Before You BUY

Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
just a little heads up on the CREE LED lighting systems that most of us drool over and see the pricing. check where your product is made. there's Serious markup on these buggers and its all because of the rave.

for instance:

Dimmable CREE LED Aquarium light 60w products, buy Dimmable CREE LED Aquarium light 60w products from alibaba.com

this look farmiliar?

corals needs-high power 140w led aquarium light products, buy corals needs-high power 140w led aquarium light products from alibaba.com

perhaps this from my own LFS

LED Aquarium Light products, buy LED Aquarium Light products from alibaba.com

Thought i would share this find of mine. Check where its made. if its made in china thats fine, just remember who is making the proffits when you purchase. USA built? well yeah its more expensive. its made by people making 10+ an hour.

Not to mention China has 0.... yes Zero quality control. Flame if ya like this is prolly the thread to do it in.

Read, Learn, Be Aware...
 
jpsika08

jpsika08

Well-Known Member
I was in China the past April in the Canton fair, besides vehicles and other products, there was also the light division on floor, I saw at least 40 different companies developing or offering the same LED product (Everything without exception was LED), and yes, I work with Chinese products and even if they are going light speed with product development, they still fall behind on quality control issues.

For example, I import a Chinese car brand, five years ago many of their parts came bad even before placing the cars at the showroom, now, this same brand has just entered into the JD Power program (Customer satisfaction Index award) which means, China is seeking better and more professional quality control, at the end is a win/win situation for all of us, all products without fail go through China, at least in a small part.

Good thread James.
 
Robzilla

Robzilla

Active Member
Figured I would continue over here instead of derailing Jason's thread:)

Anyway, don't get me wrong man...I would LOVE to get some SOL units...but the Eshine Systems made more sense for my wallet and they work extremely well. I understand your point though :)

And yes, most people do not know where their equipment is coming from. Good thread indeed.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
right on. i just hate... you know the anger i have goes towards the companies that import these LEDs, sell them to individual vendors, then sell to LFS, and in the consumer's hand. in this scenario by far dif. than auto industry lol... you have the ability to purchase this product from the source. saving tons of money. honestly im flaming to the LFS's i guess... yeah and the guys in between.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
its cool rob. i built this thread Instantly to redivert. i also sent pimpala a pm appologizing etc. i would just be Hammered to pay 2400bucks for an identical product i later found for 100bucks ea.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
those leds are imported to china btw lol. so you know the only thing you have is assembly, and basic wiring really, maybe a box with decor.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
WOOO to change the subject a tad. LFS was looking for a purple cap for me. they just called saying 35 bucks... hrmmm thats cheap, must be a small frag... nope this thing is 4 X 5! now for my 3 hours trek to "The Big Tamalle"

ooooh excited!

BrB! lol
 
chipmunkofdoom2

chipmunkofdoom2

Well-Known Member
Those lights are fine. As long as they have Cree (or comparable 3W LEDs) and some sort of optics, you'll be fine. The main thing to consider is support. LED fixtures are only really worth the price if you count that you won't be replacing bulbs as in conventional fixtures every 6-18 months. You need to make sure you either buy a quality unit or a unit from a manufacturer that will definitely be around a while, or else all the cost-benefit points are null and void. LEDs don't follow any sort of part standard like other lights do. In MH for example, ballasts, reflectors, endcaps etc can be bought and changed out at will. Not so with LEDs. Warranties only last about 3 years at the max, so after that you'll be paying for repair anyway, but if the company is out of business, your light isn't getting fixed and you're SOL.

Jackalope said:
Not to mention China has 0.... yes Zero quality control. Flame if ya like this is prolly the thread to do it in.
Click to expand...

The first computer I ever built, in 2003, is still alive and chugging today.. an AMD Athlon XP 2000+, a 40GB Samsung hard drive, some basic Kingston RAM and a ECS motherboard. Mostly budget parts, all either made in China or Asia, as most things are now adays. Either I got lucky, or there is some quality control after all. It all depends on the company. Better companies usually have better quality control standards. Less reputable companies sell less-than-perfect merchandise so they can maximize profit.

It's a popular notion that all things made in China are sub-par, and that usually is the case.. but not always. Almost every single electronic component in the world is made in Asia, with the exception of Intel CPUs. If there was really such poor quality control, I doubt anything electronic would work. Not flaming, as you requested, just stating. Many Americans have a jaundiced view of Chinese made goods, but just because unskilled labor moved there and Americans lost jobs doesn't mean all products are inferior. It all depends on the parent company and how much they put into QC. Every assembly line has rejects and defects, the amount that make it to the consumer is dependent upon how good the company's quality control is.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
oh no this is a perfectly fine thread to flame lol. my main point: why pay triple the price on something you can get str8 from the vendor. i always did this when i could. heh my old kirby i payed 1/4 the total because i signed up to be a seller, then i bought one of there products and never sold one. oh its like Lowes when they have a 50% off sale on there 1200 washers and you know darn well they still kicking a proffit.

i seriously almost bought a set of those. in fact when i first saw them i looked up the price to build one identical and it was cheaper to buy it from them.

dangit i was digging for the email from the gal i chatted with on buying those units too. anyhow it was about 8 months ago 130bucks ea. for 3 total at 60USD FoB freight.
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
Jackalope said:
Not to mention China has 0.... yes Zero quality control. Flame if ya like this is prolly the thread to do it in.
Click to expand...

I stand corrected. i stated this because a few years back when some equipment and parts i used to install faithfully w/o issue in the HVAC business moved there facilities from mexico to china, the quality went to hell in a hand basket. evidently this is now dif. i withdraw this comment as being "old news". -James-
 
sasquatch

sasquatch

Brunt of all Jokes~
PREMIUM
chipmunkofdoom2 said:
Those lights are fine. As long as they have Cree (or comparable 3W LEDs) and some sort of optics, you'll be fine. The main thing to consider is support. LED fixtures are only really worth the price if you count that you won't be replacing bulbs as in conventional fixtures every 6-18 months. You need to make sure you either buy a quality unit or a unit from a manufacturer that will definitely be around a while, or else all the cost-benefit points are null and void. LEDs don't follow any sort of part standard like other lights do. In MH for example, ballasts, reflectors, endcaps etc can be bought and changed out at will. Not so with LEDs. Warranties only last about 3 years at the max, so after that you'll be paying for repair anyway, but if the company is out of business, your light isn't getting fixed and you're SOL.



The first computer I ever built, in 2003, is still alive and chugging today.. an AMD Athlon XP 2000+, a 40GB Samsung hard drive, some basic Kingston RAM and a ECS motherboard. Mostly budget parts, all either made in China or Asia, as most things are now adays. Either I got lucky, or there is some quality control after all. It all depends on the company. Better companies usually have better quality control standards. Less reputable companies sell less-than-perfect merchandise so they can maximize profit.

It's a popular notion that all things made in China are sub-par, and that usually is the case.. but not always. Almost every single electronic component in the world is made in Asia, with the exception of Intel CPUs. If there was really such poor quality control, I doubt anything electronic would work. Not flaming, as you requested, just stating. Many Americans have a jaundiced view of Chinese made goods, but just because unskilled labor moved there and Americans lost jobs doesn't mean all products are inferior. It all depends on the parent company and how much they put into QC. Every assembly line has rejects and defects, the amount that make it to the consumer is dependent upon how good the company's quality control is.
Click to expand...

There is a different mind set in Asia, get the market first, fix mess later, look at Hyundai today compared to 10 yrs back
 
jpsika08

jpsika08

Well-Known Member
Based on what they said at the last World Distributors Convention for the car brand I import is that the 80's was for USA and Europe cars, 90's for Japanese, 00's Korean and now it's their turn, I visited the Shanghai Autoshow, now consider the biggest in the world, and every Chinese brand present had at least 16 different models, and intentions on renewing each of these in a two to three year time lapse; they even fabricate cars for all known brands in their local market so it's easy for them to grasp the latest technology.

Also, China has all the money in the world right now, they can invest in anything they want, for example, Geely which is one of their local brands bought Volvo, who knew something like this would ever happened, they even bought Hummer commercial division.

So, back to topic, they have a lot of money to invest in LED technology and do lots of research and development with it, maybe today they have driven their market and image in the wrong way, anyone says Chinese and it's like saying a bad word, as Sasquatch mentioned above, anyone said the same 10 years ago of the Korean brands (Hyundai and KIA) and today, they are full speed ahead to take on the automotive world in the next three years.
 
PIMPALA

PIMPALA

Well-Known Member
Keep in mind when you are looking at the pricing on alibaba and other wholesale sites, that there is an MOQ, and while many are low, you do not get bulk prices when you only order the minimum. in order for them to get anywhere sub $200 each, you have to purchase a dozen or more. want them for $150 each? get ready to buy 1,000 of them.

THATS why there are "middle men" who buy them, mark them up, and re-sell for a profit.


it only makes sense. there is absolutely NO reason to get mad or upset with a wholesaler buying from a manufacturer, then selling to a LFS, or another online vendor. almost every single product you purchase comes to you via a similar (or even longer) process.


the average person buying these lights would not only have the know-how, or even the want to purchase them from the manufacturer. they want to see them in person, play with the controller, and walk into a store, pay with a credit card or cash, then take them home and plug them in. if they dont work, they take them back to the LFS and exchange for another unit.


another reason for the mark up, is the risk, and return on investment. if someone orders 100 units at $150 each, they just shelled out $15,000 plus shipping costs, which add $20ish per unit. they then need to sell them for $250 plus shipping each in order to make it worth their time. they cant sell all the units at once, and have to sit there waiting for them to sell, and recoup their investment.

then the LFS has to pay $250 plus shipping to get them... they put them on the shelf, paying overhead and paying a sales staff to learn about the units, spend hours and hours every week answering question after question, the lights have to be on display so that people get interested... theres another investment. they take up shelf space, which is expensive. they spend a LOT of money keeping inventory in the store, and would need to sell the lights at $400-450 to make it worth their time.


i own a business, and have managed, and ran several retail stores, so i completely understand the process from start to finish.


and ive also always been a consumer, so i understand how you feel too. hope that sheds a little light on the subject (pun intended)
 
Jackalope

Jackalope

Member
lol like the pun though pimpala! ive done hvac work for 15 years recently retired from it. i started from the bottom on installs, tech, sales, lead tech, etc. so on and so forth. i completely understand what you are saying. although in hvac you can see 2 identical systems for 2500 bucks dif. the same pay rate people installing and the same purchase price from Ince Dist., and yet one company owner uses his work truck as his personal, and the other has a hummer with 10grand in accessories and doesnt even have a work truck. i been on both sides of the lines and yep, the reality is nothing much can be done about it except try for the best possible price.

created this thread for flaming and venting. i feel much better now. if a mod wants to lock it up for safe keeping by all means i think the thread has done its job.

Thank you all for shedding light and letting me vent. i get so frustrated sometimes!

Juan, im going to kill me some zombies now. my brother talked me into the newest map pack and omg!
 
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