Where are all the reefers
- Thread starter Basile
- Start date
Paul B
Well-Known Member
I think it also has a lot to do with all the bad luck people have in the hobby.
Many posts go something like this:
NEED HELP FAST
Please help.
I came home yesterday and I knew something was wrong, The cleaning
lady, who I later found out is not really a cleaning lady, or even a
lady for that matter, was spralled out on the couch next to my dog, who
was dead, the dog, not the lady. OMG I quickly ran to my reef tank but
tripped over something, it was my cat, also dead.
When I finally got to the tank the lights were on, but very dim. I
realized the tank was dim because my new ORP controller that was behind
the tank, was on fire.
I quickly put out the fire and pulled the chain to put on the tank
lights. At first all seemed well but then I smelled something. I
sniffed around the tank but could not find the problem, then I noticed
the cleaning "lady" was standing behind me, with the cat.
The cleaning lady doesn't speak English, or any language that I could
tell, but in sign language she explained to me that my wife ran away
with Sam. Sam is our butcher, but my wife is a vegetarian.
Now it seemed that the only good thing was my reef tank so I got
comfortable in front of the tank and called for my other dog, "Lucky".
Lucky took a long time coming to me because lucky was born with only
one leg. And for some reason that leg always points north, no matter
which way Lucky is facing, that leg points north. As Lucky ran towards
me I heard that satisfying sound of his paw on the hardwood floor, "Ker
plunk" "Ker plunk" "Ker plunk".
He has a few other, not so serious health problems but he is a loving
pet. Lucky sat with me watching the tank. He sits with his back to
the tank because Lucky only has one eye, and it faces backward.
As me and Lucky were watching the tank, I noticed that my mandarin
seemed to be eating more pods than usual. I found this odd because
there are no pods in my tank. On closer inspection I noticed that they
were not pods, but lice. I then realized that the cleaning lady, who
has hair down to her knees which it is always wet, must have washed her
hair in the tank.
This cleaning lady came to us about 6 weeks ago, at first I thought she
was an envirnmentalist because she had three shopping carts with her,
filled to the brim with plastic bottles and cans. When I opened the
door the first thing I noticed was that she had on her right foot this
really beautiful Yves St Laurent high heel shoe. On her left foot was
a timberland boot. The Timberland boot had this sticky substance
oozing from the underside but I won't go into that right now.
I asked her if she knew anything about reef tanks, calcium reactors,
oxygenators, protein skimmers etc.
She nodded to all my questions so I invited her in. I quickly learned
she had this crick in her neck and nods constantly. As a matter of
fact, that is the only movement she can make above her waist. She
doesn't really have a waist but you get the idea.
Anyway I don't want to stray from my tank problem. As I said, the
mandarin was eating, lice, but he seemed to enjoy them. I searched for
the other tank inhabitants and noticed my two hermit crabs. One was
laying on his side, obviousely in distress. I put on my reading
glasses and took a closer look. He has varicose veins and probably a
little osteoporosis. The other crab seems fine and was sitting on a
roll of pennies. I wondered where the pennies came from until I saw a
wad of rolled up twenty dollar bills under the anemone, (who was dead)
The bills had a pink rubber band around them and I realized they were
from my dresser. The cleaning lady was probably stealing money from me
and hiding it in the tank. I was born at night, but not last night. I
put two and two together and figured that this cleaning lady might have
a problem.
Anyway, this is how many posts go on these fish forums. Can't we get
some happy posts like:
Yesterday Claudia Schiffer came to my door, she heard I have a reef
tank and just loves reef tanks, she also loves to clean and cook and
she owns a yacht.
Thats the type of posts I want to hear about.
Many posts go something like this:
NEED HELP FAST
Please help.
I came home yesterday and I knew something was wrong, The cleaning
lady, who I later found out is not really a cleaning lady, or even a
lady for that matter, was spralled out on the couch next to my dog, who
was dead, the dog, not the lady. OMG I quickly ran to my reef tank but
tripped over something, it was my cat, also dead.
When I finally got to the tank the lights were on, but very dim. I
realized the tank was dim because my new ORP controller that was behind
the tank, was on fire.
I quickly put out the fire and pulled the chain to put on the tank
lights. At first all seemed well but then I smelled something. I
sniffed around the tank but could not find the problem, then I noticed
the cleaning "lady" was standing behind me, with the cat.
The cleaning lady doesn't speak English, or any language that I could
tell, but in sign language she explained to me that my wife ran away
with Sam. Sam is our butcher, but my wife is a vegetarian.
Now it seemed that the only good thing was my reef tank so I got
comfortable in front of the tank and called for my other dog, "Lucky".
Lucky took a long time coming to me because lucky was born with only
one leg. And for some reason that leg always points north, no matter
which way Lucky is facing, that leg points north. As Lucky ran towards
me I heard that satisfying sound of his paw on the hardwood floor, "Ker
plunk" "Ker plunk" "Ker plunk".
He has a few other, not so serious health problems but he is a loving
pet. Lucky sat with me watching the tank. He sits with his back to
the tank because Lucky only has one eye, and it faces backward.
As me and Lucky were watching the tank, I noticed that my mandarin
seemed to be eating more pods than usual. I found this odd because
there are no pods in my tank. On closer inspection I noticed that they
were not pods, but lice. I then realized that the cleaning lady, who
has hair down to her knees which it is always wet, must have washed her
hair in the tank.
This cleaning lady came to us about 6 weeks ago, at first I thought she
was an envirnmentalist because she had three shopping carts with her,
filled to the brim with plastic bottles and cans. When I opened the
door the first thing I noticed was that she had on her right foot this
really beautiful Yves St Laurent high heel shoe. On her left foot was
a timberland boot. The Timberland boot had this sticky substance
oozing from the underside but I won't go into that right now.
I asked her if she knew anything about reef tanks, calcium reactors,
oxygenators, protein skimmers etc.
She nodded to all my questions so I invited her in. I quickly learned
she had this crick in her neck and nods constantly. As a matter of
fact, that is the only movement she can make above her waist. She
doesn't really have a waist but you get the idea.
Anyway I don't want to stray from my tank problem. As I said, the
mandarin was eating, lice, but he seemed to enjoy them. I searched for
the other tank inhabitants and noticed my two hermit crabs. One was
laying on his side, obviousely in distress. I put on my reading
glasses and took a closer look. He has varicose veins and probably a
little osteoporosis. The other crab seems fine and was sitting on a
roll of pennies. I wondered where the pennies came from until I saw a
wad of rolled up twenty dollar bills under the anemone, (who was dead)
The bills had a pink rubber band around them and I realized they were
from my dresser. The cleaning lady was probably stealing money from me
and hiding it in the tank. I was born at night, but not last night. I
put two and two together and figured that this cleaning lady might have
a problem.
Anyway, this is how many posts go on these fish forums. Can't we get
some happy posts like:
Yesterday Claudia Schiffer came to my door, she heard I have a reef
tank and just loves reef tanks, she also loves to clean and cook and
she owns a yacht.
Thats the type of posts I want to hear about.
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
Awesome, Paul! I’d say this is roughly accurate!
Many people come here to post about some problem or other. Typically, they do so way past the point when it was possible to do something about it, assuming it ever was. Then we never hear from them again. I assume things typically went badly and they really only wanted help with their one problem.
That’s kind of the way of things and I don’t have a problem with that per se, but we also have many fewer people starting tank threads and excited to share about their building tank and engaging the community. That’s where those positive posts you are looking for come from.
On a positive note, I have an awesome new flame angel and my raccoon butterfly is doing well after Ich treatment. I’ll post on that later. I didn’t want to jinx it by declaring victory early.
Paul B
Well-Known Member
Thats great Pat. I can't think of things to post because I don't have problems and I never battle anything except sometimes my Grand Kids.
I could say my 26 year old fireclown spawned again, but that is boreing or my hermit crab just got his first social security check.
If I was still having problems after all these years I may as well just pack it in. All the problems in this hobby now have solutions but many Noobs feel they are the only one with that problem and get 497 different things to do to correct something that they perceive as a problem.
Geezers know how to avoid all of those things because we invented those problems and got tired of fighting them so we solved them.
As I read many posts I feel like that stuff has been done to death so many times, but then I think of myself at the beginning and I feel sorry for these people. It is much harder now because after Briant Gumbal invented the internet there is such an enormous influx of mostly wrong information that it is mind boggling and I hate to have my mind boggled. Some of the advice is just ridiculous but people don't have much else to go on. In the beginning there was no internet or computers (Myley Cyrus, credit cards, Mp3 players, game box, color TV, stereo, Lady GaGa, reality TV, Toyota Camry's, LRSs, I Phones, I Max movies, RAP music, etc.)
Look at a hair algae thread. It's unbelievable the things people do to try to "cure" something that is not a disease and grows on every reef in the sea. Sea hares, slugs, algae bleenies, hydrogen peroxide, change the water, then change it again and again, offer chicken bones to the moon etc. Do any of those things work? Except for the bone thing, no! But we keep doing it in the hope that it works.
The next thing we see is one of those "Getting out of the hobby" threads which is a shame.
I could say my 26 year old fireclown spawned again, but that is boreing or my hermit crab just got his first social security check.
If I was still having problems after all these years I may as well just pack it in. All the problems in this hobby now have solutions but many Noobs feel they are the only one with that problem and get 497 different things to do to correct something that they perceive as a problem.
Geezers know how to avoid all of those things because we invented those problems and got tired of fighting them so we solved them.
As I read many posts I feel like that stuff has been done to death so many times, but then I think of myself at the beginning and I feel sorry for these people. It is much harder now because after Briant Gumbal invented the internet there is such an enormous influx of mostly wrong information that it is mind boggling and I hate to have my mind boggled. Some of the advice is just ridiculous but people don't have much else to go on. In the beginning there was no internet or computers (Myley Cyrus, credit cards, Mp3 players, game box, color TV, stereo, Lady GaGa, reality TV, Toyota Camry's, LRSs, I Phones, I Max movies, RAP music, etc.)
Look at a hair algae thread. It's unbelievable the things people do to try to "cure" something that is not a disease and grows on every reef in the sea. Sea hares, slugs, algae bleenies, hydrogen peroxide, change the water, then change it again and again, offer chicken bones to the moon etc. Do any of those things work? Except for the bone thing, no! But we keep doing it in the hope that it works.
The next thing we see is one of those "Getting out of the hobby" threads which is a shame.
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
Thats great Pat. I can't think of things to post because I don't have problems and I never battle anything except sometimes my Grand Kids.
I could say my 26 year old fireclown spawned again, but that is boreing or my hermit crab just got his first social security check.
If I was still having problems after all these years I may as well just pack it in. All the problems in this hobby now have solutions but many Noobs feel they are the only one with that problem and get 497 different things to do to correct something that they perceive as a problem.
Geezers know how to avoid all of those things because we invented those problems and got tired of fighting them so we solved them.
As I read many posts I feel like that stuff has been done to death so many times, but then I think of myself at the beginning and I feel sorry for these people. It is much harder now because after Briant Gumbal invented the internet there is such an enormous influx of mostly wrong information that it is mind boggling and I hate to have my mind boggled. Some of the advice is just ridiculous but people don't have much else to go on. In the beginning there was no internet or computers (Myley Cyrus, credit cards, Mp3 players, game box, color TV, stereo, Lady GaGa, reality TV, Toyota Camry's, LRSs, I Phones, I Max movies, RAP music, etc.)
Look at a hair algae thread. It's unbelievable the things people do to try to "cure" something that is not a disease and grows on every reef in the sea. Sea hares, slugs, algae bleenies, hydrogen peroxide, change the water, then change it again and again, offer chicken bones to the moon etc. Do any of those things work? Except for the bone thing, no! But we keep doing it in the hope that it works.
The next thing we see is one of those "Getting out of the hobby" threads which is a shame.
It definitely gets highly repetitive. As I read posts about some of these "problems" they are basically the same posts other people posted 10 years ago. Probably more, but the internet and fish forums only goes back so far.
I like hearing about your grandkids.
My kids are really into helping me with my fish, which makes everything about 10 times harder.
They also dropped a pretty sizeable yellow car down one of my heat vents this week along with a blue ball. This particular heat vent makes a 90 degree turn and then goes down pretty fast. I couldn't reach the car or the ball with my arm.
So, I bought an endoscope. I can see both the car and the ball...out of my reach.
I took my wife's 12" prongs out of her kitchen (for which I'm going to be in trouble later) and managed to get the ball out, but the car is about 2" too far still.
I'm trying to come up with a better solution. I may just have to order 16" prongs and hope that gets it. My wife doesn't have any, but I'm sure she appreciates me rummaging through the kitchen and putting her tools in different places than she is used to.
Claudia Schiffer hasn't shown up at my doorstep with a pair of 16" prongs to pull the car out, but if she does I'll let you know.
StirCrayzy
Well-Known Member
I wish it was RedSea Sales that could be blamed. That would be easy, but i think many of us just lose free time as we arent just retired and going to have adventures visiting supermodel Drs and what not. If i had time to type out my daily adventures i would, but alas i am in the shame filled majority who can barely keep up with my own tank and kids, much less keep anyone else up on the goings on here in the salty midwest mitten.
I do vow this year to be more active though because i miss the comaraderie we all share. Plus if i keep posting updates to my own thread, its a huge benefit to my aging memory trying to figure out what happened and when.
I do vow this year to be more active though because i miss the comaraderie we all share. Plus if i keep posting updates to my own thread, its a huge benefit to my aging memory trying to figure out what happened and when.
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
StirCrayzy
Well-Known Member
Paul, Everybody knows Al Gore invented the internet.
Paul B
Well-Known Member
Despite popular opinion us Geezers also did the "W" thing. Work. And we worked for enough years to get to the point to retire. We did Man work and no software engineers, whatever that is. We also had kids, college expenses, and needed to buy magazines with Supermodels on the cover, but we persevered.
I worked at my "last" job for 39 years, then the Army before that and another few years before that. I am talking before color TV years. Yes, at one time TV was black and white and if you wanted to watch one of the other 5 channels, you had to get up and turn the channel. Then you had to adjust the antenna and adjust the dial so the picture wouldn't roll and it fit the screen. Then you had to fiddle with the knob behind the tuner to get a semi clear picture. You did that every time you changed the station, but you didn't change it much because there was only one channel that was worth anything and you saw that already.
But we still had a tank. I remember air pumps, they were piston operated and the leather piston needed to be oiled every few days. The oil would get in the water and give you a realistic Exxon oil spill.
Powerheads were not submersible and we had no Sissy GFCIs either so we knew something was wrong when we found ourselves across the room with our underwear on fire. Those were the good old days when you had to be a Man to have a tank.
We stirred our sand with a cro bar and killed ich with a chain saw. I miss those days. Now we have a bunch of people asking things like "I have a red fish and a blue fish, but my girlfriend likes pink which will clash with those fish, what should I do? "
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
We stirred our sand with a cro bar and killed ich with a chain saw. I miss those days. Now we have a bunch of people asking things like "I have a red fish and a blue fish, but my girlfriend likes pink which will clash with those fish, what should I do? "
That is tough. Maybe if you got a sunken pink castle ruins that would help the pink fish blend. I dunno.
As I type this, my kids and I are looking at pictures of thomas the tank engine on the computer which they then like to print out on the laserjet color printer. That would be fine except color print ink costs roughly as much as a Red Sea tank and I think I'm blowing their college fund printing out pictures for them.
Plus, the laser printer prints out pictures really fast which means I can blow through color ink really fast.
I really need to get out of this room with the computers and printers before my kids put me in debt! Save me!
Soon, pictures of tanks will have devices and app's to fix tank problems visible in the pictures.
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
I think that would go with a pink fish...
Awesome, Paul! I’d say this is roughly accurate!
Many people come here to post about some problem or other. Typically, they do so way past the point when it was possible to do something about it, assuming it ever was. Then we never hear from them again. I assume things typically went badly and they really only wanted help with their one problem.
That’s kind of the way of things and I don’t have a problem with that per se, but we also have many fewer people starting tank threads and excited to share about their building tank and engaging the community. That’s where those positive posts you are looking for come from.
On a positive note, I have an awesome new flame angel and my raccoon butterfly is doing well after Ich treatment. I’ll post on that later. I didn’t want to jinx it by declaring victory early.
You bring up some excellent points. The time to post and get to know about reef systems is before you have a problem. As you point out, byu the time that first post is made, it's often too late.
I hate to think about the number of posts I've made about disease treatment, and algae control. The solutions have been more or lss the same for years, and are easily found. To some extent many people just want some hand holding to be sure they are doing the right thing. Others want a "miracle fix" that's easy, and don't seem to realize that success in reef systems comes from work and effort that goes into the system. There seldom are any quick fixes or easy solutions.
While I'm on a rant, I'll also mention equipment and live stock selection. Many post I've seen are in the form "I just got a SW tanks and ..." or "I just brought home this live stock and ...". By then if mistakes were made, they are going to be expensive and/or time consuming to correct.
The bottom line is that it's a lot easier to keep the system out of trouble than it is to get it out of trouble.
As for the raccoon butterfly, it's a great fish as long as you don't have any corals and the like. They are just about as indestructible as a SW fish can be.
Don't knock software engineers too much. I spent my entire carer doing computer programming and all. I did like the various jobs, but one overriding factor was that it was the only thing I knew that someone would pay me for. (grin)
As a "software expert" I can tell you that you have your printer set up incorrectly for this application. What you do is change the setting so that by default all such pictured are printed in gray scale. They you print one picture for each kid and tell them that they don't get a second picture until they color in the first picture. (grin) That way the colors come from an inexpensive box of crayons, which if you think about it, is about the same thing as printer ink.
Paul B
Well-Known Member
My computer is made out of wood and there is no software, I just crank it two or three times, pour in some ink and it's good to go.
Dave, you forgot to mention the posts that go like:
I just brought home a mandarin and it does not eat. I tried corn flakes, motza ball soup, hamburger helper and baked Alaska. He just refuses all food. I also bought a pod to see if it entices him but nothing so far. Should I dose hydrogen sulfide or use hypo?
Dave, you forgot to mention the posts that go like:
I just brought home a mandarin and it does not eat. I tried corn flakes, motza ball soup, hamburger helper and baked Alaska. He just refuses all food. I also bought a pod to see if it entices him but nothing so far. Should I dose hydrogen sulfide or use hypo?
Pat24601
Well-Known Member
Absolutely. As with many problems in life, the real trick is not to be in the situation to begin with by doing research and acting accordingly.
Not that I don’t still make mistakes, but when I do it’s usually because I knew the Risk and took it anyway or just bumbled into something because I didn’t know to research it.
I had a friend that got into saltwater and I thought it would be a lot fun because one more person to talk to. Then he just bought whatever livestock he thought looked cool and I was like “Dude, everything you just bought is going to be dead in a month.”
He was out of the hobby within 6 months when really if he’d just started off right he probably would have enjoyed it.
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My computer is made out of wood and there is no software, I just crank it two or three times, pour in some ink and it's good to go.
Dave, you forgot to mention the posts that go like:
I just brought home a mandarin and it does not eat. I tried corn flakes, motza ball soup, hamburger helper and baked Alaska. He just refuses all food. I also bought a pod to see if it entices him but nothing so far. Should I dose hydrogen sulfide or use hypo?
I had a wood computer once. It was called a slide rule. Considering how simple the device is, it's amazing what you can do with one. I gave it to my younger nephew once he started working for a famous brand computer store that uses a logo of a fruit with a bite out of it. This way he'll maintain a sense of perspective of all the computer stuff.
You sure got that right about mandarin's too. Way too many people still buy livestock with out checking up on the requirements first. You'd think that with smart phones and all today that everyone would look up anything they are in doubt about. One think I find really ironic is that all those colors on a mandarin all work to help it blend into the background. In my reef system a mandarin will blend right in and unless you know what your looking for, it can be hard to find. Regretfully I don't have one at the moment.