Hello...hating life during new tank cycling

Chris3859 · 03-20-2008, 08:23 PM

First....hello to everyone. I am new to the saltwater world, but not a new aquarist. I have had a 40 tall Oceanic African cichlid tank off and on for 15 years. The only time I didn't have it was for a 4 year tour in the Marine Corps.

I just started a 55+ saltwater tank last Friday. It is currently cycling with live rock and live sand. I am so surprised what live rock will do. I tested the water this a.m. and the ammonia, and nitrite was 0 and nitrate was 5. I have to admit, saltwater is already vastly different from freshwater.

I have one word. Diatoms. When do they go away? I was thinking of doing a half and half tank. A few hardy corals and 1 or 2 anemones, a tang and a few clowns. Anyone have a tank setup similar to this? If so, can I get a few good coral names to research?

Thanks!

framerguy · 03-20-2008, 08:36 PM

Welcome to RS! You are right about reefing being different from FW. A few LPS or soft corals would probably be a good place to start looking. Euphylia, caulastrea, blastomussa, Discosoma, protopalythoa, sinularia, sarcophyton, ...that's enough to start with.

lcstorc · 03-20-2008, 08:42 PM

Welcome to RS!
The one thing about saltwater is that you want to go very slowly and do a lot of research.
What did you use to cycle the tank? It doesn't sound like you are cycled yet with those numbers. Add an amonia source to the tank. Most use a piece of raw shrimp from the store. As the shrimp rots it creates amonia. As your bacteria builds they convert the amonia to nitrite. Then as the bacteria increases it converts the nitrites to nitrates. Once your bacteria levels set up the nitrates with be converted to a harnless gas. Not all of them but most. You remove the rest during regular regular water changes.
I couple of points I want to mention. You need to use RO or RO/DI water for all tank uses. Otherwise you wil be adding various harmful items into the tank.
Second anemones are only suitable for a well established tank that has has stable parameters for a minimum of a year. They also require a lot of light and will move wherever they want as well as eat any fish they want.
Finally, Please do not get a tang. Your tank is simply too small for these large active fish.
Enjoy the hobby it is great learning and then seeing the results.

nikkipigtails · 03-20-2008, 08:42 PM

welcome! mushrooms and zoas are hardy and easy. anemones are really difficult, have intense lighting needs and require a well established tank not to mention that when they roam, they can sting your other corals. do a LOT of research before deciding to buy one.

Chris3859 · 03-20-2008, 08:54 PM

Wow, excellent info within a matter of minutes.

My tank is nowhere near done cycling. I was just commenting on how chemical levels differ with a new SW tank using live rock versus a new FW tank. I still have several weeks to go...

...before cycling is complete.

OK, I will hold off on the anemones for now. But, is my light source good enough to support them. It is a Coralife lunar aqualight. It utilizes 4 PC bulbs, 2 10k and 2 actinic blue and 4 3/4 watt LED lunar lights. Of course, no glass hood on my setup.

I have to purchase my R/o water from my LFS. Pretty cheap, but lugging water sucks. A home unit is just not pratical right now, as I want to understand the SW realm before I buy lots of extra goodies.

BTW...I'm not sure about my skimmer. It is a coralife 65g. I feel it may be a little small, and I had to modify it for the HOB feature to work. There has got to be something better out there.

OK OK...no tangs!

I swear I have Discosoma already attached on my LR. It will probably die, but it is there.

-Chris

lcstorc · 03-20-2008, 09:08 PM

No, those lights will not be enough for an anemone or for hard corals. You should be fine with softies and such. Do you have a sump with your setup? If you do I would highly recommend the ASM G-1x or 2 for your system. You always want a skimmer rated for twice the volume of the tank. If you do not have a skimmer than an Aqua C Remora plus would make a great HOB skimer.

Chris3859 · 03-20-2008, 09:17 PM

I figured my skimmer was a little small, although it is producing some coffee looking skimmate.

I paid like $320 dollars for that light! I use a pretty good size lfs. They are mainly SW retailers. The owner said it would be good for just about anything. The better half of me said buy the MH light at the start and be done with it. Oh well, lesson #1 learned. Buy the good stuff from the get go.

I don't use a sump. I use the Rena x3 canister. There again, I'm not sure if I like the canister on a SW tank. I may build a sump with and old 29g tank i have and use a manufactured HOB overflow. Suggestions on this type of setup?

BarbMazz · 03-20-2008, 09:31 PM

Hi, Chris, and welcome... you're already getting some good information here I see!

Reefing is way different from FW, and I think patience is the biggest difference I can see. I've been researching since November and I'm just about ready to add water. Been collecting equipment since then, and spending lots of money, too!

Once I get water into my tank and cycle the rock, I'm letting things settle in for about three months before I start adding livestock. I want to learn the water chemistry and get it dialed in.. watch the herbivores mow down the algae as it comes and get really familiar with it before I start to complicate it more. I figure the more mature it is, the easier the time my creatures will have when I do add them.

I think a sump setup is a good way to go; it adds water volume to the system, it gives you a place to put equipment rather than in the display, it gives you a place for a "refugium" which can help with 'pod production and nitrate uptake, etc.

There's lots of ways to set them up. One way: water flows down from display into first section where skimmer is, flows over-under-over baffles into refugium, flows over another baffle in to the return section, where the return pump pumps water back up to the display. There are many variations on that theme, too.

Dentoid · 03-20-2008, 09:31 PM

Welcome Chris. The ugly duckling stage is a hard time during the reefing process, but it'll be worth it. Take it slow and you will be rewarded with beauty and education beyond your wildest dreams! All the best!

heels92 · 03-20-2008, 10:19 PM

Welcome...Great advice one here. Some of us are hardheaded and learn from failure...lol. I have had 3 tangs in my 65 gallon and all have failed. Frankie warned me of that, lol. It is good you found this site, I wish i had found it in the beginning.

I would recommend a good skimmer...and go slow. Soft corals are what I started with...Leathers, mushrooms, etc. Although I added my anemone after about 6 months and have had no problems. Been doing this for 2 1/2 years. I guess I got lucky.

You would definitely need more light though. And they do move around until they get settled.

sasquatch · 03-20-2008, 11:39 PM

Hey Chris Welcome to RS! enjoy the cycling time its about the only time tank acne is expected if it comes later its just a nightmare lol

Frankie · 03-20-2008, 11:49 PM

Welcome to RS Chris!

Chris3859 · 03-20-2008, 11:59 PM

Thanks for all the welcomes and advice. Tank acne!!?? That's funny as all get out sasquatch!!!!

BarbMazz · 03-21-2008, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris3859

Thanks for all the welcomes and advice. Tank acne!!?? That's funny as all get out sasquatch!!!!

Ah, Chris, you'll learn.... sasquatch is one of our very best. If you're lucky he'll throw poem your way, or something.

Chris3859 · 03-21-2008, 12:10 AM

Poems, rap, jokes...anything to break up watching this empty tank cycle. Wow, live rock doesn't really swim all that fast...LOL!

03-20-2008, 08:23 PM	#1 (permalink)
Chris3859 Ricordea Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Beaumont, Texas Posts: 193 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Hello...hating life during new tank cycling First....hello to everyone. I am new to the saltwater world, but not a new aquarist. I have had a 40 tall Oceanic African cichlid tank off and on for 15 years. The only time I didn't have it was for a 4 year tour in the Marine Corps. I just started a 55+ saltwater tank last Friday. It is currently cycling with live rock and live sand. I am so surprised what live rock will do. I tested the water this a.m. and the ammonia, and nitrite was 0 and nitrate was 5. I have to admit, saltwater is already vastly different from freshwater. I have one word. Diatoms. When do they go away? I was thinking of doing a half and half tank. A few hardy corals and 1 or 2 anemones, a tang and a few clowns. Anyone have a tank setup similar to this? If so, can I get a few good coral names to research? Thanks! __________________ Chris Tanks stats: 1)Big 2)Expensive 3)Time Consuming Just got my Discover bill--> "There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines...Marines and those who have met them in battle. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion." -Unknown

03-20-2008, 08:36 PM	#2 (permalink)
framerguy Golden Moray Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Mount Airy, Ga Posts: 2,920 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Welcome to RS! You are right about reefing being different from FW. A few LPS or soft corals would probably be a good place to start looking. Euphylia, caulastrea, blastomussa, Discosoma, protopalythoa, sinularia, sarcophyton, ...that's enough to start with. __________________ ___________________________________ Greg All time fav quote: "Now and then it's good to pause in our pursuit of happiness and just be happy."-Guillaume Apollinaire "Being happy can be as easy as deciding to be!"-Greg Kimsey (framerguy) 75g Main, 55g Fuge w/DSB/+-25#LR, 25g Sump, turboflotor skimmer, 2x250w MH(9hrs/d), 4x65w PC(14h/d), 950gph mag drive/seaswirl return, 100# LR, 3" SB chronicles-akwareum (\___/) This is Bunny. (=O.o=) Copy and paste him into your signature (")__(") to help him gain world domination

03-20-2008, 08:42 PM	#3 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 16,423 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Welcome to RS! The one thing about saltwater is that you want to go very slowly and do a lot of research. What did you use to cycle the tank? It doesn't sound like you are cycled yet with those numbers. Add an amonia source to the tank. Most use a piece of raw shrimp from the store. As the shrimp rots it creates amonia. As your bacteria builds they convert the amonia to nitrite. Then as the bacteria increases it converts the nitrites to nitrates. Once your bacteria levels set up the nitrates with be converted to a harnless gas. Not all of them but most. You remove the rest during regular regular water changes. I couple of points I want to mention. You need to use RO or RO/DI water for all tank uses. Otherwise you wil be adding various harmful items into the tank. Second anemones are only suitable for a well established tank that has has stable parameters for a minimum of a year. They also require a lot of light and will move wherever they want as well as eat any fish they want. Finally, Please do not get a tang. Your tank is simply too small for these large active fish. Enjoy the hobby it is great learning and then seeing the results. __________________ Peace LYNN You can't change the past but you can change how you view it. A reef tank is like a racecar. The faster you go the harder you crash. Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g Jawfish enjoyment ASM answer girl. Every 60 seconds you spend upset is a minute of happiness you'll never get back.

03-20-2008, 08:42 PM	#4 (permalink)
nikkipigtails Elegance coral Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Hillbilly Hell, AL Posts: 1,100 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling welcome! mushrooms and zoas are hardy and easy. anemones are really difficult, have intense lighting needs and require a well established tank not to mention that when they roam, they can sting your other corals. do a LOT of research before deciding to buy one. __________________ Our 180 Gallon Family Project

03-20-2008, 08:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
Chris3859 Ricordea Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Beaumont, Texas Posts: 193 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Wow, excellent info within a matter of minutes. My tank is nowhere near done cycling. I was just commenting on how chemical levels differ with a new SW tank using live rock versus a new FW tank. I still have several weeks to go... ...before cycling is complete. OK, I will hold off on the anemones for now. But, is my light source good enough to support them. It is a Coralife lunar aqualight. It utilizes 4 PC bulbs, 2 10k and 2 actinic blue and 4 3/4 watt LED lunar lights. Of course, no glass hood on my setup. I have to purchase my R/o water from my LFS. Pretty cheap, but lugging water sucks. A home unit is just not pratical right now, as I want to understand the SW realm before I buy lots of extra goodies. BTW...I'm not sure about my skimmer. It is a coralife 65g. I feel it may be a little small, and I had to modify it for the HOB feature to work. There has got to be something better out there. OK OK...no tangs! I swear I have Discosoma already attached on my LR. It will probably die, but it is there. -Chris __________________ Chris Tanks stats: 1)Big 2)Expensive 3)Time Consuming Just got my Discover bill--> "There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines...Marines and those who have met them in battle. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion." -Unknown Last edited by Chris3859 : 03-20-2008 at 08:57 PM. Reason: Forgot this

03-20-2008, 09:08 PM	#6 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 16,423 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling No, those lights will not be enough for an anemone or for hard corals. You should be fine with softies and such. Do you have a sump with your setup? If you do I would highly recommend the ASM G-1x or 2 for your system. You always want a skimmer rated for twice the volume of the tank. If you do not have a skimmer than an Aqua C Remora plus would make a great HOB skimer. __________________ Peace LYNN You can't change the past but you can change how you view it. A reef tank is like a racecar. The faster you go the harder you crash. Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g Jawfish enjoyment ASM answer girl. Every 60 seconds you spend upset is a minute of happiness you'll never get back.

03-20-2008, 09:17 PM	#7 (permalink)
Chris3859 Ricordea Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Beaumont, Texas Posts: 193 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling I figured my skimmer was a little small, although it is producing some coffee looking skimmate. I paid like $320 dollars for that light! I use a pretty good size lfs. They are mainly SW retailers. The owner said it would be good for just about anything. The better half of me said buy the MH light at the start and be done with it. Oh well, lesson #1 learned. Buy the good stuff from the get go. I don't use a sump. I use the Rena x3 canister. There again, I'm not sure if I like the canister on a SW tank. I may build a sump with and old 29g tank i have and use a manufactured HOB overflow. Suggestions on this type of setup? __________________ Chris Tanks stats: 1)Big 2)Expensive 3)Time Consuming Just got my Discover bill--> "There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines...Marines and those who have met them in battle. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion." -Unknown

03-20-2008, 09:31 PM	#8 (permalink)
BarbMazz Keeper of The List Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Near Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 2,404 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Hi, Chris, and welcome... you're already getting some good information here I see! Reefing is way different from FW, and I think patience is the biggest difference I can see. I've been researching since November and I'm just about ready to add water. Been collecting equipment since then, and spending lots of money, too! Once I get water into my tank and cycle the rock, I'm letting things settle in for about three months before I start adding livestock. I want to learn the water chemistry and get it dialed in.. watch the herbivores mow down the algae as it comes and get really familiar with it before I start to complicate it more. I figure the more mature it is, the easier the time my creatures will have when I do add them. I think a sump setup is a good way to go; it adds water volume to the system, it gives you a place to put equipment rather than in the display, it gives you a place for a "refugium" which can help with 'pod production and nitrate uptake, etc. There's lots of ways to set them up. One way: water flows down from display into first section where skimmer is, flows over-under-over baffles into refugium, flows over another baffle in to the return section, where the return pump pumps water back up to the display. There are many variations on that theme, too. __________________ ~not knowing how near the truth is we seek it far away~ "when we were created, the world already had a Reef Central. what it lacked was a Reef Sanctuary" ~travis~ Sorry Bunny. I just couldn't do it any longer.

03-20-2008, 09:31 PM	#9 (permalink)
Dentoid Over Achiever Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Virginia Posts: 9,529 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Welcome Chris. The ugly duckling stage is a hard time during the reefing process, but it'll be worth it. Take it slow and you will be rewarded with beauty and education beyond your wildest dreams! All the best! __________________ Scott Dentoid's Reeforama

03-20-2008, 10:19 PM	#10 (permalink)
heels92 Serpent Star Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mount Pleasant, SC Posts: 237 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Welcome...Great advice one here. Some of us are hardheaded and learn from failure...lol. I have had 3 tangs in my 65 gallon and all have failed. Frankie warned me of that, lol. It is good you found this site, I wish i had found it in the beginning. I would recommend a good skimmer...and go slow. Soft corals are what I started with...Leathers, mushrooms, etc. Although I added my anemone after about 6 months and have had no problems. Been doing this for 2 1/2 years. I guess I got lucky. You would definitely need more light though. And they do move around until they get settled. __________________ 65 gal reef with fish. 250 14k mh, 2 2x96in actinic pc, berlin protein skimmer, 5 gal sump, uv sterilizer, phoban reactor. soft, lps, and some sps corals. 2 gobies, 2 clownfish, anemone, coral beauty, fridmani, dusky jawfish, mandarin, brittle starfish.

03-20-2008, 11:39 PM	#11 (permalink)
sasquatch Brunt of all Jokes~ Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: the very farthest west coast of canada Posts: 8,492 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Hey Chris Welcome to RS! enjoy the cycling time its about the only time tank acne is expected if it comes later its just a nightmare lol __________________ DIY stuff for my tank stand, 100g tank,rock lift, overflow, foam walls, closed loop,lighting reflectors, 50gal sump, bubbletrap and sock holder, ato bracket,kalk bucket and reservoir, 40gal fuge, fuge lighting, remotish dsb raceway, turf algae raceway, dual pumped recirc skimmer, more to follow. Barb ripped my sig

03-20-2008, 11:49 PM	#12 (permalink)
Frankie Angel Girl's Daddy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: The End Of The World Posts: 6,025 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Welcome to RS Chris! __________________ Visit my aquarium -->Frankie's 120 gal Experiment Bruce: Today's meeting is Step 5: Bring a fish friend. Everyone brought a fish friend? DIY=DO IT YOURSELF! If we ignore the environment maybe it will go away....

03-20-2008, 11:59 PM	#13 (permalink)
Chris3859 Ricordea Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Beaumont, Texas Posts: 193 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Thanks for all the welcomes and advice. Tank acne!!?? That's funny as all get out sasquatch!!!! __________________ Chris Tanks stats: 1)Big 2)Expensive 3)Time Consuming Just got my Discover bill--> "There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines...Marines and those who have met them in battle. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion." -Unknown

03-21-2008, 12:10 AM	#15 (permalink)
Chris3859 Ricordea Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Beaumont, Texas Posts: 193 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Hello...hating life during new tank cycling Poems, rap, jokes...anything to break up watching this empty tank cycle. Wow, live rock doesn't really swim all that fast...LOL! __________________ Chris Tanks stats: 1)Big 2)Expensive 3)Time Consuming Just got my Discover bill--> "There are only two kinds of people that understand Marines...Marines and those who have met them in battle. Everyone else has a second-hand opinion." -Unknown

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