Nitrate Test results driving me nuts

[newsalt]

Recently I posted several threads on my high nitrate problem. Today, I took another reading. This time I used two different kits. I used Mardel Strips and Aquarium Pharmaceuticals drops/color chart. I get two very different results.

Using the Mardel strips, the reading is clearly 35-40ppm (closer to 40ppm). Using the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals kit, I get 15ppm, 20ppm at the most.

Why such varying results? I even had my wife look at the results and she agreed with what I mentioned above.

These test kits are driving me nuts. They're so inconsistant. Even with the Ammonia kit. Using Mardel, it is clearly 0ppm. With the AP kit it's closer to .01 or 0.2 ppm.

The only test that both kits agree on is Nitrite. Bothe read 0 ppm.

Do I have a water quality problem or not? My tank is FOWLR. I'm the only one worrying about these results. The fish seem fine. Always swimming around, no clamped fins or hanging around the surface gasping. I cut back on their feeding. I feed them 3 times a week, Mon., Wed., and Fri. They fast on Sat. and Sun. Is this a good idea? I do a 2 gallon water change every other week.

What kind of kits do you use?

I don't know what to do.

 

[EdgeKrusher]

Spend the money and get the Salifert test kits. They are the most Accurate kits, IMO, and worth every penny. They go for about $20 at most, but it's worth it to have a happy tank. Check our sponsors web sites and I'm sure you'll find them.

EK

 

[cheeks69]

with the bio-load you have on that 15gal I would probably lean towards the reading on the Mardel strips. I believe Salifert makes really good test kits and would give them a try. In the meantime I would go to LFS and have them test your water and see what kind of results you get. I would also definitely increase the amount in the water change and do it weekly instead of bi-weekly. Although a fish only tank can handle the higher nitrate level they will definitely be stressed and could become susceptible to disease. You have to remember that with a small tank with a heavy bio-load your really have to monitor the water quality.

 

[mwrager]

Originally posted by EdgeKrusher
Spend the money and get the Salifert test kits. They are the most Accurate kits, IMO, and worth every penny. They go for about $20 at most, but it's worth it to have a happy tank. Check our sponsors web sites and I'm sure you'll find them.

EK

They are the best IMO also.

 

[NaH2O]

Well, newsalt...I'll give ya a bump for now. I've been programmed for reef systems, so I'm not sure what level of nitrates is acceptable in FO or FOWLR systems. I can, however, comment on test kits. If reagents are bad or old, then your results will be bad, if the brand has been known to give poor results, then you'll see -well- poor results. I believe Salifert will be recommended by many as a reliable brand name. Hopefully, others will send some recommendations your way, too.

edit: guess I took too long to post this....so let me add: yeah, what everyone else said!

 

[Cougra]

As far as I've seen that's a common problem with the test kits available to us. I personally use Hagen test kits and they have corrective colour charts for freshwater or saltwater depending on which the test is done with, is there a similar correction chart with you test kits?

I also haven't had good results from test strips in the past. I found that they were way off.

Another possible explaination would be the expirery date in the liqud regent test kit. The strips have a longer shelf life but the regents I find a slightly more accurate.

Salifert has the best reputation when it comes to test kits if that's available to you, you may wish to pick one up or try to get the LFS to test your water for you to see if they match either of your results.

 

[EdgeKrusher]

This may help. I have a 12gallon reef. I have to do weekly water changes in the 25% range or else things start going bad. I stress that you do weekly water changes. it's more work, but then we have smaller tanks, and are working with alot less room for error.

EK

 

[cheeks69]

Originally posted by newsalt
I cut back on their feeding. I feed them 3 times a week, Mon., Wed., and Fri. They fast on Sat. and Sun. Is this a good idea? I do a 2 gallon water change every other week.

I would feed every other day or maybe every 2 days. your fish will be fine especially the Coral beauty, they graze on the Micro-algea that grows naturally on the LR, although you don't alot of LR but it should be enough to get him by. Also to reiterate if you want to do something about your nitrates you really have to increase your water changes like others have mentioned at least 25% every week to get those nitrates down, a 2 gal water change every other week is just not even close to what you need JMHO

 

[fidojoe]

EK, is right, weekly water changes would help.

As for the test kits, salifert is great, and I've also heard good things about seachem (I beleive it was). The Aquarium Pharm. kits suck, and the test strips are usualy only good for a general range of the water params.

I used to have an Aquarium Pharm. kit, and never got a nitrate reading other than 20 ppm. I now have a Marine Master salt water test center kit, and the LFS owner says that it is the same reagents as salifert.

 

[Craig Manoukian]

Originally posted by EdgeKrusher
This may help. I have a 12gallon reef. I have to do weekly water changes in the 25% range or else things start going bad. EK

Bingo! The solution for pollution is dillution! Export some of that bad stuff out and dilute the rest! EK hit the nail on the head!

:smirk:

 

[newsalt]

Update on my different test results:

I finally received my Salifert test kits. With the new kit, my Nitrate reading was in the area of 15ppm. The Nitrite reading was the same, 0ppm and the Ammonia reading was <0.5ppm. The Salifert color scale for ammonia just has a reading of "<0.5ppm" not 0ppm for the lowest reading.

So, if I'm to trust the Salifert test over others, I guess my nitrates are not as bad as I thought. I still can't figure why my snails and hermits are dying. I use RO water, IO salt and Nitrates seem ok with the new kit. Maybe they're starving. What can I feed them if there is not enough "stuff" for them to eat?

 

[Pro_builder]

Have you tested for Iodine? If I remember right I think Iodine will cause problems with snails, if it is high concentrations in your water. Just a thought, hopefully someone will chime in that knows a little more about this.
Also, are you running a skimmer? Skimmers usually take out the Iodine on a regular basis.

 

[wooddood]

i agree on the salifert test kits they are good,i also agree with ek you have a smaller tank there fore less room for error.

 

[Cougra]

Originally posted by newsalt
So, if I'm to trust the Salifert test over others, I guess my nitrates are not as bad as I thought. I still can't figure why my snails and hermits are dying. I use RO water, IO salt and Nitrates seem ok with the new kit. Maybe they're starving. What can I feed them if there is not enough "stuff" for them to eat?

How do you acclimatize your snails and hermits? How long haveyou had them in the tank before they start to die? Are you hermits killing the snails?

One of the most common problems with introducing inverts to a new tank is improper acclimatization. INverts do not tollerate changes in water parameters very well and even the slight fluctuations in the water they came from to the water they are going in could be too much stress on them.

Even if the water they are in to begin with is bad and you are introducing them to what should be ideal parameters, the change needs to be done slowly. It's possible some people kill through kindness.

Try a slower acclimatization process should you get any more snails or hermits in the tank.


IF the snails have been in the tank for over a month and suddenly die, Iwould look to other contaminants being introduced to the tank through feeding, or air pollution. Have you changed anything in the air at you house? Used a new cleaning product? Burnt new incence or scented candles in the same room as the tank?

I highly doubt lack of food would be the case. In the wild these animals need to scavenge for thier food, in a tank there is more algae and organic matter they eat that we can't see then we realise.

 

[newsalt]

I know that acclimation is probably my first problem. With the last batch of snails, I acclimated them using the drip method for 1/2 hour. Then, I read that some people acclimate them for 4 hours. I'm going to do that with my next batch.

The snails die off after about two weeks, hermits seem to last a bit longer. I don't think it's the hermits killing the snails either. In all my attempts to keep snails and hermits, I've only seen one hermit with a new shell. There also has been no changes in the room environment.

One other thing I've read about is the SG of the water. Mine has been in the area of 1.022. I've been told it needs to be higher, like 1.025. I've been slowing raising it during my water changes. It's around 1.0235 now.

So, I this raising the SG and acclimating longer should help me out. I'll give another try and pick a few more snails maybe later this week.

 

[NaH2O]

Has the tank ever been treated with anything containing copper? Just a thought.

 

[Craig Manoukian]

Are you using a refractometer or a swing arm hyrometer to measure SG? There can be quite som e diffference and you can be off by .02 or .03 with a swing arm hydrometer.

:smirk:

 

[Cougra]

Newsalt

Yes the SG you keep your tank at could be a big part of the problem along with the speed of acclimatization. Snails, actually inverts in general, have very limited abilities to regulate the amounts of salts in thier bodies (osmoregulation) They depend on thier environment to have a salinity level very near that in which the need to survive, otherwise they expend a lot of energy attempting to maintain the salt levels within their body and can't keep up with the process.

When they are put into water that has lower concentrations of salts then what's in thier bodies, the salt content in the inverts body will be diulted and extra water entering the body can cause a lot of damage to the invert.

When it is slowly acclimatized, the invert has more of a change to be able to alter thier body chemistry to expel the extra salts in thier body to match that of thier new environment. The more difference there is in salinity the longer acclimatization should take.

Animals that are lost within the first month or so most likely die from some kind of shock that can be caused by different SG levels, pH shock, drastic difference in nitrAte levels, ammonia poisoning, or nitrIte poisoning caused from the facilities that they were held in, or how they were transported.

 

[Cougra]

Originally posted by Craig Manoukian
Are you using a refractometer or a swing arm hyrometer to measure SG? There can be quite som e diffference and you can be off by .02 or .03 with a swing arm hydrometer.

:smirk:

Granted a swing arm hydrometer can be off by a lot and it is important to know this.

However, if you measure the water that the animals come in and the water that you will be putting them in with the same peice of equipment, you will still be able to compare the difference in environments the animals will be kept in and be able to judge how much to acclimatize them from there.

 

[Craig Manoukian]

Originally posted by Cougra
if you measure the water that the animals come in and the water that you will be putting them in with the same peice of equipment, you will still be able to compare the difference in environments the animals will be kept in and be able to judge how much to acclimatize them from there.

Good point Michelle!

Just a point of clarification, if you measure the water the inverts come in and balance your system to the same reading you could still be points away from the ideal environment for long-term well being. (ie. a swing arm reading of 1.025 on both water samples could really be 1.023).

:smirk: