How many pumps do I need?

[AngelLeah1981]

How many pumps do I need?
I purchased a 120 gallon tank and am wanting to purchase the pump and skimmer next. I want to do reef and fish with a sump that has macro algae and rock and maybe sand. I thought I had the pump figured out that I was going to get. ...around 1500 gph at 4 foot head height but then I saw where someone had said they had one pump hooked up for their return and ANOTHER ONE on the skimmer ! How many pumps do you have to have? I'm so confused. Please help. Also, I am very interested in getting a pump that uses low wattage and any suggestions would be fantastic. I have such a hard time googling it for some reason.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0338.jpg
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THERE ARE TWO overflows.

48X24X25 - From the top of the tank to the bottom of the stand is almost 54 inches.

Are powerheads pumps? Do I only need one pump, one skimmer, and either 2 powerheads or a wave2k, a heater or chiller and thats it? If I don't have money to blow is the wave2k a waste of money or will it make my fish and animals happier?? WAVE2K!
Leah

Oh, and the reason I mentioned the skimmer is because that is part of the confusion. Someone said they needed to know what kind of skimmer I am getting before they can tell me what kind of pump to get. ?

 

[Anselth]

You will need one pump for your return, and one for your skimmer. Depending on the skimmer you buy, it may come with a pump. Ideally you want to match the flow through the skimmer section of your sump to the rating of the skimmer's pump, which is probably why they asked about the skimmer. However, this isn't strictly necessary, many people run higher sump turnover. The trick is to get a return pump that pumps less than your drain can handle, otherwise you will overflow the display tank.

Powerheads are technically pumps, just very small ones. And the Wave2K isn't necessary, there are lots of ways to create random motion in your tank using multiple powerheads.

 

[BigAl07]

Good morning

No need to stress. There's really nothing overly "Scientific" about pump selection. What you want to do is get SEVERAL ideas and then try to come up with a "scheme" that works for you.

I like the "Mag" series of pumps. They seem to be very dependable, quiet and "Low Watt" pumps.I would think that you're going to need to calculate about each over-flow brining about 600-800gph of water down into your sump area (totaling 1200-1400gph). I personally am running a single Mag18 (1800gph) on my 90g with a Single over-flow and think I could use more. Remember the higher the pump has to push the water the more "Head Loss" you experience. With that said I've never ran DUAL over flows but I like to keep things simple. I would go with a SINGLE return pump (Keep It Simple Silly) but those WITH Dual Over Flows may have other suggestions due to experience.

Are powerheads pumps?

Powerheads are pumps but they don't normally push water through a tube. They simply "Move" water around inside the tank.

There are different TYPES of skimmers. Some are "plumbed" into your return pump and some require their own pumps. I have an ASM G-2 skimmer and it requires it's own pump but it comes WITH it. One less thing to worry about and it's an AMAZING skimmer.... literally "Plug & Play". Take it out of the box.. slip the INCLUDED pump onto it and put it into the water. Plug it in and watch it go to work for you.

I've not had the pleasure of a "Wave2K" yet so I can't really provide any input there one way or the other. You'll have to decide how you want to stock your tank long term and work out your flow requirements for powerheads from there. Some corals needs LOTS of flow but some have delicate flesh and can get ripped torn by extreme flow. I like LOTS of flow so I have my Return Pump king of on the STRONG side and I have 2 Hydor Koralia #3's in my tank and will probably add more shortly. That's just me though.

You''ll want a heater ( I run two for redundancy ) in your sump area and a chiller if you have problems maintaining a steady temp especially during warmer months. This is also dependent upon what type of lights you're going to run. Metal Halides tend to run much hotter than T5's so it's more likely (Not guaranteed either way) you'll need to add a chiller if you go with MH's. Personally I like the new Solaris LED series of lights because you get Low Energy (Low Wattage), High Output (Comparable to Metal Halides), Low Heat (Comparable to T5's) extremely LONG bulb life (potentially several years as opposed to 6 - 12 months) and just a really COOL light fixture that has it's own built in computer to adjust the fixture anywhere from a Moon-beam to Noon Day brightness and every where in between. Plus the Solaris LED Controller also has "programs" in it to simulate various weather related light changes.... storms, cloud cover etc.... How COOL is that?

Once you get the pump(s) in hand you get to really go wild in designing and then building the plumbing for this baby! In all honesty it would probably benefit you the most by locating/joining a local Reef Club and get some people locally to let you see what they've done first hand. I have to admit when I tackled mine it was about 5x more involved than I had initially thought it would be. I'm not saying it's "Hard" but I taxed my brain more than I had planned and I'll admit it took a few weeks to get everything "Tweaked" to where I was happy with it. Lot's of adding and changing and such. But now the PVC glue has worn off and I can think MUCH more clearly

Hope this helps! Wish I had more advice but I've only done one set-up anywhere near as large as this one so I'm still learning too

Hang in there and don't get stressed. It's a journey to enjoy and learn from.


Happy Reefing

 

[JoJo]

Hi Leah, Adam & Allen have giving you great advice, i've even learned something from what was said. I have been down the road of frustration several times & i'm only in the first stage of planning.

I have a 135g glass tank with a single overflow. My equipment includes: Coralife Super Skimmer 220(not sure how it actually works yet), a Mag 9 for the return(which are highly rated), & a Sequence Snapper for my Closed Loop System. You may like a CLS with a flow diverter such as a ocean motion

 

[AngelLeah1981]

First I just want to thank you guys for replying. I have a hard time getting responses sometimes. I think it's because I have too many questions. Sorry. Why have some people suggested external pump(s) instead of powerheads? Are these cheaper/more expensive? Do they use more or less power?

You'll have to decide how you want to stock your tank long term and work out your flow requirements for powerheads from there. Some corals needs LOTS of flow but some have delicate flesh and can get ripped torn by extreme flow. I like LOTS of flow

Oh loooooord. ha ha. I don't know what coral I want yet.....so I have to figure this out before I buy my pump? I wonder how much money I could lose if I bought overpowered stuff. This is the only aspect I'm not sure of. I was going to figure this out after the equipment. There are so many to chose from and here is the big problem for me: I was so set on anemones and blue carpet anemone and then found out that the blue carpet anemone can secrete bad stuff into the water so that killed a 11 month dream in less than a second. lol. silently pouted big time over that for a couple weeks. ha ha. The problem is I like all the coral. I thought you could mix it altogether. So tell me what I need to do with this roadblock? Do I really need to figure this out now? ....b/c I am so picky. It would probably take me months to figure out EXACTLY what I wanted. lol. ?? help. ??

but I have an IDEA of the fish I want:
yellow faced jawfish
seahorses
ocellaris clownfish
blue jaw tilefish - (very active lives on bottom - so probably not with the seahorses, right?)
blue powder tangs
regal tang,
other tangs? maybe lemon peel
racoon butterfly fish,
maybe an Angel Fish
I realize I can't have all these fish together and am also thinking about using my 75 gallon to do the seahorses. These are my favorite fish after searchng for months. I love bright colors. I am most in love with occelaris clownfish and blue powder tang and am aware I can't tackle this until later on...just trying to plan ahead. Oh, I want a BPT so bad. I know I will get one against all advice when my tank is VERY ESTABLISHED b/c of the good stories I've heard and the beauty of this fish....and also I am a VERY dedicated mommy. lol. but I am developing a real problem with wild caught fish because of some horror stories I've read recently. I hope I am at least going to be able to find the BPT tank bred as I know I can find the clowns. If anyone knows of captive bred blue powder tangs PLEASE give me the link. Smile ....or even for the regal tang (blue)... I haven't seen any of these fish captive bred except clowns. How do you all feel about wild caught fish being stuck in an aquarium? Maybe there's something I don't know. I'm just a sensitive person especially when it comes to animals and fish. They're like humans to me. Anyways,
WOOOWWWY about the lights. Do you have a link? How many thousands of dollars did THOSE cost? j/k. lol Would these lights be just as strong as mh or t5ho's and be good for all coral/difficult animals? Unfortuantly no clubs here. My husband is going to do the plumbing when he gets back from the "sandbox". I was supposed to get the equipment while he's gone. I hope this isn't going to be a problem. ....sounds like it could be....

But now the PVC glue has worn off and I can think MUCH more clearly

LOL HILARIOUS. :hammerhea he he
Ok, here's one more question. sigh. I just heard about "closed loop system". Is this cheaper/more expensive in the long run or initial cost? Is this better for water quality? Does it matter what kind of fish or coral I want to decide this?
THANKS !!!!

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[/IMG]I think I might get the photos to post this time. ...hope so.
Oh, THE LAST PIC IS 1/2 THE TANK. THERE ARE 2 OVERFLOWS WITH 2 HOLES EACH. ...don't know if this would help or not....

 

[Anselth]

First I just want to thank you guys for replying. I have a hard time getting responses sometimes. I think it's because I have too many questions. Sorry. Why have some people suggested external pump(s) instead of powerheads? Are these cheaper/more expensive? Do they use more or less power?

Well, one of the benefits to an external pump used for extra flow (usually called a closed loop system) Is that you eliminate the look of the powerheads in the tank. When coupled with an Ocean's Motion or similar system, you can randomize the flow in your tank. This also helps cut down on heat and stray electrical voltage, depending on the pump used.

Oh loooooord. ha ha. I don't know what coral I want yet.....so I have to figure this out before I buy my pump? I wonder how much money I could lose if I bought overpowered stuff. This is the only aspect I'm not sure of. I was going to figure this out after the equipment. There are so many to chose from and here is the big problem for me: I was so set on anemones and blue carpet anemone and then found out that the blue carpet anemone can secrete bad stuff into the water so that killed a 11 month dream in less than a second. lol. silently pouted big time over that for a couple weeks. ha ha. The problem is I like all the coral. I thought you could mix it altogether. So tell me what I need to do with this roadblock? Do I really need to figure this out now? ....b/c I am so picky. It would probably take me months to figure out EXACTLY what I wanted. lol. ?? help. ??

You can mix and match soft corals, LPS, and SPS to a degree, you just have to pay attention to what species you are putting together and where they are in relationship to eachother. Softies have a habit of releasing chemicals into the water to inhibit the growth of other corals. Activated carbon use can greatly reduce the impact of these compounds. LPS and SPS sometimes have sweeper tentacles, which require that they be given more space so they don't sting their neighbors.

As far as flow goes, you can keep lower flow loving species in areas where rockwork breaks up the current. You can also aim your returns/powerheads in such a way as they create areas of intermittent flow. High flow through the tank doesn't necessarily translate into high flow everywhere, you just need to find out what areas are good for what coral.

but I have an IDEA of the fish I want:
yellow faced jawfish
seahorses
ocellaris clownfish
blue jaw tilefish - (very active lives on bottom - so probably not with the seahorses, right?)
blue powder tangs
regal tang,
other tangs? maybe lemon peel
racoon butterfly fish,
maybe an Angel Fish
I realize I can't have all these fish together and am also thinking about using my 75 gallon to do the seahorses. These are my favorite fish after searchng for months. I love bright colors. I am most in love with occelaris clownfish and blue powder tang and am aware I can't tackle this until later on...just trying to plan ahead. Oh, I want a BPT so bad. I know I will get one against all advice when my tank is VERY ESTABLISHED b/c of the good stories I've heard and the beauty of this fish....and also I am a VERY dedicated mommy. lol. but I am developing a real problem with wild caught fish because of some horror stories I've read recently. I hope I am at least going to be able to find the BPT tank bred as I know I can find the clowns. If anyone knows of captive bred blue powder tangs PLEASE give me the link. Smile ....or even for the regal tang (blue)... I haven't seen any of these fish captive bred except clowns. How do you all feel about wild caught fish being stuck in an aquarium? Maybe there's something I don't know. I'm just a sensitive person especially when it comes to animals and fish. They're like humans to me.

Seahorses will definitely need their own system. They require lower temperatures (round 72 degrees F, I think) and non-boisterous tankmates, which tangs and clowns definitely do NOT qualify as. You're going to run into issues with that many tangs in such a small tank, I think. Tangs can be quite aggressive and I wouldn't keep more than one in a 120 gallon tank. There's a thread on here (I think under the fish forum) called "so you want a tang?" I'd check that out for more information.

I'm not too familiar with the Raccoon Butterflyfish, but I don't think they're one of the reef-safe species. Butterflies as a group like to eat corals and inverts, although some, like the Copper Banded Butterfly and the Heniochus are generally considered reef-safe, although keeping a CBB alive seems to be hit or miss. As far as angels, only consider a dwarf variety, and be cautious. Mine is a model citizen, but some will munch corals and clam mantles. It all depends on the individual.