Hair Algae?

mike1970

Active Member
I agree. all in one tank OK maybe for basic stuff softies fish only but in order to progress with the hobby thing will be needed to be added like sump/reactor dosing pumps it's just the way of the hobby. So your first tank all in one to learn with OK, but as you progress you will need things expensive things it's so sad :wah:
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
I agree. all in one tank OK maybe for basic stuff softies fish only but in order to progress with the hobby thing will be needed to be added like sump/reactor dosing pumps it's just the way of the hobby. So your first tank all in one to learn with OK, but as you progress you will need things expensive things it's so sad :wah:

I don't entirely agree with you. While all in one systems are a compromise design, to advance in the hobby, you do not necessarily need to spent a lot of money on additional equipment.

At one time I was always ready to spend money on the "latest and greatest" gear. Many time I found that it did make some improvement, but it often was a marginal improvement, and really not cost effective.

If you have good lighting, good filtration usually with a skimmer on larger tanks, and do the necessary general maintenance on the system, you will usually get excellent results.

There may be good reasons for adding additional equipment. It can often save you a lot of work, or monitor the system better. I'm not saying don't buy a lot of equipment. I am saying make sure your going to get a decent return for you investment. Be sure you really need it and that it will solve your problem.
 
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Trinny

Member
GFO in a reactor seems like the way to go, anyone know of a reactor that fits into the rear sump or a C250?
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
GFO reactors are typically sealed units not unlike a canister filter without the pump. You have a tube going in and another tube coming out.

You can mount it just about any place you would like to. I suggest choosing a place where it's easy to get to for service.
 

Trinny

Member
Thanks.

I ended up getting a small Reef Octopus reactor that fits in the rear sump. I'm running Bio Pellets in there at the moment to see how that goes and also while I track down the GFO options I have.


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Paul B

Well-Known Member
I know I am in the very vast minority, OK, no one will agree with me, :doh:but that's OK, and I never, never get involved in algae threads but it sure seems like you guys like to spend money. I have said it before and I will say it one last time. Nitrates, phosphates and phases of the moon do not cause algae, and eliminating those two things will not kill it. The main thing people do is change water. Does that ever help? No. It doesn't. If it did, there would be no algae. Interesting that it grows the most on brand new, no nutrient tanks. Odd isn't it? Will adding phosban or snake oil work? No it won't. Well I have never tried snake oil so I can't comment. But the algae will get bored eventually and disappear which is the reason that virtually anything you do, or do not do will at one point work. Search back over years and years of algae threads and look at all the remedies. Eventually, the algae disappeared weather you did all of those things, or none. :dunno:
My tank now probably has more nitrates and phosphates than all your tanks put together, but I have no algae except where I want it on the scrubber. Algae grows on every healthy reef, you just need to make friends with it and convince it to grow where you want it. 2 years ago I took this picture on one of the outer, remote Hawaiian Islands. It is hair algae. I think the Governor of Hawaii was taking up a collection to buy Phosban, Chemi Cure or Reef carbon to eliminate it. I heard if that doesn't work, they are thinking of changing the water in the Pacific to RO/DI. :eek:
Yes, I know I am an old senile guy who doesn't know a clown fish from a Duck Billed Platypus so go back to your thread and see what you are going to buy for this. Sorry I interrupted this discussion, I was bored. :dance: Have a great day :clink:

 

Therapy

Active Member
Paul, I agree to disagree. But will not debate with you as there are some subtle points that are correct. There are phases that will, and need, to run their course. That being said, during such times it IS beneficial to keep aforementioned PO3 PO4 levels in check to keep it to a minimum and keep the tank healthy. I also agree that with an aged tank, (years) these won't create an emergency or even a problem worth discussing. But there are are many more factors with an aged tank that contribute to that. That being said, it is still important to address these issues with a new or "somewhat" new system. (2 years or 3 is still a new system IMO)
The purpose of this forum is to help people get established. This is a trying time. That's great to show that after years in existence its not as bad of a problem, but during the starting trying times its best to get levels stabilized to make it through because it CAN get out of control and turn people off to the hobby.
Thanks for your post.
 

MikeyAl

New Member
I know I am in the very vast minority, OK, no one will agree with me, :doh:but that's OK, and I never, never get involved in algae threads but it sure seems like you guys like to spend money. I have said it before and I will say it one last time. Nitrates, phosphates and phases of the moon do not cause algae, and eliminating those two things will not kill it. The main thing people do is change water. Does that ever help? No. It doesn't. If it did, there would be no algae. Interesting that it grows the most on brand new, no nutrient tanks. Odd isn't it? Will adding phosban or snake oil work? No it won't. Well I have never tried snake oil so I can't comment. But the algae will get bored eventually and disappear which is the reason that virtually anything you do, or do not do will at one point work. Search back over years and years of algae threads and look at all the remedies. Eventually, the algae disappeared weather you did all of those things, or none. :dunno:
My tank now probably has more nitrates and phosphates than all your tanks put together, but I have no algae except where I want it on the scrubber. Algae grows on every healthy reef, you just need to make friends with it and convince it to grow where you want it. 2 years ago I took this picture on one of the outer, remote Hawaiian Islands. It is hair algae. I think the Governor of Hawaii was taking up a collection to buy Phosban, Chemi Cure or Reef carbon to eliminate it. I heard if that doesn't work, they are thinking of changing the water in the Pacific to RO/DI. :eek:
Yes, I know I am an old senile guy who doesn't know a clown fish from a Duck Billed Platypus so go back to your thread and see what you are going to buy for this. Sorry I interrupted this discussion, I was bored. :dance: Have a great day :clink:

Hilarious.


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Pat24601

Well-Known Member
I know I am in the very vast minority, OK, no one will agree with me, :doh:but that's OK, and I never, never get involved in algae threads but it sure seems like you guys like to spend money. I have said it before and I will say it one last time. Nitrates, phosphates and phases of the moon do not cause algae, and eliminating those two things will not kill it. The main thing people do is change water. Does that ever help? No. It doesn't. If it did, there would be no algae. Interesting that it grows the most on brand new, no nutrient tanks. Odd isn't it? Will adding phosban or snake oil work? No it won't. Well I have never tried snake oil so I can't comment. But the algae will get bored eventually and disappear which is the reason that virtually anything you do, or do not do will at one point work. Search back over years and years of algae threads and look at all the remedies. Eventually, the algae disappeared weather you did all of those things, or none. :dunno:
My tank now probably has more nitrates and phosphates than all your tanks put together, but I have no algae except where I want it on the scrubber. Algae grows on every healthy reef, you just need to make friends with it and convince it to grow where you want it. 2 years ago I took this picture on one of the outer, remote Hawaiian Islands. It is hair algae. I think the Governor of Hawaii was taking up a collection to buy Phosban, Chemi Cure or Reef carbon to eliminate it. I heard if that doesn't work, they are thinking of changing the water in the Pacific to RO/DI. :eek:
Yes, I know I am an old senile guy who doesn't know a clown fish from a Duck Billed Platypus so go back to your thread and see what you are going to buy for this. Sorry I interrupted this discussion, I was bored. :dance: Have a great day :clink:


I'm truly not sure if this supports your theory or not, but I used to have the dreaded green bubble algae and (knock on wood), I haven't seen it in my tank in several months.

I did try a lot of things to get rid of it. Changing water, emerald crabs, gfo, manual extraction, dancing ritualistically during a full moon (well...maybe not). But, truly, I don't credit any of those things with working. I think it just went away one day. I have no idea why.

I do think an algae scrubber like you have is a good idea. I bought one. Maybe someday I'll install it.
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
I...
I do think an algae scrubber like you have is a good idea. I bought one. Maybe someday I'll install it.

While I like algae scrubbing in certain cases, I can say that they are not effective if you leave them in the box they came in (grin)

You bought it, you might as well give it a try.
 

Pat24601

Well-Known Member
While I like algae scrubbing in certain cases, I can say that they are not effective if you leave them in the box they came in (grin)

You bought it, you might as well give it a try.

LOL. Indeed.

The return on investment of something left in the box is pretty darn low...
 

Trinny

Member
I had green bubble algae too, that's a lot easier to remove by hand... It's hard to watch either fish or corals suffering and some of my corals are suffering.


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Paul B

Well-Known Member
While I like algae scrubbing in certain cases, I can say that they are not effective if you leave them in the box they came in (grin)

You bought it, you might as well give it a try.

Dam, you mean you have to actually install the thing! :ponder2:
 

Paul B

Well-Known Member
Therapy, I would never argue with you or anyone else on a fish site. We all have the same purpose, to try to teach Noobs through our experience. These are my experiences and of course I am not the God of fish so I could be totally wrong. :confused:
I get my experiences mostly from diving and spending time with the creatures we are trying to keep. (not usually tourist diving) I try very hard not to just repeat what someone else heard someplace unless I can see pictures or hear a lot of experience. Like you said, a new tank is 2 or 3 years old, I would say 5-8 years old.
I have been dealing with algae since 1952 when I started my first tank and I m sure in that time I killed more fish than Starkist Tuna. :eek:
I am positive other people have other valid things to add. :rolleyes:

I'm truly not sure if this supports your theory or not, but I used to have the dreaded green bubble algae and (knock on wood), I haven't seen it in my tank in several months.

I did try a lot of things to get rid of it. Changing water, emerald crabs, gfo, manual extraction, dancing ritualistically during a full moon (well...maybe not). But, truly, I don't credit any of those things with working. I think it just went away one day. I have no idea why.

I do think an algae scrubber like you have is a good idea. I bought one. Maybe someday I'll install it.

This type of post has been around since the 60s and unfortunately will probably always be around.
I realize many people, especially Noobs want an easy fix for algae, but there is none. I also wish we would curtail telling people that nitrates and phosphates cause algae, as it does not. We should, of course try our hardest to reduce these pollutants, but not because of algae as it won't help. You can see the picture I posted from Hawaii. I don't know how much nitrates and phosphates are off a remote Island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean but hair algae is all over the place because for some reason, the herbivores disappeared along with the large predators like sharks. Hair algae is natural and as a matter of fact a healthy substance as it will purify the water better than any product you can buy, do it naturally and for free. How is that! Yes, we don't want it on our corals, I don't either but if it "wants" to grow for whatever reason that only the algae knows, it will grow no matter what you do or buy. It is a self limiting substance and luckily for us, temporary. The algae of the OP, which is not hair algae by the way, will, if left alone, deplete whatever it is living on as well as removing other questionable substances leaving the water much purer than it was before. Adding store bought substances are sometimes a good Idea for certain things but they won't work for algae. I sometimes use Chemi Clean or Poly Filters for situations, but never for algae because even if you manage to eliminate the algae with a product, you are not eliminating all the things algae lives on. Only algae can do that and it should be allowed to grow in a place where we want it to grow. I know it is the goal of almost everyone to have an algae free system, but that is totally un-natural and more important, un-healthy. Algae is growing because it is supposed to grow as it does on every healthy reef in the sea. If you dive you will see millions of tangs, rabbitfish and algae bleenies all over the reef, at night they will be replaced by hordes of urchins, slugs, snails and chitins, guess what they are eating? No, not Happy Meals.
I thin many people would have much healthier reefs if we kept the natural and let algae do what it is supposed to do just as it does in the sea. Remember that our corals are also filled with algae.
I took this last year off a mangrove Island on Ley Largo. Covered in algae.


This is my tank over 20 years ago covered in Hair algae. I didn't do anything except pull it off manually until it depleted what it wanted. It left on it's own. The corals were very healthy and even better after the algae purified the water. I still have that fireclown.



I also took this in Hawaii. You can see an urchin in every crevice. I don't see any hamburgers.
 
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zamerico

New Member
Is anthelia considered an algae because that sh-, er, stuff is everywhere in my tank! I made the mistake of listening to the LFS tell me it's a "great starter coral". When I walked in there the first time I was mesmerized by the flowing corals he had in the center display tank. Now I know he was simply trying to get rid of it. I know, I know this is an algae thread. Sorry.

I suppose the solution to your algae problem is to put one tiny piece of half dead anthelia in your tank and in 2 weeks, you won't be able to see any algae or aquascape rocks...
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
Is anthelia considered an algae because that sh-, er, stuff is everywhere in my tank! I made the mistake of listening to the LFS tell me it's a "great starter coral". When I walked in there the first time I was mesmerized by the flowing corals he had in the center display tank. Now I know he was simply trying to get rid of it. I know, I know this is an algae thread. Sorry.

I suppose the solution to your algae problem is to put one tiny piece of half dead anthelia in your tank and in 2 weeks, you won't be able to see any algae or aquascape rocks...

This all depends on how you feel about the coral. It's not an algae, but it can be invasive. If you like the coral, embrace it, but prune it back often and keep it where you want it. If you don't like it, then work on removing it, usually by cutting it off the rock it's on many times. Various Aiptasia Anemone killing products may work on it also.

All that being said, there is always someone that wants to grow the coral but can't seem to make it happen, even though everything about their tank seems to be correct. Go figure.
 

Therapy

Active Member
Paul. I appreciate your reply. Please allow me to question it. Not arguing because I feel this may be an incredible valid outlook. But not sold as of yet.

First thought is that I would have loved to see a breakdown of the water quality at the said locations that you posted the pictures. (Light and flow included) The Ocean is not one big tank with all the same qualities at all portions of the ocean. Too bad we didn't think of this (post) before you experienced and took pictures of discussed area's. I am very curious.

Second thought is I see minimal Coral growth of any kind in your first and third pictures. I see some in the third but none in the first. But hey, you were there and saw the bigger picture. I would like to compare it.

We all know that some parts of the ocean have far more coral growth than others and there are lots of reasons for this. Nutrients, (high and low) water flow, light, Salinity and many more to list.

All this being said, the typical hobbyist, as a general rule are trying to replicate a certain part of the great blue ocean (classified "reef") along with the organisms (corals) growing there. What are the parameters there and how do they compare?

I look forward to your observations.
 

lzrlvr

Member
hi I think I have the same type of algae its nasty and I do not think you will find any clean up crew that will want to eat it. I try to remove as much as possible during my weekly water changes. my tank is only 12 gallons with no protein skimmer. the tank has been in operation for 6 years and even with this algae problem I have done well. I do use chemi-pure blue and that seems to help. I just purchased a santa monica filtration drop .2 algaescrubber so I will see how well that goes hopefully it will help eliminate this snotty algae. good luck.
 

Paul B

Well-Known Member
Therapy the pictures in Hawaii were I think off Lanai or Kauai. Hawaii is more of a volcanic Island and there is no great coral formations there although there is coral. I found crown of Thorn starfish all over the place killing corals. I have no idea what the water parameters are there. I am sure the volcanoes play havoc with the place. The middle picture was the Florida keys. No coral there either. I am not sure why but I think the water is to turbid which causes a lack of light. There is plenty of coral there in deeper water away from the Islands.

Here is that spot in Hawaii from a helicopter. This Island has no industry and very little tourism. There is not much of anything there for 6,000 miles so I don't think nitrates would be a problem.


This picture would show my point better. I took this because, if you look close, a spotted moray eel is in the center. That is a coral head covered in algae. That is generally how it looks there. Coral encased in algae. The coral seems healthy as does the algae. I have dove all over the world and no matter where you go, you will find herbivores. You find them because algae is growing and they are keeping it to short to see. In the Caymans you also see all sorts of algae because it is a natural part of every ocean. We as aquarists see it as a harbinger of doom but I think we should re think this.


These Manatees are all over the Florida Keys and eat an enormous amount of algae to keep up their massive weight. It even grows on them. Make a great clean up crew I would imagine. They have been there thousands of years before pollution and I am sure they were eating algae then also. These are just my observations from many years of looking at this stuff. I realize most people feel I am wrong. But they are re-hashing old tales from other people who also heard it from rumors. I try to prove my ideas through pictures if I can. But as I always say. I am not the God of fish, or algae. :cool:

 

Pat24601

Well-Known Member
Is anthelia considered an algae because that sh-, er, stuff is everywhere in my tank! I made the mistake of listening to the LFS tell me it's a "great starter coral". When I walked in there the first time I was mesmerized by the flowing corals he had in the center display tank. Now I know he was simply trying to get rid of it. I know, I know this is an algae thread. Sorry.

I suppose the solution to your algae problem is to put one tiny piece of half dead anthelia in your tank and in 2 weeks, you won't be able to see any algae or aquascape rocks...

LOL. I was lucky and I read about many of the more invasive species here before I bought anything. Your experience is probably true for a big percent of new refeerers, though. I don't have any statistics, but I'd say it probably happens most of the time.
 
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