Nitrate hit zero using NO3PO4-X

[Reef Gypsy]

Hey



Can any one tell me what I need to do to get my Nitrate back up to 0.25?

I have a deep sand bed as well which I am guessing has also helped make me hit zero Nitrate 0 My phosphate is at 0.04 both tested with the red sea test kits.. and I have had same results both days 3 days apart of testing.



I have halved the dose of No3Po4-X to 2mls a day



I estimate with my sand and rocks I have about 200liters left in my red sea max250



I dose reef energy A & B 2mls each night at lights out and skimmer off for 30mins & I feed my fish twice a day..



please help I have an outbreak of cyano and my corals wont be happy

cheers

 

[theplantman]

You don't want nitrate at .25, 0 is ideal unless you are keeping something that needs really dirty water. You cyano outbreak is most likely being caused by your phosphate level at .4 which is high. You need to do some hefty water changes, not sure how you are filtering your tank but if its a canister or media floss or socks in a sump, clean them thoroughly.

Try reducing your lighting to 4hrs per day for a week or go lights out for a day or two.
Check your feeding levels, that phosphate reading is high and certain foods can contribute heavily to a phosphate issue.
Once you get the levels down you can try running GFO in a reactor if it is a continuous problem .

Good Luck

 

[goma]

Agree with the above, you need to reduce phosphates as cyano is caused by excess nutrients. Large water changes and running GFO can both help.

 

[DianaKay]

I don't know what to tell you about dosing & my phosphate are higher than yours (my nitrates test 0) ....but they aren't causing any obvious problems in my tank YET. Trying to get it down as best I can until my Lifereef sump gets built & I have more options.
I've had cyano outbreaks a couple of times and I give full credit to my MP10 & getting the dead flow spots.
I added a spin-flo device on my #1 return flow nozzle also. Keep the water moving & cut back on any food that could be getting trap in low flow areas. That might help your issues, IMO.

 

[Reef Gypsy]

hey sorry I put phosphate in wrong its 0.04 on the redsea phosphate pro test kit
apparently you have to have higher nitrate then 0?

 

[theplantman]

That's better on the phosphate, my guess is you are experiencing possible flow issues, I would still try to get that phosphate down though. You do not have to have nitrate above 0 that I am aware of unless it has something to do with the products you are dosing and them functioning properly. Every reefer I have ever known wants those puppies at 0 especially if they are keeping SPS corals.

 

[goma]

You could also cut back the Reef Energy to every other day and see if that helps. Are you sucking up the Cyano when you do water changes?

 

[Reef Gypsy]

hey thanks for the replies
My flow seem good maybe this is some issue I will have to look into I am only using the stock pumps still, I do have some sps I am following the redsea reef care program which in the NO3/PO4 management manual it says not to drop the nitrate to zero, and it tells me I want phosphate at 0.02 and to half the dose of no3po4-x which I have, bit confused at moment

 

[theplantman]

I think I have heard about that before with the Red Sea Program. I do not know enough about it to comment. If you go to the ask red sea thread, they are very good about responding to questions.

http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/red-sea/37228-ask-red-sea.html

 

[KarlyBoy]

.25 Nitrate is ideal for SPS/LPS, no N03 at all is not, most Corals need some level of Nitrates, Randy Holmes Farley has an excellent Essay on this

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2003/8/chemistry

 

[RedSeaKev]

hey thanks for the replies
My flow seem good maybe this is some issue I will have to look into I am only using the stock pumps still, I do have some sps I am following the redsea reef care program which in the NO3/PO4 management manual it says not to drop the nitrate to zero, and it tells me I want phosphate at 0.02 and to half the dose of no3po4-x which I have, bit confused at moment

Hi Reef Gypsy, I seem to be following the same questions from you all over the world on different forums.

Nitrate is your main guidance for dosing No3Po4-X you need to reduce yours, for your 200 litre system from memory drop the dosage to 0.5ml total so a dosage of 0.25ml per 100 litres.

For clarity for those dosing Reef Energy, the lower the No3 content the more Reef Energy needs to be dosed, not less, check out the Reef Care Videos here http://www.redseafish.com/index.aspx?id=4341 it explains in depth the association between Nitrate and Energy ( Nutrition)

Reef Energy will not increase No3 content unless massively over dosed, there is evidence that zero No3 can lead to the outbreak of Cyano so getting some No3 back into your system is important.

 

[KarlyBoy]

Hi Reef Gypsy, I seem to be following the same questions from you all over the world on different forums.

Nitrate is your main guidance for dosing No3Po4-X you need to reduce yours, for your 200 litre system from memory drop the dosage to 0.5ml total so a dosage of 0.25ml per 100 litres.

For clarity for those dosing Reef Energy, the lower the No3 content the more Reef Energy needs to be dosed, not less, check out the Reef Care Videos here http://www.redseafish.com/index.aspx?id=4341 it explains in depth the association between Nitrate and Energy ( Nutrition)

Reef Energy will not increase No3 content unless massively over dosed, there is evidence that zero No3 can lead to the outbreak of Cyano so getting some No3 back into your system is important.

+1 to Kev on this one.

 

[Reef Gypsy]

hello redseakev
oh yes you do put up with a lot from me
I do post all over the place sorry about that! I am looking for answers to sort of back up what I hope is the right thing
thanks so much for your answers though!
I am following your instructions

 

[Reef Gypsy]

Hello
So todays results are
Nitrate 0 redsea
phosphate 0.4 redsea
phosphate 0.6 hanna
phosphorus 15ppb / 0,015ppm hanna
No change really
I have been dosing 0.5ml daily NO3PO4-X
4 mls each of Energy A&B so in total mix together 8mls
Im also feeding slightly more as ive added 2 more fish
only change I am noticing is more cyano on the sand bed
I cleaned both return pumps so the flow is improved,
what should my next step be?
cheers

 

[Reef Gypsy]

Next test are more promising



Nitrate showed some grey leading me to think it was 0.25 now or just below

and my phosphate was 0.08



I still dosed 0.5ml NO3PO4X today

But the cyano has got even worse the sand is coverd now

 

[SenseiSays]

I've had the same problem and just gave up on it, not using NOPOX anymore and just doing CPE with Purigen. I've had a ton of algae ever since using NOPOX and was supposedly "nutrient release" but its been "releasing" for over a month now. It sounded promising and others seem to have a great time with NOPOX, hope it works good for you and good luck!

 

[theplantman]

Next test are more promising



Nitrate showed some grey leading me to think it was 0.25 now or just below

and my phosphate was 0.08



I still dosed 0.5ml NO3PO4X today

But the cyano has got even worse the sand is coverd now

Not sure what others would think, but if it were me, I would vacuum out what I could and then go lights out for a few days.

 

[tangers]

I've been dosing NOPOX as well and have come up against this same problem. Seems to be quite a common issue with carbon dosing and from what I understand is often related to Nirates coming down to zero a lot faster than the Phosphates the imbalance favours Cyano.

For me I was fighting a loosing battle. And after trying the standard methods reduce dosing, increase flow, reduce nutients, syphoning, I am now trying the ChemiClean route. Another method that works for some it seems is dosing Nitrate to try and restore the ratio of nitrate to phosphate (google redfield ratio cynobacteria).

Good luck

 

[RedSeaKev]

Hi Folks, No3Po4-X has proven to be very popular and there are many systems running very successfully dosing No3Po4-X, there are a few things that are very important when dosing and a few things that need some under standing.

We recommend the monitoring of the No3 with accurate No3 test kits like the Red Sea No3 Pro simply because a lot of No3 test kits cant not measure the very low levels of No3 that the Red Sea test can, ( 0.25 ppm to 4ppm in low range) the accurate measurement of No3 is critical.

It is very important to adjust the dosage as per the instructions in relation to No3 content, it is important not to drive the No3 levels to zero, this can lead to an outbreak of Cyano.

Protein skimmer efficiency plays a large part in the efficient removal of Po4 via PHB's (Phosphate Harboring Bactria) dying off and be extracted via the skimmer along with Cyano spores.

PHB cultures do not react or reproduce as quickly as those that control No3 levels and this is the reason why No3 monitoring is more important than Po4 when dosing No3Po4-X, giving time the No3 & Po4 levels will sync, systems where heavy feeding takes place will take longer to develop this sync between the No3 & Po4 levels.

Folks with systems that have a light bio-load may find in necessary to dose extremely small doses of No3Po4-X, for this we recommend diluting the No3Po4-X with 9 parts of R/O water (giving an active content of 0.1ml per 1ml of No3Po4-X) 1ml per 100 litres can then be dosed for very fine control of No3 content, this also works very well in low nutrient systems with those controlling No3 at 0.25ppm.

I am confident that once you have a stable No3 content in your system you will see the Cyano out breaks die back and not be an issue, this has now been proven in many systems that have experienced a Cyano outbreak.