Shaun's 2000 Litre (530 USG) Living Reef & Red Sea Max S 650 LED Design & Build

Discussion in 'Red Sea Max Owners Club' started by SPR, May 27, 2016.

  1. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    Looking good so far. Keep faith in your own skills.

    PS - check your home insurance for water damage.........just saying.
     
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  2. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Your funny aren’t you NOT! Lol

    I’m quiet enjoying it actually, I’m trying to do everything slowly and double think everything as I go.

    I’ve been staring at the clarisea sk5000 for a few hours this afternoon thinking how to plumb it in. But still haven’t decided yet so I’ll leave it for a while

    At least building the system up like this I know how every single system works and is put together

    It also makes me realise how relatively easy it would be to modify the S650 to make maintenance easier. I’ve always been frightened to touch any of the plumbing but now I can modify all sorts of things. And adding a spare emergency return pump system would be simple.
     
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  3. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    I’ve mentioned calcium reactors before and I still haven’t decided wether to get one. The Apex DOS units, and I have 2, have been assigned to automatic water changes for both systems, so if I go down the dosing route I’ll either need to get some more or something like the Kamoer which I have now.

    The main concern with dosing, is the volume of solutions required and constantly making it up, and of course the ongoing cost of the foundation elements. The calcium reactor once set up requires little adjustment, and of course will add all foundation elements and some trace elements from the dissolving coral skeletons, maybe with the addition of some magnesium additives mixed in.

    The principal of a calcium reactor looks sound and especially for a large system that will be heavily stocked with corals. If I get one I think I’m going to get the Deltec Twin Tech Calcium Reactor 3000 as it seems to pretty much automate everything, with very little maintenance. But, it’s also expensive.

    This is a good video and review of it, and having watched it, with the various parts explained, it looks relatively simple as the computer controls it. It does look a bit scary though! Lol



    https://www.theaquariumsolution.com/product/8157/300

    I’ve never used one before, but it’s not going into a mature system, it’s a new system so I can learn to use it slowly as the tank grows. So it’s not like I’m taking a risk with an existing tank by changing methods and upsetting everything as I learn if you see what I mean.

    The alkalinity consumption on the S650 is currently 250ml per day of Red Sea Foundation B powder so multiply that by 4 x water volume and you can see were I’m coming from, and why I’m seriously looking at these.
     
    #1663
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
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  4. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    I’ve decided after months of studying, watching videos and finally being in contact with the experts at DD I’m getting a calcium reactor and the daddy of calcium reactors, the Deltec Twin Tech 1500.

    I was looking at the 3000 but after liaising with DD and the guys who use these, (on similar size tanks to mine) the 1500 is more than adequate and will probably run on the lower end of its capabilities. Their customer support and help is absolutely first class.

    So along with the endless stuff I’ve had to purchase, and below is just the main components, here’s an up to date list

    Abyzz a200 return pump
    Ecotech Radion XR30w G4 Pro LED x 4
    Ecotech Radion RMS Tank mounts x 4
    Ecotech Vortech MP60wQD x 2
    Ecotech Vortech MP40wQD x 1 (for the centre of the tank)
    Ecotech battery backups x 3
    Real Reef Rock Premium x 150kg
    NYOS Quantum 300 protein skimmer
    Clarisea SK5000
    Clarisea SK5000 XL Fleece
    Deltec FR512 rhowaphos reactor
    DD 80w UVC
    Neptune Apex 2016 Fusion (in addition to the one on the S650)
    Neptune Apex DOS (for auto water changes/dosing) x 2
    Neptune Apex Vortech WXM Module (to control/monitor Radions)
    Neptune Apex Magnetic Probe holder
    Neptune Apex Auto Top Off ATK
    Neptune Apex 2’ flow sensor (to monitor flow from return pump)
    Neptune Apex 1’ flow sensor x 2 (UVC and Chiller)
    Neptune Apex optical sensors x 2 (RODI/saltwater containers) with magnetic mounts
    Neptune Apex Advanced leak detection system
    Neptune Apex Energy Bar x 2
    Eheim 400e heaters x 2
    Red Sea Activated Carbon to be used in media bags
    Deltec Twin Tech 1500 Calcium Reactor
    Rowalith W (chunky version) 6kg reactor media
    Innovative Marine custom probe holder XL (for ATO and water change pipes etc)
    2 x 425 litre water containers for RODI and automatic water changes
    ATM Colony x 5 946ml (no I’m not using dead shrimps!! Lol)
    Red Sea Reef Pink Live Sand x 70kg
    Red Sea Standard salt x 6 22kg buckets
    32mm PVC pipe and various fittings including ball valves, unions etc. The main downflow return pipe will have a more expensive gate valve fitted by the tank builders as there more accurate

    I’m also going to install back up RODI pumps and lines into both tanks controlled by Apex so that in the event of an ATO failing when I’m away, I can manually switch on a RODI pump into each tank to add RO water to the systems or possibly configure them when on auto in the event of failure to switch on every x hours. All with have anti siphon breaks installed

    I’m sure I’ve missed something....... lol
     
    #1664
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
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  5. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    Blimey, 250ml per day for Alk! I dose 100ml a day and I thought that was heavy !
    I must admit I've watched a few videos on the Calcium Reactor. My first concern was how you manage to 'dose' the required amounts, but this new reactor seems to have that screwed down. I also think it is an indicator that you personally are moving away from the 'hobby' side of aquariums into the more professional side of things (if that sounds clear). Maybe the new tank is so big that it needs something like this rather than mixing up Foundation B. It does carry a hefty price tag, and the re-fills for the Co2 won't be cheap I doubt, but it will certainly help reducing the maintenance, as I can see you mixing up Foundation B every couple of days !!!!
     
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  6. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    You've missed the snorkel, mask and fins. I also can't see any heaters or heater controller, and I assume that somewhere on Apex will be the heater controller?
     
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  7. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Heaters added to list being 2 Eheim 400 e versions and yes they will be controlled by Apex

    The alkalinity consumption, was the reason I started looking at calcium reactors. I have a 5 litre dosing container and fill it to about 4.5 litres and at 250ml per day it gets through it, so just imagine how much a bigger fully stocked system will use.

    I’m feeling very comfortable with the Twin Tech now I understand how it’s put together and works, it’s actually very simple. Basically you just change the out flow by pressing a button. One of the ‘masters’ at DD has it on his fully stocked tank and doses just 49 litres a day through it. The maximum capacity is 350 litres so you can see the spare capacity and why I’m going for the 1500 version rather than the 3000.

    The CO2 is inexpensive really. I actually have 3 food grade large CO2 containers now (the long ones) that I use for making beer and they cost about £30 to fill up I think but last ages. Infact the one on my bar has been in place for about 3 years and it’s still full.

    The principal seems very straightforward and the Rowalith also contains magnesium so as the old corals break down they release all their elements back into the water, it’s quiet natural really once you get your head around it.

    The Twin Tech makes it very easy. You don’t even need to monitor pH in the reactor because of the way it works, although there’s a probe port if you want to.
     
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  8. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    I recommended a programme on tv last week, and in that they collected dead corals from the sea and they had a bloke crushing them up in a bowl to be added to one of their Calcium Reactors !

    2 x Eheim 400e heaters. What if one breaks down? Will one be able to cope with a tank that size?
     
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  9. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    That’s basically what the media is, dead crushed corals and as they break down their elements go back to build new corals. Seems a very natural way to do it.

    The Eheim 400e heaters are the new ones and each rated to around 1200 litres so 2 will easily be ok and 1 should be fine on the basis they are hardly ever on. My central heating picks up the bill!!

    I will also have a heater in the new Teco 2000e when it arrives

    https://www.eheim.com/en_GB/products/technology/aquarium-heaters/new-thermocontrol-e_400
     
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  10. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    The builders have finished there work which was basically building and insulating the shed for water containers and equipment and drilling some holes.

    I didn’t want to do anything to the house in case I ever wanted to take everything down, so the only alteration to the house structure is drilling/cutting 2 holes. That’s it.

    Ducting has been installed through to the back of the tank from the shed and I can now start to build everything in there and feed the wires and pipes through. It was very fiddly cutting and installing the ducting do to the confined space, but it’s all been sealed on the outside with water proof sealant etc for rain protection.

    A 52mm diameter hole has been drilled in the wall behind the S650 and I’m going to install a 50mm pvc pipe from the shed to this hole containing Apex DOS tubing for auto water changes on the S650 and a hose or 2 if they fit to auto fill the RODI reservoir in the S650 all from the same water containers as the new 2000 litre system. The total water volume of the new tank is just under 3000 litres including these containers.

    I had to buy a 52mm diamond drill cutter blade to do this and when they fitted it to the drill it was like some sort of rocket launcher. If I said I wasn’t nervous watching them drill a hole through the wall behind the S650 I would be lying and I was just thinking please don’t cut through anything critical like gas pipes, electric, you get the idea! But all went well.

    Not the most exciting pictures but you get the idea.

    IMG_0827.JPG IMG_0828.JPG IMG_0829.JPG IMG_0830.JPG IMG_0831.JPG
     
    #1670
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  11. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    You're going to get an Achilles Tang aren't you !
     
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  12. emvanburen

    emvanburen Well-Known Member

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    Shaun - love the progress. Nothing like cutting into your house to affirm your commitment to the hobby!

    The automatic carx are very interesting. However with an apex - even the traditional ones are pretty stable these days. I had one back in the 2005 timeframe and it was more sketchy!



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  13. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Yes it’s going to start moving along more now as I have most of the equipment apart from a couple of pvc reducers for a 2’ Apex flow sensor which is going at the end of the pipework on the main return (before it goes up into the tank) so I can monitor flow and the amount after what’s being fed from the manifold.

    I was waiting on these holes so I can get pipework outside

    I think the calcium reactor will be a good investment certainly and last night I thought about testing it on the S650. Or I might get another one! Lol
     
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  14. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    Well their reef safe apparently as I’ve just checked!

    I haven’t even thought about fish apart from the ‘shoals’ to be honest, I have that many ‘build’ things to consider.

    But basically if an LFS can get it, and it’s reef safe I can fit it in this system.
     
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  15. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    So this morning, very early I checked the sump to make sure all was well, and thought I’ll just turn the protein skimmer up a bit as not much Skim was being produced.

    I settled down for a cup of tea..... Shaun Shaun come quick to the fish tank!!!

    Skimmer overflowing into the 5 litre container, return section nearly empty and bubbles filling the tank.........

    Shaun FFS, stop messing with things!!! Lol

    Oh and the skimmer nearly wouldn’t start back up, but then it’s past it’s full body ‘annual’ clean so it’s about time I cleaned it!
     
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  16. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    Skimmers are weird aren't they. I look down into the Sump every day, and sometimes I notice that the water/bubble level in the Skimmer is low. In the past, I would have adjusted it, but I've now learnt to just leave it be. 'Something' (and I've no idea what) makes the level drop sometimes, in the same way that 'something' (and I've no idea what) makes it explode like a volcano now and again.
     
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  17. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    So today I’ve installed the Neptune Apex ATK auto top-off system, but into the S650!

    After 3 years of faultless running the Tunze Osmolator failed last night and fortunately I was in the room and heard it constantly ‘on’. I cleaned the optical sensor (for the first time and it was a bit ‘funky’!) in citric acid, but it didn’t make any difference it couldn’t tell it was supposed to switch off.

    I’m am aware of potential issues with bubbles forming and when I wiped the sensors with my finger it turned off. But then at top off time it just kept running again.

    So this morning after doing some research, when the Tunze starts up in test mode, a single light stays on for 1 second to test the optical sensor. It’s green amber or red. It. It was red so....

    I’ve actually kept it and might test is as a back up in a few months or it will be in the bin which is very disappointing to say there supposed to be one of the best.

    So my initial thoughts on the Apex ATK. It’s a very well built piece of kit and mine is the Version 2, the new one. It has 2 optical sensors for redundancy but it also has a physical float switch the shuts off the water if the sensors failed. Works like the float switch from Red Sea on their tanks, which I also still have as a back up system. All the Apex sensors are on one magnetic block and it seems very good quality.

    It integrates into the Apex Fusion control so it’s all very nice and easy to control. The system automatically sets the control parameters which you can alter if you want to suit your needs.

    It’s extremely sophisticated how it works. But I was sat there for 30 minutes thinking why isn’t it pumping when the sensors are telling it to.......mmmm, it’s because it has a delay period in the software program so it won’t come on again for an hour after running I think. And of course I’d been testing it

    For those of you interested and if you haven’t seen it the program is here

    IMG_3092.JPG
     
    #1677
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  18. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    My Tunze Osmolator has both an Optical Sensor and a Float Switch for redundancy.

    Don't bin it, just replace the Optical Sensor.
     
    #1678
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  19. SPR

    SPR Well-Known Member

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    There £35 and ‘These need to be soldered onto the board by a competant professional’ so that rules me out! This just shouts of ‘failure whilst away’.

    I’d sooner just buy a new one, or rather put the money towards an Apex ATK which I’ve got to now anyway for the new tank.
     
    #1679
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  20. Nobbygas

    Nobbygas Well-Known Member

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    Ah, I've got to agree with you on that one :)
     
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