Shaun's 2000 Litre (530 USG) Living Reef & Red Sea Max S 650 LED Design & Build

SPR

Well-Known Member
For those of you who have never used Apex, it’s a very advanced piece of kit and it’s incredible what it will do with a bit of programming.

This is excellent write up on how the ATK program works. My ATK is named different if your wondering why they are slightly different (ATKNRM etc)

‘Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If ATK_LO OPEN Then ON
If ATK_HI CLOSED Then OFF
When On > 005:00 Then OFF
Defer 000:10 Then ON
Defer 000:04 Then OFF
Min Time 060:00 Then OFF

Let’s walk through each line:

  • Fallback OFF — instructs the Apex to turn off this output if the Apex ever gets disconnected from the FMM. This could also apply if the Apex locks up and becomes unresponsive (which rarely happens). This just basically means don’t run the program if the Apex unit isn’t in control of the situation.
  • Set OFF — This sets up the output’s register to default to OFF if no other conditions are met.
  • If ATK_LO OPEN Then ON — ATK_LO is the lower optical sensor plugged into port 1 of the FMM. This is the primary sensor that should do all the work under normal circumstances. If the water is lower than this sensor, it will report OPEN so the pump should be turned On. If the water level is even with the center of the sensor, or if the sensor is completely submerged, it will report CLOSED so this line of code would evaluate as False.
  • If ATK_HI CLOSED Then OFF — ATK_HI is the upper optical sensor plugged into port 2 of the FMM. Like the ATK_LO sensor, if will report OPEN if it’s above the water level, and CLOSED if it’s level or submerged in water. This would turn off the pump if the lower sensor failed to do its job.
  • When On > 005:00 Then OFF — As described in the previous tutorial, the When command is a failsafe that will move the ATK PMUP output sider from AUTO to OFF on the dashboard. This will prevent the ATK from running again until you manually move the slider back to AUTO. This typically represents an error condition you should investigate to determine why the pump ran for too long. This will be discussed in the next section.
  • Defer 000:10 Then ON — Also described in yesterday’s tutorial, the Defer command causes a delay before turning on the pump until the water level has been detected as continuously low for at least 10 seconds before turning on the pump. This avoids rapid on/off fluctuations caused by water ripples triggering the optical sensors.
  • Defer 000:04 Then OFF — Same as above, but wait for 4 seconds once the water level has filled sufficiently before turning off the pump.
  • Min Time 060:00 Then OFF — Also described in the previous tutorial, the Min Time command forces the ATK to wait at least 60 minutes before allowing the pump to turn on again.’
 
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SPR

Well-Known Member
So today I’ve been busy installing some of the equipment including the 50mm PVC pipework to house the auto water change DOS tubing for the S650, Ethernet cable to hard wire the additional Apex into the internet and also a hose which I’m going to use to pump RODI water into the S650 reservoir from the new water system. This will mean no more hauling barrels of water for me!!

So all installed, insulated and then I just needed to cut the pipe at one end to the correct length to go into the shed for the last few feet while my wife held the other end for me.

The normal pipe cutter wasn’t big enough so off I went for the hacksaw which cut through the pipe like butter...... and it also cut through what was inside the pipe..... you know that moment when you stand there going you stupid stupid...........

So I cut through all the pipe, cables the lot and now I’ve had to reorder it all. Fortunately for my sanity, I was going to need some ‘shorter lengths’ anyway.....

IMG_0843.JPG
 

Nobbygas

Well-Known Member
So today I’ve been busy installing some of the equipment including the 50mm PVC pipework to house the auto water change DOS tubing for the S650, Ethernet cable to hard wire the additional Apex into the internet and also a hose which I’m going to use to pump RODI water into the S650 reservoir from the new water system. This will mean no more hauling barrels of water for me!!

So all installed, insulated and then I just needed to cut the pipe at one end to the correct length to go into the shed for the last few feet while my wife held the other end for me.

The normal pipe cutter wasn’t big enough so off I went for the hacksaw which cut through the pipe like butter...... and it also cut through what was inside the pipe..... you know that moment when you stand there going you stupid stupid...........

So I cut through all the pipe, cables the lot and now I’ve had to reorder it all. Fortunately for my sanity, I was going to need some ‘shorter lengths’ anyway.....

View attachment 49873
I can't give you a 'like' for that. It sort of seems cruel ! Remember, measure three times, cut once!
 

SPR

Well-Known Member
Do your family trust you with a knife and fork?
It’s funny you should say that....

I bought some large Brazilian steak knifes a few days ago and they arrived and I thought I need to try them so I had a nice piece of rib eye for my tea yesterday. These knives cut through it like butter. They have large wooden handles.

You know when you get something on the knife and then do what your mother told you not to, like putting it in your mouth...... I very nearly cut my mouth, infact I thought I had. I was wiping, waiting for the blood!! Lol

That’s why your mother tells you not to put a knife in your mouth, as apart from being bad manners, you might cut yourself!
 

SPR

Well-Known Member
I did my normal weekly water tests today, all levels were fine, alkalinity usage is fairly high at 250ml (now 260ml per day) of Foundation B and the Magnesium usage was fairly high as well.

Well magnesium usage made me suspicious as although at 1320ppm the level was fine I couldn’t believe the dosing amount. So I investigated and found there was very little coming out of the dosing tube. Infact it was virtually blocked.

So I investigated a little further and took a look at the dosing container. The magnesium liquid had solidified in one corner were the dosing pipe goes in at the bottom. It was like clear glass/acrylic so clearly some form of reaction.

So I emptied this out, replaced some of the dosing tubing and it works fine now but I’ve halved the dosing amount on the basis it must have been wrong and I’ll adjust again in 7 days

These things are sent to test you from time to time!
 

Nobbygas

Well-Known Member
Moved from another thread....

"Knowing what I know now, if I was buying anything of that size and cost I would go custom build, no hesitation

You can design everything exactly as you want it to your own requirements rather than just a standard. My sump has bubble traps and all sorts which I had never even thought of, but the guys who build them every day know their stuff.

The other thing is you learn stuff. Like plumbing and do you know what, once you get the hang of it it’s relatively easy. And you can design it how you like it. I was scared to death to even touch the S650 plumbing, but I would now as and when I want to alter something.

I think they will sell them, because unless you’ve had custom build you don’t know anything else. I would have got one definitely until I decided to build my own ocean!"

I hear what you are saying, but it was the knowledge and experience built up from the original plug & play system that has enabled you to develop this far. A new starter wouldn't really know what they wanted, they wouldn't know what to design. Look at us, total newbies with a large tank and sump, yet very quickly we had to learn about Skimmers as the C-Skim had to be replaced !
You are moving up into a different league to the ready made aquariums. A tank the size of your beast just has to be custom made.
 

Nobbygas

Well-Known Member
I did my normal weekly water tests today, all levels were fine, alkalinity usage is fairly high at 250ml (now 260ml per day) of Foundation B and the Magnesium usage was fairly high as well.

Well magnesium usage made me suspicious as although at 1320ppm the level was fine I couldn’t believe the dosing amount. So I investigated and found there was very little coming out of the dosing tube. Infact it was virtually blocked.

So I investigated a little further and took a look at the dosing container. The magnesium liquid had solidified in one corner were the dosing pipe goes in at the bottom. It was like clear glass/acrylic so clearly some form of reaction.

So I emptied this out, replaced some of the dosing tubing and it works fine now but I’ve halved the dosing amount on the basis it must have been wrong and I’ll adjust again in 7 days

These things are sent to test you from time to time!
I found the same in my Mag container when I cleaned it out. As for Mag I hardly dose any at all. It really is minimal.
The one tube that I always have to keep the end clean is the Alk tube. That cakes up every few days !
 
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SPR

Well-Known Member
Moved from another thread....

I hear what you are saying, but it was the knowledge and experience built up from the original plug & play system that has enabled you to develop this far. A new starter wouldn't really know what they wanted, they wouldn't know what to design. Look at us, total newbies with a large tank and sump, yet very quickly we had to learn about Skimmers as the C-Skim had to be replaced !
You are moving up into a different league to the ready made aquariums. A tank the size of your beast just has to be custom made.
That's very true and that's why they will sell the new 900 if they build it no problem at all. They will still sell the S Series because their stunning.

But 'if I were buying...' I would go custom even at the S650 size. Infact when any of the rear circulation pumps go down there may be some MP10/40's going in.
 

SPR

Well-Known Member
I found the same in my Mag container when I cleaned it out. As for Mag I hardly dose any at all. It really is minimal.
The one tube that I always have to keep the end clean is the Alk tube. That cakes up every few days !
Its funny because my Alk doesn't (so far). I use the Red Sea 1kg powder and mix into solution and never had a problem with that.
 

SPR

Well-Known Member
I also use the Foundation Powder.....but the end of the tube always cakes up with the Alk.
I get the crystals forming but its never stopped the liquid going through.

Ive actually ordered some more non return valves for the ends of the tubes
 

Nobbygas

Well-Known Member
That's very true and that's why they will sell the new 900 if they build it no problem at all. They will still sell the S Series because their stunning.

But 'if I were buying...' I would go custom even at the S650 size. Infact when any of the rear circulation pumps go down there may be some MP10/40's going in.
Question. Would you then seal off the outlets/inlets for the rear pumps? Why the Vortech MP10/40's? With the S-650 you probably wouldn't be able to use the functionality ie the various flow patterns, as this would upset the water level in the S-650 and lead to that gurgling sound ? Next, the MP10 may be no good. I think the glass thickness on the S-650 is too much for it (9.5mm for the MP10).....and you'd have pumps on the glass with wires hanging over?
 
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Nobbygas

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I just had a look at the MP40, and it came up with this......

"Tidal Swell Mode
Tidal Swell mode (TSM) creates a harmonic balance reminiscent of the changing flow conditions found in nature. Over the course of several hours, the flow pattern will go from very chaotic to calm, followed by a detritus-clearing surge at the very end of the cycle. The flow direction will change direction every cycle."

That describes the mood swings of She Who Casts No Shadow !
 
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SPR

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Question. Would you then seal off the outlets/inlets for the rear pumps? Why the Vortech MP10/40's? With the S-650 you probably wouldn't be able to use the functionality ie the various flow patterns, as this would upset the water level in the S-650 and lead to that gurgling sound ? Next, the MP10 may be no good. I think the glass thickness on the S-650 is too much for it (9.5mm for the MP10).....and you'd have pumps on the glass with wires hanging over?
As far as I can see, the rear chamber doesn't actually do anything other than house the 4 pumps. Its just like a separate section of the tank so I cant see how it would affect anything on the downpipe. I would leave the outlets in place to prevent fish going through and for a bit of circulation in there. Maybe even put a small flow pump in to keep all the rubbish out which it hasn't got now.

The water is still being pumped up by the return, going over the over flows and then down the pipe.

I would get MP40's because your correct, the glass is to thick for the MP10. There's actually a flow calculator on the Ecotech web site that tells you exactly what you need, flow levels etc.

I don't think flow patterns would make any difference to the down pipe other than slight adjustments as normal. Water is still being pumped up and then runs back down again. The Ecotech has all sorts of programable flow patterns. MP40's I think would need to be run nowhere near full power but I would have to check as and when.
 
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Nobbygas

Well-Known Member
As far as I can see, the rear chamber doesn't actually do anything other than house the 4 pumps. Its just like a separate section of the tank so I cant see how it would affect anything on the downpipe. I would leave the outlets in place to prevent fish going through and for a bit of circulation in there. Maybe even put a small flow pump in to keep all the rubbish out which it hasn't got now.

The water is still being pumped up by the return, going over the over flows and then down the pipe.

I would get MP40's because your correct, the glass is to thick for the MP10. There's actually a flow calculator on the Ecotech web site that tells you exactly what you need, flow levels etc.

I don't think flow patterns would make any difference to the down pipe other than slight adjustments as normal. Water is still being pumped up and then runs back down again. The Ecotech has all sorts of programable flow patterns. MP40's I think would need to be run nowhere near full power but I would have to check as and when.
You can do a test. Turn off one or two of the circulation pumps and see if it effects the water level. This would be the same as changing the flow level/pattern with an MP40.
 
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SPR

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You can do a test. Turn off one or two of the circulation pumps and see if it effects the water level. This would be the same as changing the flow level/pattern with an MP40.
Im not doing it, I might break it! lol

If you think about it, when one of the pumps has stopped working did it make any difference ? I seem to recall it didn't and I only noticed it wasn't working when I added some reef energy/food and it didn't get blown around.

I know if the one on the left is working because the Apex auto feeder drops food infront of it and its gets blown around so I can see its working.
 
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