Super High Alkalinity

rjryerson

New Member
Well I had a boo boo on Sunday: Read a test wrong and super elevated the Alk. Which has killed the snails and crabs and all the pods, worms and dusters. (no fish, corals, etc in tank at the time, or now)

It made the pH drop to 7.4 (from avg 8.0) and precipitated calcium on the glass, rocks, pumps and such.

We did a 80% water change that same day and removed all dead inhabitants we could.

pH has gradually risen to 8.17 today, and I feel it's going to go super nova in the next week or so.

How can I get the Alk down? I thought that adding vinegar would do it, but reading several articles it seems that in the end, vinegar would increase (or maintain) the carbonate; net effect, no change in Alk.

I normally dose Kalkwasser, but don't want to with the Alk in the state it's in, as that would add to the Alk problem. We tried Kent Marine Super Buffer as the Alk was generally really low. (And here is the start of the problem, but reading the test wrong was the reason and dosing too much)

Current readings today are:

Water Density: 1.024
Salinity: 35 ppt
pH 8.17 (rising both day and night)
Temp: 83° F / 28.3° C
Ca: 60 ppm (due to precipitation)
Alk: 26 meq/L (73 dKH) 8 times target value
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate 40-50 ppm
(Sorry no Mg as I am out of tests, can assume to be low)

Alk test had to be continued with 5 ml of KH reagent as the first 4 showed no change, thus dKH was calculated (5-remaining amount) * 16 (16 dKH is the max value for 1 ml of reagent)

If this method is wrong, one can assume the Alk is AT LEAST 16 dKH / 5.7 meq/L

System (4 years old):
10 Gallon Nano (6-7 gallon net)
7 lbs Live Rock
10 lbs Live Sand
Prizm Skimmer
Basic filter loading with floss and carbon
96w 50/50 PC (10,000K & Atinic) on for 8 hours / day.

The test kits I use are Saliferts, brand new, and tested against know solutions.

What can I do about the Alk? Nothing is a viable option as long as it's a reasonable time line, as I'd like to get this corrected.

Best regards,

Rick
 

Cassette87

Well-Known Member
waterchanges and dose calcium.. while testing calc/alk levels i'd say, but this is slightly above me.. as i've never had this happen.. hopefully someone else can chime in..?
 

Tru2nr

Well-Known Member
ok i had a problem with alk...i had a 17dkh with everything still living what i did was dose calcium every other day and i did a 20%water change everyday for one week straight and after i added the new water i would dose the tank with cycle for the amount of water i added into the tank after that i was running around a 10dkh and a 450ppm calc level...my mushrooms,clownfish,orange prawn goby all survived the bombarding of water changes...this is my suggestion only cuz it worked for me but as we all know what works for one doesn't work for another
 

althea2you

Active Member
i am no pro by any means... but the higher your calciium.. the loewer your alk... but definitly do 100%WC and wait a bit to see where its at.....if still high, then maybe do your calcium dosing to see if that will help level it out... its a fine balance between the alk/calc. gl! i hope you can fix this soon!
 

Jason25

Active Member
Just a few other questions I have.

2. Why is your temp 83? That's high
3. Nitrates are very high do you know why?
 

JoJo

Active Member
I'm just starting to learn about the chemistry of reefs so i cant give any input but I wish you the best of luck buddy.
 

kitkamoose23

New Member
i have a freind that had his alk up to 20dkh he didnt have anything die i know that the inverts you have to be carfull with ph thats most likely what killed them all as far as the alk it just came down over time
 

prow

Well-Known Member
Well I had a boo boo on Sunday: Read a test wrong and super elevated the Alk. Which has killed the snails and crabs and all the pods, worms and dusters. (no fish, corals, etc in tank at the time, or now)
sorry to hear that, but hey at least it happend now and not after you have fully stocked reef.

It made the pH drop to 7.4 (from avg 8.0) and precipitated calcium on the glass, rocks, pumps and such.
humm 7.4, it was not high alk levels that did this, perhaps a supressed Ca level??

We did a 80% water change that same day and removed all dead inhabitants we could.
adding some good quailty carbon like black diamond or SeaChems matrix carbon.

pH has gradually risen to 8.17 today, and I feel it's going to go super nova in the next week or so.
what about you Ca+ levels??

How can I get the Alk down? I thought that adding vinegar would do it, but reading several articles it seems that in the end, vinegar would increase (or maintain) the carbonate; net effect, no change in Alk.
yeah not vinegar that mainly effects H+ =ph not alk.

I normally dose Kalkwasser, but don't want to with the Alk in the state it's in, as that would add to the Alk problem. We tried Kent Marine Super Buffer as the Alk was generally really low. (And here is the start of the problem, but reading the test wrong was the reason and dosing too much)
its not the alk its your Ca+

Current readings today are:

Water Density: 1.024
Salinity: 35 ppt
pH 8.17 (rising both day and night)
Temp: 83° F / 28.3° C
Ca: 60 ppm (due to precipitation)
Alk: 26 meq/L (73 dKH) 8 times target value
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate 40-50 ppm
(Sorry no Mg as I am out of tests, can assume to be low)

Alk test had to be continued with 5 ml of KH reagent as the first 4 showed no change, thus dKH was calculated (5-remaining amount) * 16 (16 dKH is the max value for 1 ml of reagent)
yup, its your Ca+ that is too low not that your alk is too high that cause all the fuss. many run into this. you see a lowering of ph due to metabolic activity uptaking of O2 or excessive CO2 trapping from inadequate gas exchange and add buffer to correct it, but it was not a low alk causeing the ph to drop, and you end up suppressing Ca levels droping the ph dropped along with it, your tank is a attempt to compensate. but, by adding buffer it only made things worse and your Ca and Alk get more out of balance.

here this should help you understand whats going on and how to fix it. your issue falls into zone 3, i believe:D
Chemistry and the Aquarium

here is a little more on balancing Ca and alk. here you will see why all that precipitate occured.
Calcium and Alkalinity by Randy Holmes-Farley - Reefkeeping.com



If this method is wrong, one can assume the Alk is AT LEAST 16 dKH / 5.7 meq/L

System (4 years old):
10 Gallon Nano (6-7 gallon net)
7 lbs Live Rock
10 lbs Live Sand
Prizm Skimmer
Basic filter loading with floss and carbon
96w 50/50 PC (10,000K & Atinic) on for 8 hours / day.

The test kits I use are Saliferts, brand new, and tested against know solutions.

What can I do about the Alk? Nothing is a viable option as long as it's a reasonable time line, as I'd like to get this corrected.

Best regards,

Rick
if its 5.7meq. high yes but not bad. no need to do big water changes, IMO, adding some CaCl will bring your Ca/alk and ph back inline:thumbup: careful though while you add Ca it and the alk will get used, so more will be needed then calculators will indicate. you will need to watch both Ca and alk and keep them balanced. read the links:D now doing the water changes to deal with all the die off for sure, limiting lighting right now will help with algae that will grow in a effort to compensate for your lower ph:)
 
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