Dinoflagellates - The documented journey

[Triggerjay]

Thanks BoomerD. I have seen these on E-Bay, but did not know how well this brand works. If you trust it, I can..

Jason

[largo]

I was searching the web on dino's and came across this thread - I am having a breakout of dino's too that looks just like yours. I bought Julian Sprungs book "algae a problem solvers guide" and have been readin it and basically here is what I'm understanding so far:
Dino's aren't cause by your ro water
running kalk will help reduce them
running carbon will help reduce them
reducing photoperiod to 4 hrs per day will help
water changes should be avoided during the bloom so you aren't providing the dino's more trace elements.

he says trace elements don't cause it but if they are present may promote it.

I am starting my kalk tonight to try and battle this stuff - but I would like to follow along here too!

BTW:
My tank info
265g mixed reef
2 250 MH's
1 400 MH's
4 VHO actinics
octopus nw200 skimmer
1 vortec
4 Koralia 4's
spraybar
running filter socks

[JWarren]

Hello Largo,

Welcome to RS!

If you are planning on dripping Kalk, do not add any other buffers to the tank. Kalk is kind of an all in one sup. It may not add enough calcium, but that can be brought up by CaCl2. Drip it no faster than 1 drop per second, without doing thorough testing on your perameters.

I don't have a lot of time at the moment, to get into the other points from the book, but I did want to welcome you to the forum.

[largo]

thanks,
I stopped my other buffer 2 days ago and have run tests so far I have:
ph 8.4
alk 3.5 meq
cal 400

1 tsp of kalk to 1gallon of ro water on an IV drip of 1 drop per second.

Thanks for the welcome......did you need a dictionary to read the book??!!

[JWarren]

Dang near!

Those levels look good. You can mix the kalk a bit heavier to get a super saturated level. Just let any undesolved excess settle out to the bottom. You just want to use the clear lime water, not the milk.

[robinscp]

Guys I have being battling this for 4 weeks.

Let me start by saying that It has not all gone but is miles better than it was and I am sure it will go soon.

I started by the usual things I would do with algae issues, reduce nutrients and change water for new nutrient free water.
I reduced feeding, added extra flow and did some crazy amounts of water changes while sucking the snot off the substrate.
I increased my phosphate removing media.
I also added a 200 micron filter to try and catch the slime but it just passed right through.

Adding more clean up crew would not work either as it was killing anything that ate it. (toxins)

The above routine would successfully get rid of cyanobacteria but did not work with Dinoflagellates.

Turning off and reducing the light cycle slows it down but as soon as I put the lights back on it would just start where it left off.

So these things never worked. So what has?

The turning point in this battle was adding a UV purifier.

I believe that because Dinoflagellates is in the water column it is being affected by the UV.

What is happening now is the UV is clumping the dino together so that it is caught in the 200 micron filter and taken out by the skimmer.
I am emptying the skimmer cup once a day instead of the normal twice a week so it is taking something out. Also the filter sock is getting blocked in two days. it never got blocked in the week before I added the UV.

So to get rid of Dinoflagellates I would suggest:
Putting a high wattage UV on the tank and also a filter sock to catch the snot.
I would also add a lot of carbon to the tank as this reduced the smell and I believe reduced the toxicity of the dino. (I never lost any more snails after adding the carbon)

I hope this helps anyone else that may get this problem.

Cheers

[Triggerjay]

Originally Posted by robinscp

So to get rid of Dinoflagellates I would suggest:
Putting a high wattage UV on the tank and also a filter sock to catch the snot.
I would also add a lot of carbon to the tank as this reduced the smell and I believe reduced the toxicity of the dino. (I never lost any more snails after adding the carbon)

I hope this helps anyone else that may get this problem.

Cheers

I run an Aqua 40W uv, and was before the problem began, and continue to run it, 24/7.

I now have TWO TLF phosban reactors, filled with carbon. (only had one before)

I have reduced my photoperiod to 6 hours a day.

Changed out my ro/di filters

replaced my junkie already burnt out 54w T-5 actinics

And now,... I am happy to say.. am seeing a drastic reduction in the Dyno. It is almost gone. I need to update with some more pics, .. I intended to do a day by day pic, but time did not permit it. Once the Dyno is completly gone, I have plans to drastically increase my cleanup crew. I should also note I purchased an orange face sleeper goby to turn over the sand. This really seems to be helping. Thanks again for the replies!

Jason

[largo]

well, I've also suspended waterchanges and have ben running a 36watt turbotwist UV and have been for 4 months & the dino's are still going. They are better but now I'm having cyano join in. I'm just wondering how easy suspending WC's and still controlling nitrate will be and how long it will take to starve the dino's off. I haven't ran any carbon though

[prow]

your going to need water changes or you will never get ahead of it. blowing off the rocks and then doing the water change and using a filter sock while doing the blowing and water change works well to remove things. dieing algae only feeds what lives. skimmers and such only do so much.

[Triggerjay]

you should see my new "filter sock". its a 20l, with egg crate dividers, filled with carbon pads. the drains from the display run into one end of it, then it drains into my sump. I have also been doing weekly 55g water changes. things seem to be coming along well. I have noticed a slight amount of hair algae taking the place of some of the dyno, but my tang and foxface are making short work of it. I also reconfigured my 55g fuge, taking all the calupera and halmedia out, and leaving only the cheato. I also installed a 250w 6500k mh over the fuge in place of the 48" shop light fixture. lots of good changes happening. I am looking forward to the end results of my changes. I know I keep saying it, but pics soon. been real busy with work, and busy making the changes to my system.

Jason

[largo]

well, I'm following the advice of Julian Sprung, Randy holmes-farley, & Eric Borneman all of whom say limit the trace elements/nutrients in the water. Sprung specifically says to "suspend" wc's. Here are 2 online articles I've referenced, and Sprungs book on algae. The only component not in place is the use of carbon. I've already went thru the 40% weekly wc for over 3 months with no change in the tank so now it's time (for me at least) to try it their way.
Dinoflagellates - Predators, Pathogens, and Partners by Eric Borneman - Reefkeeping.com

Problem Dinoflagellates and pH by Randy Holmes-Farley - Reefkeeping.com

Algae: A Problem Solver Guide

[Triggerjay]

Ok, finally took some new pics. Here is a before:


I did however, move the blastos. In the "after" pic, the light spot on the rocks is where it was.



I will continue the changes I have made to the system, until all signs of it are gone. I still have a slight amount in the sand. Here is a video of the carbon filter I made from a 20g tank. I plan to add more carbon pads to it tomorrow.


Have a good day!

Jason

[johnmaloney]

I have heard copepods love to eat dinos

[brooks93]

I have been fighting the same problem for about 6 weeks. going to have to change my TLF reactor out to carbon and or add another one.

[deepgreen]

This thread has been so helpful - so now I know what hit my tank for 3 weeks and recently my sons tank for about 10 days. I hate to say it but I gave him several frags which must have had some on - little did I know about this monster.

But here is an interesting observation with the survival of snails in these 2 tanks. To cure the problem I bought about 10 mexican turbo snails - where all 10 seemed to like the stuff and kept it partly at bay my tank - it seemed to be in check. But I transferred 4 of these large turbos to my sons tank and they all died in about 2 days - the balance of mine still survive. In my tank they ate large quantities of the stuff in his just a small amount - I had by far the worse covering. So I am interested in why the toxicity is so different.

Well in any case I shall follow your lead Triggerjay - congrats on a battle well won.