check valves

[rgfast]

well you always hear they will fail (NOT IF BUT WHEN) last night power went out wife wakes me up to tell me ,my question to her was did you check the tanks answer no got up to flood. check coming from ref. just flapping.Will have to come up with new plan today!Seems hole house gen. getting closer.

 

[mbdave]

rgfast,
Please not to insult you but I don’t understand your post, well not all of it. Can you expound please?
If you are having a check valve failure problem I can safely say I use the "Y" type checks and have not had a problem with them in 15 years, "thats testing them and cleaning them periodically" Valves WYE005 Premium Aquatics This is one here you can install isolation valves on the in and out so you can remove and inspect it or just take the cap off and clean tthe seats. Actually every check valve should be plumbed with isolation valves that is probably why many fail is the inability to secure and perform maintenance.

Good luck,
Dave

 

[rgfast]

its really my fault, being a plumber by trade I should have installed above my exc. tank coming from the ref. This would have given me low presure below valve an allowed it to close propperly.The flood wasn't that bad only lost about 5to10 gals before I caught it this is much better than 350gls running out the door

 

[BigAl07]

Whole house generator is always a GREAT idea

 

[mbdave]

Shame, shame, give me your plumber card!

 

[rgfast]

yell I know rub it in

 

[DaveK]

After having tried ball check valves and Y check valves, IMHO check valves are just about worthless in a SW reef system. They simply pick up too much stuff in the form of algae or bacteria or calcium deposits to work when you really need them. Sooner or later they will fail at a critical point, even though they seem to work perfectly in test.

You are much better off drilling a small hole in the return pipes at or just under the water level. Then if you do loose power, onec the water level drops to the hole, air will enter and break the siphon action.

 

[mikev15101]

im with you Dave, not much experience with the check valves or the y but i did just place a small hole in my locline return line and it works perfectly. I turn off my power to clean my tank check to make sure all my levels are still correct and I turn the power heads on. The flowing water makes no difference.

 

[mbdave]

The hole works but I will still stay with a well maintained check valve.

 

[smoothie]

Whole house generator on sale on cl here buddy.

 

[Luukosian]

I use the "drill a hole" method and would never go another route....the maintenance is so much easier, take a toothpick and make sure the holes are open once a month(if that). Check valves freshwater and salt always fail....eventually...and that's true for anything with moving parts.

 

[marine281]

That works well when the pipe goes in the top of the tank, but what about systems where the water enters from the base of the tank?

I think that's what RG has got- correct me if i'm wrong

 

[rgfast]

that is correct, I use bulk head fittings threw bottem. My 209 Oceanic is the only one which has piping over the sides an thats only because I didn't want to drill 8 1"3/4 holes threw 1" glass bottom

 

[marine281]

How would an electric knife valve go? you could set it to be opened under power, then when power goes out it closes. Using the knife would help it seal better by cutting away algae/sludge. You could even set them on timers so they close & open throughout the day to reduce further the chance of blockage.

Probably a more expensive option, but saves your floor!

 

[rgfast]

thats a thought,where do they sell them

 

[DaveK]

That works well when the pipe goes in the top of the tank, but what about systems where the water enters from the base of the tank?...

You have a point.

However in that case I would recommend that the bulkhead fitting just be used to allow the pipe to pass through the side or bottom of the tank, and then run it up to the surface and then where you want it to come out. Drill your hole where it comes to the surface.

Of course, you could also reroute the plumbing up over the edge of the tank.

Check valves, any type, are just going to fail with all the stuff floating around in a reef system. I speak from experience. New, just installed, right out of the box they seem fine. A little later, and it sticks open during a power failure and you have a flood. Then the process repeats. You clean the check valve, test it, time passes, it sticks open during a power failure, and you have another flood.

Remember, it doesn't take much to keep the check valve from completely closing, and just a little back flow will cause a flood if given enough time.

 

[mbdave]

Dave,
Not sure the type of checks you have used but I have never had the problems you speak of. Now yes the hole in the pipe to break the siphon works fine and I would recommend it, but I have had many tanks in the 20 or so years I have done this and never had a check valve fail, "never" I also use strainers on my pump suction, and proper maintenance on the valve. Even my occupation involves many checks and unless the wrong check was installed or misused they fail very seldom. Your right like I said that the hole is fine but I question how you used or what type of check you used when you did because personally I never have those problems.
JMHO
Dave Y

 

[DaveK]

Dave,
Not sure the type of checks you have used but I have never had the problems you speak of. Now yes the hole in the pipe to break the siphon works fine and I would recommend it, but I have had many tanks in the 20 or so years I have done this and never had a check valve fail, "never" ...

I have used ball check valves, Y check valves, and flapper check valves. All of them failed at one time or another, just when they were needed. The result was almost always a flood.

Now you may have never had a problem. All I can say to that is that you have been very very lucky. Perhaps you live in an area where a power failure is rare.

After my multiple experiences, I just can not recommend check valves for use in a reef system with a sump. They might be ok in other types of systems such as FW or in something where you will not get any build up of anything, such as an auto top off system, but IMHO using a check valve in anything that is going to have SW from a reef system running through it is looking for a flood.

 

[mbdave]

Maybe your unlucky

 

[DaveK]

Maybe your unlucky

That possible. I always say that if I didn't have bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all.