Starting Over with New Rocks?

MCDM

Member
Hi everyone. It's been a while since I've posted. I've had my rem 130d up and running for almost 6 years now, and everything has been pretty much smooth sailing... until a few months ago. My aiptasia problem has spiraled out of control to the point where it has taken over the entire tank. There must be a million of these things. I've tried it all.... nudibranchs, peppermint shrimp, lemon juice... and all to varying degrees of success.

I'm ready to throw in the towel and start fresh. What are your thoughts about removing the rocks, boiling them in water (thus killing everything off), removing all the dead debris, and letting it dry for a few days? Is it safe to put this rock back in the tank, or will it cause a major ammonia spike? Any other suggestions would be great.


Thanks
Morgan
 

ziggy

Active Member
It will cause an ammonia spike as you will have to repeat the cycle. How thick is your substrate? Maybe some bacteria is there.

Also, how much livestock do you have and are they staying in the tank while you boil.

I'm surprised the nudibranchs did not work. Were they the correct type and did you have 3 or more. Wonder if you can borrow a pipefish from a LFS?

What about boiling 1/2 rock now and 1/2 in a week or so?
 

Pat24601

Well-Known Member
We talked about this a little when I threw around the term without knowing what it meant here: Green Bubble Algae.

Basically, don't literally boil your live rock. It can be dangerous for you. People do seem to leave them out in the sun for a few weeks or treat them in other ways to kill everything on them. I'd have to research to know what a good process would really be.
 

ziggy

Active Member
Also, after boiling, what if you quick cycle the rock in a bucket or smaller aquarium with 2 deli shrimp? That might give you the quickest bacteria colony buildup... just wondering
 

MCDM

Member
Thanks everyone for the replies. I currently only have 2 clowns and a lawnmower blenny. My substate is a bout 2-2.5 inches thick. I don't have a lot of rock in the tank (it's pretty much one big tall piece). Could I just put it back in the tank with weekly water changes to help squash the ammonia?
 

ziggy

Active Member
Thanks everyone for the replies. I currently only have 2 clowns and a lawnmower blenny. My substate is a bout 2-2.5 inches thick. I don't have a lot of rock in the tank (it's pretty much one big tall piece). Could I just put it back in the tank with weekly water changes to help squash the ammonia?
You could do that however that will significantly slow the cycle. the ammonia needs to be there for the colonies to grow to convert it to nitrite and the same for nitrates. If your nitrates were high then large WC's are appropriate. Also don't forget, boiling the rock kills the living matter but when you put the rock back with dead matter on it the ammonia will take off.

since you only have the 3 small fish, and 2.5 inches of substrate I would leave the fish alone and just do not feed too much. cycle the rock in a bucket and after a week you might luck out and have completed your nitrite spike and at that point I would put the rock back in even if your nitrate level was peaking in the bucket.

How many pieces of rock do you have? perhaps you can put in 1 rock a day while monitoring your ammonia. if it shoots up take the rock out. if it remains low or goes back to zero, then put the next piece in.

several options here but I do not get a warm and fuzzing putting in all the rock at once with dead matter on it. even scrubbing it will not remove the matter in the crevices
 

Adrienne

Well-Known Member
I have recently read that the following is 100% successful in killing apistasia - a 50/50 mix of lemon juice & white vinegar or injecting calcium directly into the apistasia mouths. +1 to boiling - there was an article I read where boiling what had been live rock nearly killed a couple and their pet dogs due to palytoxins (it was not observed there were palyzoa).
 

MCDM

Member
Hands down the best forum, can't thank you guys enough for your input. I will be weighing my options and let you know when the battle begins.

Quick question: How much risk is there to the new rock to becoming infested?
 

Adrienne

Well-Known Member
Something will have to bring it in but I would assume that if you have sand already in your tank and you don't remove and replace that as well and completely scrub your tank and all equipment then there is a reasonable chance aptasia will remain. I've seen it in the sand in my tank - pre CBB.
 

Joeys Tank

Well-Known Member
The best solution is to do what you can with killing off those you can see. Aiptasia-X does well. There will very likely be many that you don't see. Pulling the rock and re-curing them is a great solution, but as recommended, I wouldn't do all of your tank. With a 130, half or a third of your rock at a time should be good. Ideally, take out the rock in one section. Kill any aiptasia on the rock you pull as well as in the sandbed. Once the rock is clear, place it back in the tank and pull the other half (next third). Peppermint shrimp are great, but they take a bit of time to really settle in (for my tank at least). Slow and steady, keep on top of it, inject Aiptasia-X in any you find. Eventually, you will get it under control. The shrimp will take it the rest of the way and get any small pieces that start up.
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
Could you post a picture of your tank so we can see just how bad the problem is? What you might think is a hopeless case might not be that bad.

If the tank is really over run with aiptasia you only have two serious options. You can live with it and fight it as best you can or you can do a complete tear down and re-setup of the whole system. Aiptasia will get just about everyplace, and killing the ones you can see will just leave the ones you can see a new area to repopulate.

The methods of using various injectable products or material to cover them do work, but only when you have a manageable population.

If your going to tear down the tank and start over, it's going to be a long process. Only do this if there is no other way. here are the main steps. This is an extremely drastic action.

Remove anything you want to save to a quarantine tank. They are going to be there a long time, so don't overcrowd. While it's there, kill any aiptasia you find. You need to make sure you are not reintroducing the problem when you set up again.

Drain all the water out of the original system

Refill the tank with FW and add about a cup of bleach per 5 gal of water. Stir up the sandbed too. This step will kill everything in the tank. Let this stand over night.

Drain the tank again removing as much dirt as you can. Sometimes you need to repeat the previous step.

Refill the tank with FW and wait a day. Stir everything up again. You need to get rid of the bleach at this point.

Repeat the prior step at least 2 more times. You can add one of the usual dechlorination products at this time. You need to get to the point where you can no longer smell the bleach.

Drain the tank, remove everything and manually clean everything. Let everything dry.

Set the tank back up as if it was a new system. Use RO/DI water and a quality salt. Use the deli shrimp method to initially cycle the tank. Expect this to take several weeks, and you'll see the massive ammonia and nitrite spikes typical of new systems.

Slowly reintroduce anything you saved in the initial step.

Now you have a new system, and you'll typically have all the new tank issues with algae blooms. Keep after those. If you see any aiptasia on anything, you need to kill it right away.
 

Pat24601

Well-Known Member
Could you post a picture of your tank so we can see just how bad the problem is? What you might think is a hopeless case might not be that bad.

If the tank is really over run with aiptasia you only have two serious options. You can live with it and fight it as best you can or you can do a complete tear down and re-setup of the whole system. Aiptasia will get just about everyplace, and killing the ones you can see will just leave the ones you can see a new area to repopulate.

The methods of using various injectable products or material to cover them do work, but only when you have a manageable population.

If your going to tear down the tank and start over, it's going to be a long process. Only do this if there is no other way. here are the main steps. This is an extremely drastic action.

Remove anything you want to save to a quarantine tank. They are going to be there a long time, so don't overcrowd. While it's there, kill any aiptasia you find. You need to make sure you are not reintroducing the problem when you set up again.

Drain all the water out of the original system

Refill the tank with FW and add about a cup of bleach per 5 gal of water. Stir up the sandbed too. This step will kill everything in the tank. Let this stand over night.

Drain the tank again removing as much dirt as you can. Sometimes you need to repeat the previous step.

Refill the tank with FW and wait a day. Stir everything up again. You need to get rid of the bleach at this point.

Repeat the prior step at least 2 more times. You can add one of the usual dechlorination products at this time. You need to get to the point where you can no longer smell the bleach.

Drain the tank, remove everything and manually clean everything. Let everything dry.

Set the tank back up as if it was a new system. Use RO/DI water and a quality salt. Use the deli shrimp method to initially cycle the tank. Expect this to take several weeks, and you'll see the massive ammonia and nitrite spikes typical of new systems.

Slowly reintroduce anything you saved in the initial step.

Now you have a new system, and you'll typically have all the new tank issues with algae blooms. Keep after those. If you see any aiptasia on anything, you need to kill it right away.


Wow @DaveK, I've bee looking for a simple tutorial like this for weeks. Thanks!
 

Pat24601

Well-Known Member
Thanks for your support.

Keep in mind that this is a "nuke and pave" approach and should only be used when all other methods fail or the system has been wiped out due to disease. It should not casually be used.

I know. I'm extremely unlikely to use it anytime soon. Just always good to know how to if it comes to it. :)
 

MCDM

Member
Thanks everyone once again. I will post some pics when I get home tonight. I'm contemplating a total tear down.... would be nice to get a fresh start.
 

Snelly40

Well-Known Member
i had a huuuuge outbreak of aiptasia a few years back and was contemplating this too... adding the Tahitian Butterfly had all the aiptasia gone quickly and was the best investment...
 

ziggy

Active Member
i had a huuuuge outbreak of aiptasia a few years back and was contemplating this too... adding the Tahitian Butterfly had all the aiptasia gone quickly and was the best investment...
wouldn't the aips from the rubble and crevasses keep reproducing since I would think the fish can't get into the nook and cranies?

I hear a pipefish is also good. Saw a really neat video on youtube of one cleansing a tank.
 

Snelly40

Well-Known Member
wouldn't the aips from the rubble and crevasses keep reproducing since I would think the fish can't get into the nook and cranies?

I hear a pipefish is also good. Saw a really neat video on youtube of one cleansing a tank.

all i know is he ate all mine and they never showed back up...
 
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