Skeptical Reefkeeping: Test Kits, Chasing Numbers and Phosphate
- Thread starter Mayja
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reefer gladness
Well-Known Member
IMO this article was completely inconclusive.
I just read the article and found it interesting and informative. Being new to the SW hobby how ever I would not say it is inconclusive it is just giving a different perspective on what is good verses what is bad but it is all variables same as our tanks. The little variables can make the difference I for one am not huge on wanting to add a bunch of chemicals to try and treat something that may not be horrible for my tank
after reading this article we decided to try Anemones and I am glad we have. We check our water every 3 days now and have done 2 15-25% water changes and our tank is doing great !!!! We don't worry about checking every little thing in the water as long as ammonia and nitrate nitrite are 0 everything else should be good is mo
depends on if you have corals in you tank...then the ammonia nitrate and trites aren't the only thing that matters...the corals will use up calcium and your alkalinity might go down and phosphates could be way out of hand...you dont know unless you test for them..and if you top off your tank with R/O water then from what i understand is that your slowly depleting all your trace elements that are useful for your corals...
reefer gladness
Well-Known Member
Not sure what you're trying to say here? Top-offs must be done with RO or RO/DI water - if you top-off with salt water then you are increasing the salinity. Trace elements are replenished with regular water changes.
Water changes are the way to really keep trace elements in order. Can't go wrong with them. Keep it simple and just top of RO as it gets evaporated, or with kalk if you know what your doing in that respect.
Major elements can be dosed on tested consumption via dosing or calcium reactor dependant on overall consumption. But by that time your really understand your tank anyways.
Major elements can be dosed on tested consumption via dosing or calcium reactor dependant on overall consumption. But by that time your really understand your tank anyways.
i was just saying that the other guy said that he tests for amm nitrate and trites and if those are ok then everything else is ok also...i was just saying i dont know if he does and topping off or not but if he does then the just testing for the 3 basics doesnt simply mean that if those 3 are ok then everything else in your tank is ok too
mikecc
Member
amm nitrate and trites are not the 3 basics
Alk, Cal, and Mag. Thems the 3 basics, I think. Looking for correction if I'm wrong.
Also depletion of trace elements is in no way due to evaporation..... evaporation removes the water itself and leaves everything else behind.
The trace elements are mostly consumed by livestock.
Because, you know, air is a fluid. Water is both a liquid and a fluid. Air is just a gaseous fluid.
Alk, Cal, and Mag. Thems the 3 basics, I think. Looking for correction if I'm wrong.
Also depletion of trace elements is in no way due to evaporation..... evaporation removes the water itself and leaves everything else behind.
The trace elements are mostly consumed by livestock.
Because, you know, air is a fluid. Water is both a liquid and a fluid. Air is just a gaseous fluid.
reefer gladness
Well-Known Member
Alk, calcium and magnesium are the 3 basics for water chemistry - critical for SPS, LPS, snails, clams, etc. anything that builds a a calcareous skeleton or shell.
Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and phosphates are the 4 basics for water quality - critical for everything in the reef aquarium.
I think we got on the topic when someone posted about their RBTA - which does require very good water quality but does not build a calcareous shell or skeleton and is less dependent water chemistry.
I'm running a mixed reef with LPS, SPS and 3 huge RBTA's - if I let water chemistry get out of balance (I usually battle low magnesium and low alk) I see the impact almost immediately with my LPS corals (acans are the first to pout in my tank, then GSP), SPS it takes awhile for me to notice any problems and my RBTA's don't seem to react at all.
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It's been awhile since I have disagreed in part with a lot of the posts on a thread. Here is my take on water testing and quality.
First, before you even bother to test anything else, make sure your SG is correct. If it's not, most of the other tests will be skewed and of little value.
Ammonia and nitrite - It's necessary to test these parameters during the initial cycle of a tank. Once you get past that, unless you have something really really wrong, you seldom need to test for them. A reef system has a huge capacity to convert ammonia --> nitrite --> nitrate.
pH, calcium, alkalinity and to a lessor extent magnesium are critical to maintaining corals, so you should test for these also if you have any corals. It's usually best to test your newly mixed SW to establish a base line. Then when you test your tank you can spot any differences. You might want to add a supplement to you new SW, rather than the tank, or even change salt brands if you fund your current brand mixing to different levels, or being really low in some areas.
Nitrate and Phosphate - In a reef system these measure roughly how much pollution you have in the tank and how likely it is that you'll have algae issues. It's best to keep them as low as possible.
To keep things interesting, don't think for a moment that because all your test kit reading are good that you don't have a water quality issue. Algae can use up a lot of nitrate and phosphate giving you a massive growth of nuisance algae, and very low readings for nitrate and phosphate. That's one example only. There are plenty of others.
Above all, observe your livestock. If it's doing well, be extremely careful about making changes. Don't ruin a good thing. Livestock is often a better indicator toward water quality than almost any test you can run.
Also, very important, don't chase numbers. If something is way out adjust it slowly. It's really easy to mess up a whole system because a bunch of additives were added that were used too quickly or not necessary.
Lastly while you can debate "water quality" verses "water chemistry" they are so related that you really can't separate them. To keep corals all of the parameters need to be within reason. There are also plenty of other parameters you can test for. Most of them are only worth doing in specific cases. Of course, the vendors are always happy to sell you an additional test kit. There are also plenty of parameters we can't test for. So despite what some may say, keep you with your water changes.
First, before you even bother to test anything else, make sure your SG is correct. If it's not, most of the other tests will be skewed and of little value.
Ammonia and nitrite - It's necessary to test these parameters during the initial cycle of a tank. Once you get past that, unless you have something really really wrong, you seldom need to test for them. A reef system has a huge capacity to convert ammonia --> nitrite --> nitrate.
pH, calcium, alkalinity and to a lessor extent magnesium are critical to maintaining corals, so you should test for these also if you have any corals. It's usually best to test your newly mixed SW to establish a base line. Then when you test your tank you can spot any differences. You might want to add a supplement to you new SW, rather than the tank, or even change salt brands if you fund your current brand mixing to different levels, or being really low in some areas.
Nitrate and Phosphate - In a reef system these measure roughly how much pollution you have in the tank and how likely it is that you'll have algae issues. It's best to keep them as low as possible.
To keep things interesting, don't think for a moment that because all your test kit reading are good that you don't have a water quality issue. Algae can use up a lot of nitrate and phosphate giving you a massive growth of nuisance algae, and very low readings for nitrate and phosphate. That's one example only. There are plenty of others.
Above all, observe your livestock. If it's doing well, be extremely careful about making changes. Don't ruin a good thing. Livestock is often a better indicator toward water quality than almost any test you can run.
Also, very important, don't chase numbers. If something is way out adjust it slowly. It's really easy to mess up a whole system because a bunch of additives were added that were used too quickly or not necessary.
Lastly while you can debate "water quality" verses "water chemistry" they are so related that you really can't separate them. To keep corals all of the parameters need to be within reason. There are also plenty of other parameters you can test for. Most of them are only worth doing in specific cases. Of course, the vendors are always happy to sell you an additional test kit. There are also plenty of parameters we can't test for. So despite what some may say, keep you with your water changes.
mikecc
Member
Must we include pH in this statement?
To give you a specific answer, in my opinion yes. However, testing pH runs a lot deeper that just the number. It's also important to understand why your getting that number. There is a lot of latitude for pH depending upon many factors. Even so, I've see it get extremely high and extremely low for various reasons. So it should be tested for. In some cases it can indicate other issues.
mikecc
Member
Never heard that. Resistivity is temperature dependent, but pH? Can we get a confirmation on that?