reduce the need for loud, noisy fans, are super bright (I have to wear sunglasses when I work on mine) and surprisingly not only cover a large spectrum, but also offer lots of wattage. I can't speak to their coral growing powers as my tank is only a month old, but I hear they're quite enough for what most entry level hobbyists like myself wish to keep.
In short, I'm very satisfied with mine, and wish you the best with yours!
They reduce the need for loud, noisy fans, are super bright (I have to wear sunglasses when I work on mine) and surprisingly not only cover a large spectrum, but also offer lots of wattage. I can't speak to their coral growing powers as my tank is only a month old, but I hear they're quite enough for what most entry level hobbyists like myself wish to keep.
In short, I'm very satisfied with mine, and wish you the best with yours!
chipmunkofdoom2
Well-Known Member
Most people recommend replacing bulbs in T5 and MH fixtures anywhere from 6 months to a year and a half. Be sure to factor in 13+ years worth of no bulb changes, as well as around half of the electrical cost.
They actually appear to be less than 1 watt per LED. Anything that's going to get you near-MH PAR has 3 watters. Anything less is the reason most people are skeptical of LEDs.
I wouldn't. Unless you can get a PAR meter and ensure you're getting decent numbers, 1W LEDs just can't penetrate the water as well as 3Ws. Also, the color (blue/white) has nothing to do with what coral it will support.
Appearance of light doesn't really count unfortunately. LEDs are not like conventional aquarium lights, they are semiconductors whose dies emit light when you run current through them. They don't heat phosphors or other gasses like T5 and MH. LEDs need to be a certain power to penetrate water sufficiently to get PAR to the corals. Also, though the light might work for FW plants, SW corals have totally different requirements as far as light is concerned.
For most, no, you're right. Like I said though, it's unfair to discount LEDs because they cost so much without looking at the savings (yearly or sooner bulb changes, electrical savings).
I used to agree, whole heartedly. My motto was "if it's ever cheap enough that you would consider spending money on it, it's no good," but manufacturers are stepping up to the plate. Check out the AI Sol, a reefer on another forum did some PAR testing and the results are outstanding. They're a little on the expensive side, but they use the BEST and most recent LEDs from Cree, the LED of choice for almost all custom builds. You definitely get what you pay for.
You're right in a sense. Watt for watt, LEDs out perform almost all aquarium lighting out there. However, that's apples to oranges. When you're comparing apples to apples (LEDs to LEDs), that analogy doesn't hold. For MH, you could probably use a 70W HQI fixture on a 10 gallon tank and you'd be fine. On a 30G, though, you'd need to bump it up to 150W. It's the same with LEDs, 1Ws might be fine for accent lighting or shallow tanks, but don't expect dazzling PAR and coral growth. For more light, PAR, and growth, 3W LEDs are required. Everywhere that DIYers claim that LED fixtures can get near or equal-to-MH PAR levels, they're not talking about 1W LEDs, they're talking about 3Ws.
1W LEDs might get you around what you had in CFLs, so if that's all you want, you can certainly do that. Don't expect to burn any acros though.
Couldn't have said it better. In MH and T5s, there are some bulbs that are better than others. I know a lot of people here favor ATI bulbs and they seem to be of high quality. The difference is with T5 bulbs, you can still get adequate PAR with middle of the road bulbs. Not true with LEDs. With LEDs, you're paying for 10+ years of use. Buy quality and you won't be disappointed. A big problem, I think, is that none of the MFGs are telling you what LEDs they're using, the driving current or wattage, or any other relevant specs. You don't have to be an electronics guru to pick out a good fixture, but the MFG at least has to give you some basic info. That's why I like the AI Sol, they are VERY transparent about what they are using: QUALITY PARTS.
Sorry I'm late to the party, if you get me a link I'll check it out.
You're right, the biggest issue with LEDs is penetration and PAR at depth. 3W LEDs are not perfect because they are 3W, but they are what we know to work well. You also need to ensure they have some sort of optic on them if your tank is much deeper than 14-18 inches. PAR drop-off is substantial.
Now for my build.. check my avatar and my build thread in my sig. I only have a few rics and zoas in there now, so there's not much to see, but this is the second LED fixture I've build, and I can guarantee once I move out and get my 65g resealed, it's going to have an LED light too.
DBrinson
Member
The biggest issue for me is the number of LED's and how the spread of light reduces the "shimmering" effect of light as it is refracted through the surface ripples into the recipient xooanthellae inside of coral polyps.
Coral polyps are optimized in nature for catching the bursts of light that are refracted into them, they like "spikes" and "lulls" more than constant illumination.
Think about a laser used to cut through metal in a factory. A "pulsing" laser is far more effective than a steady beam with the same wattage applied to the sheet of metal. A single point source such as a metal halide together with a random surface current is capable of providing the bursts of light intensity from different angles that corals thrive on in ocean reefs. (I wrote up my complete thoughts on the issue tonight in this thread if you want to read more.)
Coral polyps are optimized in nature for catching the bursts of light that are refracted into them, they like "spikes" and "lulls" more than constant illumination.
Think about a laser used to cut through metal in a factory. A "pulsing" laser is far more effective than a steady beam with the same wattage applied to the sheet of metal. A single point source such as a metal halide together with a random surface current is capable of providing the bursts of light intensity from different angles that corals thrive on in ocean reefs. (I wrote up my complete thoughts on the issue tonight in this thread if you want to read more.)
The one issue I have not seen addressed on this thread is replacement parts for an LED fixture. For T5 or MH lighting you can make a repair using more or less easily available, off the shelf parts. Most LED fixtures available today are proprietary from the manufacturer. If the manufacturer discontinues an item, or will not supply parts, or goes out of business, you are high and dry. This actually happened to people that bought the PFO Solaris LED fixtures.
If it's a DIY project, your a lot better off. Usually you can get some sort of replacement parts.
The other issue with LED lighting is the high initial investment. It can still take many years for it to pay for itself, and that even if you don't have any problems that require replacement parts. How many people keep a lighting fixture 10 years? Usually something lots better comes out and you get the new lighting. If your replacing you lighting every 3 or 4 years, the savings from LED lighting may not be there.
I think LED lighting will be the lighting of choice, once they get the initial investment costs down, and the parts more or less standardised so we can repair them with off the shelf parts.
If it's a DIY project, your a lot better off. Usually you can get some sort of replacement parts.
The other issue with LED lighting is the high initial investment. It can still take many years for it to pay for itself, and that even if you don't have any problems that require replacement parts. How many people keep a lighting fixture 10 years? Usually something lots better comes out and you get the new lighting. If your replacing you lighting every 3 or 4 years, the savings from LED lighting may not be there.
I think LED lighting will be the lighting of choice, once they get the initial investment costs down, and the parts more or less standardised so we can repair them with off the shelf parts.