Corals, light, [pigments and junk like that

[mojoreef]

Mike they usually use small red halogen lights, UV-A I beleive.


Mike

 

[Boomer]

Mike have to go to work but will dig up some ref and show people how they can get them, that is those in journals and for free. I also have some links on pigments.


One question

usually use small red halogen lights, UV-A I beleive

How does a Halogen Lamp that is producing mostly Red and IR light, end up producing UV-A1 "violet light", in the Ultra region and then turn it into red light. Must be via FM Or am I missing something here Only about .2 % of a Halogen lamp is UV. They can appear violet to purplish but that is due to a slight absorbtion in the green band by iodine vapor:smirk:

Ok, Ok, I know this isn't far, due to the lighting tech manuals I have

 

[Scooterman]

Yea, you need lighting tech manuals to keep up with you guys lol! Holly FM! :closed:

 

[EdgeKrusher]

Man what a way to make a man feel dumb. LOL. I read this stuff thinking to myself the whole time "I wish I knew WTF they get this stuff". Then the realization that I'm dumb washes over me, and everything is fine again. well back to my happy world. LOL LOL LOL LOL:explode: :explode: :explode:

EK

 

[mojoreef]

How does a Halogen Lamp that is producing mostly Red and IR light, end up producing UV-A1 "violet light", in the Ultra region and then turn it into red light. Must be via FM Or am I missing something here Only about .2 % of a Halogen lamp is UV. They can appear violet to purplish but that is due to a slight absorbtion in the green band by iodine vapor

HEY its a japanese thing...leave me alone OK ok I will go dig it up.


Mike

 

[mojoreef]

Ok its a RED (orange was close, lol) 50 and 75 watt USIO standard hallogen lamps.
its the lillte bulb in the upper right hand corner



Mike

 

[Boomer]

I agree it is that bulb but they don't produce UV light.other than less than 1 %, as they can't, the chemistry and operation says so. Such lamps have a K of 2800- 3400. They make almost a straight line from 350 nm, to 700nm, where at 350 nm it is about <1 % RE ad at 700 nm it is near 85 % RE. So of course they can make red light,yellow, organge and even appear bluish or white but not UV. You can change the K by about 200 K or so by "over voltaging" them or dropping it about the same by under voltaging them. Such lamps have only about 10-12 % visible light. About 70 % of the energy is IR, 20 % conducted and convected heat and less that 1% UV. Their Efficacy is around 20 Lum. / W.

This is about what they look like;

Here is something for everyone to read about light and what it does to your eyes

http://palimpsest.stanford.edu/waac/wn/wn21/wn21-3/wn21-308.html


Here is some on CRI and K

http://www.effectiveconcepts.net/def.html

While playing with Google's I found this cool article

Cyanobacteria , Tempeature and Light

 

[Boomer]

Light and Pigment stuff


Cool K program


Another Program to Play With

Get the Calculator Out Now !!


Environmental Factors Affecting Corals and Coral Reefs

Light on a Reef


The best website on lighting I posted this the other day, many must have missed it :columbo:


Photosynthesis


Stony Coral Pigments, Algae Pigments and Captive Lighting

 

[mps9506]

This link didn't work, a break got imbedded in there somehow...
http://www.coralreefecosystems.com/ltg_technical_data.htm
That was for the "best website on lighting"
Mike

 

[Boomer]

I see that now Mike, after lookin' at yours. Yours works THANKS. I also fixed mine

 

[mps9506]

Ok, just finished reading Tyree's article..
http://www.reefs.org/library/talklog/s_tyree_060202.html
Nice article, I wish he could have gone more into the intensity aspect...
Pretty interesting that he doesn't recomend the use of the 250 watt "full spectrum violet" bulbs. I felt I had experienced better coloration of my corals when going with the AB bulbs after using Iwasaki's when I first setup up my halides.
I guess I can't really measure how much "better" my corals were colored though, or how the pocilloporin in the corals in my tank reacted to the change in bulbs.
Mike

 

[Boomer]

I guess I can't really measure how much "better" my corals were colored though, or how the pocilloporin in the corals in my tank reacted to the change in bulbs.

Tha is the misleading issue. Sure corals will change due to dif lighting but that change in color, to which "you like", means nothing to the coral, they only cares about growth and reproduction,etc... Some where reefers have gotten the idea that if the coral looks better to them, they must be doing better, when in fact they many be doing worse.

 

[mps9506]

Originally posted by Boomer
I guess I can't really measure how much "better" my corals were colored though, or how the pocilloporin in the corals in my tank reacted to the change in bulbs.

Tha is the misleading issue. Sure corals will change due to dif lighting but that change in color, to which "you like", means nothing to the coral, they only cares about growth and reproduction,etc... Some where reefers have gotten the idea that if the coral looks better to them, they must be doing better, when in fact they many be doing worse.

Is this a misleading statement by Tyree then?

It was also recently discovered that corals containing high densities of fluorescing pigments were less sensitive to coral bleaching that was induced by photo damage to the photosynthetic apparatus within the corals algae.

I do undertand what you mean though, what the corals look like in our glass tanks, are really just what we perceive as a result of our lightring choices. What I was trying to say is there was no way to measure the density of flourescing pigments, esp. pocilloporin, that could be an indication of how healthy my corals are doing.
I guess those white growth tips are my best clue as to the health of my corals, unless one day/night I happen to see a spawn event occur in my tank.
Mike

 

[mojoreef]

I guess those white growth tips are my best clue as to the health of my corals, unless one day/night I happen to see a spawn event occur in my tank.

growth is a good one for sure although I have seen, them growing on one end and dieing on the other at the same time, lol. A few years ago I went to aan all radium lighting arrangement (all 400 watt 20K's) I loved the look of the tank and my acro coloration was just beautiful.... I was a happy puppy. As time passed by, I began to notice that my growth rates had severly decreased, I would guess by around 75%. I then began to notice that alot of them were forming larger and larger bleaching areas lower and on the underside of branches. Even though I loved the colors of the corals I changed my lighting back to its original configuration (mix of 20K radiums and 10K Ushio) , the color is still very good (not as intence as it was ) but the corals have once again began to show great growth and the bleached areas have repopulated.


Mike

 

[Boomer]

It was also recently discovered that corals containing high densities of fluorescing pigments were less sensitive to coral bleaching that was induced by photo damage to the photosynthetic apparatus within the corals algae.

And the discovery said what about how the high density pigments got there. Hi K bulbs does not necessarily mean more fluorescing pigments. Maybe they are just fluorescing more and that is what you see. So no Mike, there is no way for you to tell, but to hope that such observation is good and not bad.

What I was trying to say is there was no way to measure the density of fluorescing pigments, esp. pocilloporin, that could be an indication of how healthy my corals are doing.

Sure there are ways of measuring them, it is we just can't, if that is what you mean. You would find much in professional journals on this if one looked


So yes it is misleading to a degree

Have you read this;
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/eb/index.htm

 

[mps9506]

Originally posted by Boomer
So yes it is misleading to a degree

Have you read this;
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/eb/index.htm

Ok, I think I'm getting somewhere on this lighting issue

Yup, read the article, and the follow up. One of my favorites from reefkeeping.
Guess this would be one of the most important things for me to take from it...

The primary control on their production appears to be total irradiance level, and little evidence exists to suggest that the "k" rating of bulbs will influence their production. There is also a strong genetic component, although the specific aspects of fluorescing proteins and their respective genes have not yet been worked out. The color temperature of light bulbs most likely influences the perceived color of corals in a tank, with ultraviolet components enhancing highly fluorescent pigments. Certain bulb temperatures may have enough of their spectrum skewed in relative distribution that total irradiance with a given wattage may be affected, and thus total irradiance influencing the relative production of fluorescing proteins.

I guess one other thing to keep in mind also would be:

coloration is largely aesthetic for reef aquariums.

Thanks Boomer...

 

[mojoreef]

remember growth and color are two different things in most cases


Mike