Now cloudy water - don't know why. (Long)

[BoomerD]

I watch the threads you post, both here and over at RAG...It seems like you thrash around like a fish out of water...this way, that way, flip/flop...I'd never try to discourage anyone from the hobby, and I'm not trying to here either, but I would certainly encourage you to slow down, and quit bouncing all over the place with this...Let us get you started going in the right direction, do things slowly and stay on one course, instead of going several different directions as once.
Get the few remaining fish out of the tank, put them in quarantine tank, let your main tank stay empty for 6 weeks., to allow the ich to run it's livecycle out with no fish to host on. Thst should finally kill it.You should slowly lower the salinity in the quarantine tank to 1.009 do this over the course of about a week...not by more than 0.002 per day. Hyposalinity will kill the ich on the other fish. They may not show any signs of having it, but they have been exposed to it, and may still hav it in their tissues, just not at a level that is going to bother them. Some fish seem more reststant to it than others.
IO has always been notorious for being low in alk/calcium...Most supplement with either kalk/calcium reactors or kalk drippers, or with somthing like the Kent Tech you used. For one of those to be used right,first you gotta test to know where the levels are at. Then, a good aquarium chemistry calculator helps. Try this one: http://www.kademani.com/reefchem.htm You have to know how much water is in the aquarium, NOT how big the tank is for this to be accurate! As you've been told many times before on both forums, take it easy, slow down...nothing good happens fast in this hobby, only the bad things happen fast.
I've posted the same response on the RAG thread as well.

 

[newsalt]

Boomer:

I here ya. I'm fairly new to this hobby, less than a year. I sincerely appreciate all the responces I've gotton on this topic as well as other, less stressful topics. However, in three days, I lost over $95 in fish and such. Maybe not alot to you or others, and quite honestly not alot for me either, but I don't like flushing money down the toilet...literally. I've tried garlic, selcon, and ginger. All the stuff that others have had results with, but not me. I've made three attempts to get the three green chromis out of the tank. You seem like you've been in this hobby a while so I'm sure you're aware that these fish are fast as lightening. So, despite the excellent advice, I may take a gamble with these fish and let them be, but watch them closely. I have a UV sterilizer that is expected to arrive tomorrow. From what I've read about ich, it doesn't stay on the fish forever. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but there seems to be two times in it's life cycle where it could get zapped by UV. One is when it falls of the fish to form a cyst, the second is when the cyst ruptures and all the "baby ichs" float around looking for a host, which are only three now, much more difficult for them to find a host. So I'm banking on those two opportunities for the UV to do it's thing. Keep in mind though that I have absolutely no intention on adding any fish to my tank until the UV has been operating for a minimum of 6 weeks.

Now as far as my Ca and Alk problem. Those articles referenced to me in many replys are useless. I'm sorry if you don't want to hear that. They are all written in terms where you need a chemistry degree to follow them. The calculators may be good, they haven't worked for me though and are not complete. For instance, before I itried kalk, I used Kent's two part additive. Well, that's not one of the options on that calculator you linked. So although it might be the greatest thing since sliced bread to others, it was of no use to me. so, I've tried two part additives, now kalk and quite frankly I'm baffled, niether worked. One day Alk goes down and Ca starts to go up, and I feel I'm on the right track. The next day Alk rises again and Ca goes down lower that the day before. I get the message, "take it easy, slow down...nothing good happens fast in this hobby, only the bad things happen fast.", So, as the subject of one of posts read, "....Nothing is working..". I'm not kidding about that. I use 2 tsp. per gallon ratio for kalk, and kalk has a pH of what 11 or 12. Well my pH won't budge. I calibrated my meter twice. Even borrowed one from work, and it reads the same, 8.0. I want it at 8.4-ish because according to Brucey (another huge help), he found out that ich can't live at that pH. So, again I must say, "....Nothing is working..".

Now onto your statement:

"You have to know how much water is in the aquarium, NOT how big the tank is for this to be accurate"

I've bee wondering that myself. I'm an engineer and I know all about Archemede's Principle, but I don't know the calculations. Maybe someone else does.. my total tank volume is 50g actually 50.49g is you want to get picky. What volume does 62 lbs of LR and 50 lbs of aragonite sand take up? If someone can answer that then I'll know the true volume.

Anyway, bottom line...I love this hobby. I've wanted a saltwater tank since I was a kid. I'm going to make this work, one way or another. My wife knows I've been upset with these results or lack thereof an she said, "...try saltwater again, if it doesn't work, switch to freshwater". Freshwater! Are you kidding me.

 

[Brucey]

Originally posted by newsalt
However, in three days, I lost over $95 in fish and such. Maybe not alot to you or others, and quite honestly not alot for me either, but I don't like flushing money down the toilet...literally

HI NS . . . . Here's the thing. We've all gone through what your going through. I'm not kidding you mate. Honestly I did. In the first 3 months i lost more fish and inverts than i have in the last 18 months. Why, because I was impatient. I know you don't want to hear this but in a years time everything will be OK and you'll be able to put most things in your tank without any mortalilities. And in a years time you'll be saying exactly what we're all saying to you now. Just take it slow and take your time. You may have to take 2 backward steps before before your can take 1 forward. Boomer's point is that there is no one magical cure which is what your searching for and spending your hard earned cash on. Don't get me wrong, throwing money at it will help enormously but it isn't the magic cure. The two biggest and best investments I've ever made are a PH computer (which holds the tank PH at 8.4 abd doses your kalk for you) and a UV unit. The one thing that will help your tank more than anything, and help stabilise your PH, Alk and Ca that your struggling with is time. Your tank needs to be mature and there is no magic cure apart from an Orson Wells time machine.
Anyway good luck with the new purchase
Brucey
PS, How is the Kalk dosing going ?

 

[newsalt]

Thanks Brucey, that's encouraging. Regarding the kalk, I only mix up a quart a day. I use 1/2 tsp. per quart which equate to 2 tsp per gallon. The mixture never really clears after mixing. It get "clearer", but should I be able to see through it? Anyway, I've only been doing it a couple of nights. I haven't seen any results. As I mention in my last post, One day Alk goes down and Ca starts to go up, and I feel I'm on the right track. The next day Alk rises again and Ca goes down lower that the day before. But regardless, the pH doesn't change. If it does, maybe from 8.0 to 8.1, but after the kalk stops, back to 8.0 and sometimes 7.9. There lies the frustration I have. Do you think its due to the fact that the tank has been running for only 2 months?

Thanks

 

[fidojoe]

FWIW, I normally do about 1tbsp per gallon when dosing kalk manually to my nano. With the reactor on my 50 I couldn't tell ya what the ratio is. I would reccomend mixing up a gallon at a time, that way the kalk has a chance to settle completely before use instead of mixing it as needed and using it right away.The water should be pretty much crystal clear before you dose it into the tank. I mix up a gallon after topping off for the day, and let it settle overnight, and whatever is left, is shaken up in the container and allowed to settle for the next day. Just keep dosing kalk. I have also been in your shoes, and I feel for ya, just keep going.

 

[newsalt]

Fido:
Can I mix the kalk up in a 1 gallon milk jug with a screw top? I know that won't be totally air tight, but would it be ok?

 

[Woodstock]

A screw on top is fine. I use that type of jug for kalkwasser.

 

[fidojoe]

This is my kalk mixing system for my nano

Pardon my laziness, I was too comfy to leave my chair to take the pic, so I just used the zoom

 

[fidojoe]

Oops

 

[Dingo]

A gallon jug is fine. Mix it up, and let it sit overnight, and in the morning, there will be white powder all over the bottom, and the liquid is crystal clear. Use only the clear liquid, never the white residue.

I mix 7 gallons in a rubbermaid tub at a time for my kalk. It keeps for weeks, so a single big batch that you scoop from is much easier to deal with than mixing it up every time.

A couple of things. A new tank will generally use more alk than an older tank, so alk tends to drop faster than CA. This is because there is still a lot of rot going on in your system even though it is cycled, and that is an acidic process which kills your alkalinity. So you can add limewater, but you still may need to supplement alk on top of that to keep levels up. Thats why you are all over the place. Also, 1 quart of limewater isn't going to do much to the ph of a 55 gallon tank. To give you an idea, I use about a gallon a day on my 10 gallon, and my PH is fine.

Coralline tends to grow quickly in a new tank, which will suck your ca and alk down. That is the only thing in your tank using calcium right now, since you have no stonies.

I recommend that you continue using limewater, but buy a two part additive such as B-Ionic and use that to tweak in your levels a couple of times a week until things settle down. You may find in a few months that you need very little ca/alk addition depending on what you grow.

As to the ich, you pretty much have to let it run it's course. The parasite is always in your water, no matter what. When a fish is stressed, their immune systems can no longer fight it off. The fish probably got it from being added too quickly to a brand new tank, causing water quality issues. Your chromis may be just fine, or they may die. If they stay healthy, they aren't a danger to later fish. If they die, you are out 6 bucks. Good luck.

 

[Dingo]

One other thing. Double check your salinity against something else. Those float arms are notoriously inaccurate. Mine read 1.026 when the water was actually 1.029.