Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef?

danz24 · 10-22-2007, 10:47 PM

This might determine how long I will actually stay in this forum. But is a 7 gallon tank enough to start a nano reef?
And also how much would it cost approximately to startup one?

dobejazz · 10-22-2007, 11:02 PM

It can be done but it is difficult to keep parameters in check in such a small water volume.

If this is your first try at a reef I'd suggest starting at 20-30g as the smallest

kathywithbirds · 10-22-2007, 11:12 PM

I started with a 5 gallon. I found it hard to keep the temp down on it.

Tank was $100, came with pc lights, bought a $20 cheapy skimmer and a $20 air pump for it, used the filter included in the unit too, then add whatever the cost of the live rock (think I paid $6 a lb., got 6 lbs.).

Long story short, now I have a 75 gallon and I LOVE IT.

BigAl07 · 10-22-2007, 11:22 PM

7 gallon CAN be done but in all honesty it's MUCH (can't stress how STRONGLY this is meant to HELP you) MUCH easier with a larger tank.

If you shop around you can get a slightly larger tank without much more investment. The longer you take to research and plan the more money you can save. Trust me when I say, "It's worth EVERY penny and THEN some!".

Allen

danz24 · 10-22-2007, 11:29 PM

I have a heater already that keeps the temp at about 25 celius, and a filter. Im willing to invest a few minutes a day for maintenance, just not to the point where I come home from school hoping my fish arent dead.

I know I have to buy a protein skimmer, salt water and new lighting. Just wanted to know approximately how much I have to spend to get started. Would a $200 budget be reasonable? I don't want to be in the wrong hobby if its too expensive.

I actually have a 25 gal but its in the hallway but dont want to use it because i dont appreciate it much. I only see it briefly walking by. The 7 gallon is on my desk so I can appreciate the beauty more and can observe it better for any fluctuations.

dobejazz · 10-22-2007, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danz24

I have a heater already that keeps the temp at about 25 celius, and a filter. Im willing to invest a few minutes a day for maintenance, just not to the point where I come home from school hoping my fish arent dead.

I know I have to buy a protein skimmer, salt water and new lighting. Just wanted to know approximately how much I have to spend to get started. Would a $200 budget be reasonable? I don't want to be in the wrong hobby if its too expensive.

I actually have a 25 gal but its in the hallway but dont want to use it because i dont appreciate it much. I only see it briefly walking by. The 7 gallon is on my desk so I can appreciate the beauty more and can observe it better for any fluctuations.

You don't need a skimmer on the 7g weekly water changes will be fine
I have a 5.5g on my desk and I love it

BigAl07 · 10-22-2007, 11:39 PM

Kelli even though I know it's possible to run skimmerless on just about ANY size tank, the addition of a skimmer is really a STRONG need for any "reef" tank. I know others who have a small tank without a skimmer but you really have to "Stay on TOP of your game" with the water changes or your water quality will very quickly hit the wall. I have to say that if you're wanting to go "minimalist" with maintenance you MUST have a skimmer (and have a tough time telling ANYONE with a REEF desire to fore-go a skimmer).

With all due respect I have to disagree about a skimmer. It just does so MUCH good for your reef tank and many times you aren't getting enough of the DOC's out of the water with normal water changes.

Allen

danz24 · 10-22-2007, 11:48 PM

Alright maybe i should change my question a bit. Is there an faq or link that someone can share with me to introduce the basics of a nano reef, preferably tailored to one that is my size of 7 gallons.??

also my 2 questions. I would prefer to have these main questions answered throughly before I start diving deep and making a serious commitment. And thanks for the help so far you guys have been helpful to the new guy.
1. Is the maintenance really that hard, keeping in mind I am willing to devote at least 15minutes (if necessary) daily. What kind of maintenance are we talking about?
2. Roughly what is the startup cost.

dobejazz · 10-23-2007, 12:11 AM

I'm not sure what kind of lighting is on the mini bow so there may be costs involved upgrading lighting

Your main expense will be Live rock 2-10$ a pound depending on whats available in your area

If it were me I'd buy bottled RO/DI for top off and you can buy premade ASW at many Saltwater fish stores (around here anyway)

maintence would be daily topping off with Fresh water to replace evaporation and weekly waterchages I'd do a gallon a week

Is there anything in particular you are interested in keeping ??? that will go a long way in determining some of your start up costs

danz24 · 10-23-2007, 12:15 AM

I want to have those corals of all colours and a dynamic aquarium, I wanted a starfish, hermit crab and small animals but i think they are included with the rocks. I also want to add an anemone with a clownfish.

reefman420 · 10-23-2007, 12:40 AM

no anenome in that small a tank,,but im no profesionall..And id wait agood year to buy one.they need pristine water conditions

Jason25 · 10-23-2007, 08:15 AM

Although I am fairly new to saltwater I have read so much and learned from everyone in here I feel I can share some info with you.

1st off in a tank that small you are going to be very limited in what you can keep in it both as fish and corals.

As already stated water parameters will be hard to maintain.

Saltwater is not a cheap hobby by any means, although in a tank that small it may be a bit more managable. Just keep in the back of your mind I can almost guarantee that once you see how beautiful and how much funa SW tank can be you will want to upgrade in size and then comes the expenses.

I am not by any means trying to discourage your interest in this hobby because it is so much fun, I am just trying to fore warn you of things to come.

One other thing I forgot to mention is that in a tank that small changes in water or heat will be very drastic and happen quickly.

Keep asking for help here before you make decision and things will be easier on you, your tank and your wallet.

kathywithbirds · 10-23-2007, 10:25 AM

Hey Dan, I take it you're a student? YOu could keep costs down with a 7 gallon, but it is a commitment, sometimes you spend 5 minutes a day just feeding and changing the skimmer cup, other days you spend an hour or two... (or three 10 hour days setting up a big tank : ) ... so yes, do your research before starting this up.

If you already have the tank: live sand can be $10 to $25 for that size tank, it comes packed in plastic OR you can get "dead" aragonite sand, a little less. Live rock is VERY IMPORTANT. You get that at the store $2 to $10 a lb, the rule of thumb is 1 to 2 lbs per gallon, so you're looking at upwards of 14 lbs. The average price I've seen if $6 per lb, so that comes to $84 for that. There's a Lee's skimmer that's just basically a plastic tube (do your research on what skimmers do) that you hook up to an air pump. That's $40 for both of those. Salt mix runs about $15 for enough for 25 gallons (depending on what brand, it can go up) and you're going to be using that on a weekly basis, siphoning out water (20% seems to be the recommended amt) and replacing with newly mixed saltwater. And you need to spend time mixing that up. YOu've got a heater, OK. What else? Lights. Do your research on lights. what lights are on the tank you have now? you need some STRONG lights for an anemone, and you shouldn't put one in a tank that small OR without metal halide lights (well, that's cause for debate, another subject) and those are minimum $300 new.

Have I scared you yet on the prices?

Test kits! you need a basic saltwater test kit to start, $25, you should regularly test the water for levels of stuff. a hydrometer or refractometer, $5 to $100, this is what tells you how much salt is in the water (basically...)

Then comes the prices for fish and invertebrates... $3 for your basic damselfish, and the prices LEAP from there... check out RS on here somewhere for michael_cb's thread on getting a $4,000 fish (a joke but the price is very real). You'll need a "clean up crew" after a while -- snails and/or hermit crabs, maybe things like cucumbrs or starfish that eat, well, the crap and leftover food and waste and icky stuff in the sand and tank.

There's ALOT to read about EVERYTHIGN about this hobby, it's not cheap, it's time consuming but it's addictive and incredibly rewarding.

BigAl07 · 10-23-2007, 10:38 AM

Dan,
If you're intent to get started on such a small tank I would really TRY to NOT get a fish in it.. at least until you can get a handle of the "duties" of a reef tank. Get it started with your basics (sand, rock, filtration etc) and then once it's ready for live stock add shrimp, crabs and or snails. Let them get established and get used to how the tank "acts". Once you have done that for a while then you can consider a small fish. Keep in mind that the rule of thumb (especially for a beginner to learn by) is 1" of adult fish per 5 gallons of water. That's conservative but you'll need ALL the conservation you can get to learn as you go. This rules out MANY of the fish most people WANT when they think of Salt Water. A great fish for a small tank is a goby type of fish. They are small and very calm fish that don't tend to try and jump out of the tank. I have a pair of Neon Gobies that I love. Very colorful and active fish.

You're going to have to be dedicated to testing and maintaining your water chemistry. That's the hardest part of this. If you see something slipping in your tests react with the right action to keep it from snow balling out of control. With 7 gallons of water (actual amount will be mush less once you add Sand, Rock and other decorations) things happen very quickly.

A small "Pico" type tank is VERY doable and the maintenance daily is minimal. I spend maybe 3 minutes a day through the week on my 12g reef tank and maybe 7 minutes a day on my 10g Reef tank. But on the weekends I spend more than that (a lot more) mixing fresh water, testing existing water, cleaning tanks, adding new water and making any "adjustments" that the tank needs.

Hang in there... it's well worth the efforts.

Allen

flricordia · 10-24-2007, 01:35 AM

Agree with just about every post so far. If you start with a 7gl don't do any fish for a few months at least. If worst comes to worst keep it a single small goby or something. First make sure the tank cycles all the way before adding any pricey livestock.
Don't need a skimmer really. There are some good fiter mediums that with a tank that size could be changed out often enough and kept fresh. One product I started using in my tank back in Aug 06 and am still using that works good for me is this Aquarium Chemical Filtration & Algae Removal: Drs. Foster & Smith PhosPureÂ® Pads and water chanes every week to 2 weeks. So far I have not had to use a skimmer.
As far as heat issues you can get a small fan to blow across the surface to keep the tank cool, but at the same time you will have a much higher water evaporation rate and will need to stay on top of top-off water.
But all in all, the most important piece of equipment that will either make or break your tank is a good RO/DI unit.
Best advice is to listen to what everyone is telling you as they have all gone through it and know what to do and what not to do.

10-22-2007, 10:47 PM	#1 (permalink)
danz24 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 6 View Gallery Karma Komment	Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? This might determine how long I will actually stay in this forum. But is a 7 gallon tank enough to start a nano reef? And also how much would it cost approximately to startup one?

10-22-2007, 11:02 PM	#2 (permalink)
dobejazz Elegance coral Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 1,246 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? It can be done but it is difficult to keep parameters in check in such a small water volume. If this is your first try at a reef I'd suggest starting at 20-30g as the smallest __________________ Kelli

10-22-2007, 11:12 PM	#3 (permalink)
kathywithbirds Social Darwinism victim Join Date: May 2007 Location: The Hood, NJ Posts: 5,836 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? I started with a 5 gallon. I found it hard to keep the temp down on it. Tank was $100, came with pc lights, bought a $20 cheapy skimmer and a $20 air pump for it, used the filter included in the unit too, then add whatever the cost of the live rock (think I paid $6 a lb., got 6 lbs.). Long story short, now I have a 75 gallon and I LOVE IT. __________________ (\_/) (\__/) ( . .) (^.^) (")(") (> <) Bunny and Bunnina have worked things out. Bunny was mistaken after all, Bunnina was not having an affair. "Besides the noble art of getting things done, there is the noble art of leaving things undone. The wisdom of life consists in the elimination of non-essentials." ~Lin Yutang

10-22-2007, 11:29 PM	#5 (permalink)
danz24 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 6 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? I have a heater already that keeps the temp at about 25 celius, and a filter. Im willing to invest a few minutes a day for maintenance, just not to the point where I come home from school hoping my fish arent dead. I know I have to buy a protein skimmer, salt water and new lighting. Just wanted to know approximately how much I have to spend to get started. Would a $200 budget be reasonable? I don't want to be in the wrong hobby if its too expensive. I actually have a 25 gal but its in the hallway but dont want to use it because i dont appreciate it much. I only see it briefly walking by. The 7 gallon is on my desk so I can appreciate the beauty more and can observe it better for any fluctuations.

10-22-2007, 11:48 PM	#8 (permalink)
danz24 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 6 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? Alright maybe i should change my question a bit. Is there an faq or link that someone can share with me to introduce the basics of a nano reef, preferably tailored to one that is my size of 7 gallons.?? also my 2 questions. I would prefer to have these main questions answered throughly before I start diving deep and making a serious commitment. And thanks for the help so far you guys have been helpful to the new guy. 1. Is the maintenance really that hard, keeping in mind I am willing to devote at least 15minutes (if necessary) daily. What kind of maintenance are we talking about? 2. Roughly what is the startup cost.

10-23-2007, 12:11 AM	#9 (permalink)
dobejazz Elegance coral Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 1,246 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? I'm not sure what kind of lighting is on the mini bow so there may be costs involved upgrading lighting Your main expense will be Live rock 2-10$ a pound depending on whats available in your area If it were me I'd buy bottled RO/DI for top off and you can buy premade ASW at many Saltwater fish stores (around here anyway) maintence would be daily topping off with Fresh water to replace evaporation and weekly waterchages I'd do a gallon a week Is there anything in particular you are interested in keeping ??? that will go a long way in determining some of your start up costs __________________ Kelli

10-23-2007, 12:15 AM	#10 (permalink)
danz24 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 6 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? I want to have those corals of all colours and a dynamic aquarium, I wanted a starfish, hermit crab and small animals but i think they are included with the rocks. I also want to add an anemone with a clownfish.

10-23-2007, 12:40 AM	#11 (permalink)
reefman420 Elegance coral Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: minneapolis Posts: 1,085 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? no anenome in that small a tank,,but im no profesionall..And id wait agood year to buy one.they need pristine water conditions __________________ 155 oceanic bow front,20 long refuge packed with caluerpa and mangroves,40 gallon sump,175lbs LR,3x250 watt xm 10ks,aqua-c remora,and pro-clear 150 skimmers sailfin tang,kole tang,royal gramma,cinnimon clown,2xpink skunk clowns,six line wrasse,mandarin, 155 bow coral-orange montipora cap,superman monti cap,scripps green polyped staghorn,ORA pink poccilipora,ORA blue millipora,green slimer,yellow UK acro,pink birdsnest,armor of god zoas,various zoas and shrooms,hammer,frogspawn,clove polyps,favite,fancey toadstool,reg toadstool,yellow leather,purple leather,devils hand,2 types xenia,ricordea florida,ricordea yuma,kenya tree,galaxia,bubble coral,button polyps inverts are lots of snails and hermits,crocea clam,maxima clam and seabae anemone,rbta

10-23-2007, 08:15 AM	#12 (permalink)
Jason25 Elegance coral Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Lancaster,PA Posts: 1,024 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? Although I am fairly new to saltwater I have read so much and learned from everyone in here I feel I can share some info with you. 1st off in a tank that small you are going to be very limited in what you can keep in it both as fish and corals. As already stated water parameters will be hard to maintain. Saltwater is not a cheap hobby by any means, although in a tank that small it may be a bit more managable. Just keep in the back of your mind I can almost guarantee that once you see how beautiful and how much funa SW tank can be you will want to upgrade in size and then comes the expenses. I am not by any means trying to discourage your interest in this hobby because it is so much fun, I am just trying to fore warn you of things to come. One other thing I forgot to mention is that in a tank that small changes in water or heat will be very drastic and happen quickly. Keep asking for help here before you make decision and things will be easier on you, your tank and your wallet.

10-23-2007, 10:25 AM	#13 (permalink)
kathywithbirds Social Darwinism victim Join Date: May 2007 Location: The Hood, NJ Posts: 5,836 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? Hey Dan, I take it you're a student? YOu could keep costs down with a 7 gallon, but it is a commitment, sometimes you spend 5 minutes a day just feeding and changing the skimmer cup, other days you spend an hour or two... (or three 10 hour days setting up a big tank : ) ... so yes, do your research before starting this up. If you already have the tank: live sand can be $10 to $25 for that size tank, it comes packed in plastic OR you can get "dead" aragonite sand, a little less. Live rock is VERY IMPORTANT. You get that at the store $2 to $10 a lb, the rule of thumb is 1 to 2 lbs per gallon, so you're looking at upwards of 14 lbs. The average price I've seen if $6 per lb, so that comes to $84 for that. There's a Lee's skimmer that's just basically a plastic tube (do your research on what skimmers do) that you hook up to an air pump. That's $40 for both of those. Salt mix runs about $15 for enough for 25 gallons (depending on what brand, it can go up) and you're going to be using that on a weekly basis, siphoning out water (20% seems to be the recommended amt) and replacing with newly mixed saltwater. And you need to spend time mixing that up. YOu've got a heater, OK. What else? Lights. Do your research on lights. what lights are on the tank you have now? you need some STRONG lights for an anemone, and you shouldn't put one in a tank that small OR without metal halide lights (well, that's cause for debate, another subject) and those are minimum $300 new. Have I scared you yet on the prices? Test kits! you need a basic saltwater test kit to start, $25, you should regularly test the water for levels of stuff. a hydrometer or refractometer, $5 to $100, this is what tells you how much salt is in the water (basically...) Then comes the prices for fish and invertebrates... $3 for your basic damselfish, and the prices LEAP from there... check out RS on here somewhere for michael_cb's thread on getting a $4,000 fish (a joke but the price is very real). You'll need a "clean up crew" after a while -- snails and/or hermit crabs, maybe things like cucumbrs or starfish that eat, well, the crap and leftover food and waste and icky stuff in the sand and tank. There's ALOT to read about EVERYTHIGN about this hobby, it's not cheap, it's time consuming but it's addictive and incredibly rewarding. __________________ (\_/) (\__/) ( . .) (^.^) (")(") (> <) Bunny and Bunnina have worked things out. Bunny was mistaken after all, Bunnina was not having an affair. "Besides the noble art of getting things done, there is the noble art of leaving things undone. The wisdom of life consists in the elimination of non-essentials." ~Lin Yutang

10-24-2007, 01:35 AM	#15 (permalink)
flricordia Just Mike for short Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pensacola FL Posts: 599 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Is 7 gallon enough for a nano reef? Agree with just about every post so far. If you start with a 7gl don't do any fish for a few months at least. If worst comes to worst keep it a single small goby or something. First make sure the tank cycles all the way before adding any pricey livestock. Don't need a skimmer really. There are some good fiter mediums that with a tank that size could be changed out often enough and kept fresh. One product I started using in my tank back in Aug 06 and am still using that works good for me is this Aquarium Chemical Filtration & Algae Removal: Drs. Foster & Smith PhosPureÂ® Pads and water chanes every week to 2 weeks. So far I have not had to use a skimmer. As far as heat issues you can get a small fan to blow across the surface to keep the tank cool, but at the same time you will have a much higher water evaporation rate and will need to stay on top of top-off water. But all in all, the most important piece of equipment that will either make or break your tank is a good RO/DI unit. Best advice is to listen to what everyone is telling you as they have all gone through it and know what to do and what not to do.

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