Sandbed disturbia

Dweezil

Dweezil

Well-Known Member
Please bear with me on this question: I've been reading alot of the threads that say without a doubt that it is not a good thing to disturb an established sandbed. Even threads that say it may be the cause for total tank crashes. That got me wondering why then is it okay to have burrowing fish? For instance, I really want to have a jawfish at some point so I planned ahead and have a fairly deep sandbed. Why would a burrowing fish not cause the same ill effects on a tank that any other disturbance would? Logically I would think that anything burrowing would release the same toxic gases. This was just one of those things that made me say hmmmmm? Any thoughts and insight would be appeciated.
 
R

redsea reefer

Well-Known Member
Dweezil- your tank has not been up long enough to develop toxic gases and anaerobic areas, so add your jawfish soon. That applies to tanks where the sand bed has not been disturbed for a long time (6-12 months) or even ever.
 
Dweezil

Dweezil

Well-Known Member
Thanks Eddie but I was not talking about my tank perse. I was more speaking in general terms. Just wondering what the difference would be with someone getting a burrowing fish or disturbiing the sandbed on their own. I'm sure someone at some point later in their tank life say 2 or 3 years has decided they would like to have a burrowing fish. Would this not release toxic gases just the same as a gravel vac for instance?
 
R

redsea reefer

Well-Known Member
Dweezil said:
I'm sure someone at some point later in their tank life say 2 or 3 years has decided they would like to have a burrowing fish. Would this not release toxic gases just the same as a gravel vac for instance?
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yes it would, you will be taking a chance in releasing the gases and causing harm.
 
Dweezil

Dweezil

Well-Known Member
Okay then I guess that's my answer. If you have any plans at all to get some sort of burrowing fish it is better to do it sooner than later. Thanks Eddie!
 
Rhodes19

Rhodes19

Active Member
This is just an inexperienced thought, but wouldn't have more to do with how much the bed is disturbed? Granted, disturbing the bed will release gas and toxins, but I would think that a burrowing/sand sifter fish would stir up only a small amount that the system can handle verses stirring up the bed to re arranging rockscape, do maintenance, or moving the tank. Again, just an inexperienced thought. :)
 
BigAl07

BigAl07

Administrator
RS STAFF
Rhodes19 said:
This is just an inexperienced thought, but wouldn't have more to do with how much the bed is disturbed? Granted, disturbing the bed will release gas and toxins, but I would think that a burrowing/sand sifter fish would stir up only a small amount that the system can handle verses stirring up the bed to re arranging rockscape, do maintenance, or moving the tank. Again, just an inexperienced thought. :)
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I think you've hit the Nail on the Head!! Unless you get something that REALLY messes up a LOT of the sandbed you're probably ok. Compared to turning over the whole sand-bed all at once. A mature tank can handle some gas being released but a large portion of the snad-bed being turned over can (or so it seems) cause tank issues.
 
Clownfish518

Clownfish518

Razorback
PREMIUM
Don't know why. But I have been keeping DSBs for years and burrowing animals have never caused a problem, whether added sooner or later.
 
R

redsea reefer

Well-Known Member
BigAl07 said:
I think you've hit the Nail on the Head!! Unless you get something that REALLY messes up a LOT of the sandbed you're probably ok. Compared to turning over the whole sand-bed all at once. A mature tank can handle some gas being released but a large portion of the snad-bed being turned over can (or so it seems) cause tank issues.
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I agree...
 
JNicho

JNicho

Member
I keep the sand bed stirred and vacuumed in all my tanks...I don't buy into the "leave it alone" theory anymore...siphon vac and remove the junk!

If you want a more in depth read the link below is to a post I put on my reef blog about my feelings on sand beds and maintenance:

Reef-a-holic
 
BigAl07

BigAl07

Administrator
RS STAFF
JNicho with all due respect I find your "blog/article just a bit to ... opinionated and lacking in tests & proof one way or the other.

You stated
Well, guess what, there is no invisible barrier between substances in the sand and the rest of the system.
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Well then how do you explain the differentiation between the aerobic zone and anaerobic zone (which you did indeed mention) in the sand bed? It's not a distinct LINE but a gradual differentiation as you get deeper into the sand. What happens is that these "locked in" substances are either processed or slowly released into the system over long periods of time and not all at once during a deep cleaning session.

In a stable and mature tank if you do go about digging and cleaning into the DEEPER regions of a DSB you will release the "Pockets" of built up gases . I don't have scientific proof but I can tell you from experience those gases are present and some-what locked in. I've removed/replaced sandbeds and when you dig into the deeper layers there is no way of denying what's being released into the tank (smells like rotten eggs).

If someone wants to "clean/siphon" their sandbed then it should be done from the beginning and maintained that way. I believe that even remotely hinting that someone should dig in and start cleaning an established DSP into the deeper regions of their DSB is asking for serious problems.


Now I'm not saying DSB's are perfect or am I saying they are terrible. There is no IDEAL substrate yet but I'm afraid that telling someone (paraphrasing here) "It's a good idea to start digging into your DSB today with a Gravel-Vac" could lead to some serious tank problems and even crashes.
 
JNicho

JNicho

Member
Your concerns are duly noted...and in the case of a very mature sand bed that has not been touched in a long time you are probably right...it is, however, still my opinion, that removing the accumulating "nasties" from the sand is the lesser of evils...I don't have any "proof" other than my own anecdotal evidence and that of a few of others I've seen who also perform regular cleaning of their sand...I kept sand beds in my tanks for many years following the strict "do not disturb" theory...and I too have removed and found those lovely black pockets of H2S...in the last few years however, I've gone to keeping my sand clean and IMO/IME this is a better method if you want to keep sand as a substrate...I might note that with regular maintenance of the sand bed, I no longer get those pockets of H2S caused by trapped decaying matter.

BigAl07 said:
JNicho with all due respect I find your "blog/article just a bit to ... opinionated and lacking in tests & proof one way or the other.

You stated

Well then how do you explain the differentiation between the aerobic zone and anaerobic zone (which you did indeed mention) in the sand bed? It's not a distinct LINE but a gradual differentiation as you get deeper into the sand. What happens is that these "locked in" substances are either processed or slowly released into the system over long periods of time and not all at once during a deep cleaning session.

In a stable and mature tank if you do go about digging and cleaning into the DEEPER regions of a DSB you will release the "Pockets" of built up gases . I don't have scientific proof but I can tell you from experience those gases are present and some-what locked in. I've removed/replaced sandbeds and when you dig into the deeper layers there is no way of denying what's being released into the tank (smells like rotten eggs).

If someone wants to "clean/siphon" their sandbed then it should be done from the beginning and maintained that way. I believe that even remotely hinting that someone should dig in and start cleaning an established DSP into the deeper regions of their DSB is asking for serious problems.


Now I'm not saying DSB's are perfect or am I saying they are terrible. There is no IDEAL substrate yet but I'm afraid that telling someone (paraphrasing here) "It's a good idea to start digging into your DSB today with a Gravel-Vac" could lead to some serious tank problems and even crashes.
Click to expand...
 
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