Refugium Layout

[Rcpilot]

I will be using a 29g tank for the refugium on a 90g reef.

The refugium is 30 long x 12 wide x 18 tall. I'm not sure how to lay it all out.

LOTS of questions:

Do you want the skimmer and refugium on opposite ends with a center return? If using this method, can you simply run 2 overflows and drain each into opposite ends of the tank? Do you WANT to do that? Do you want to drain unskimmed water into your refugium?

Do you want the refugium first and then the skimmer and then the return section?

Do you want the skimmer in the first compartment and then the refugium with the return section on the end?

So many options.

[DML08]

this is what i did
sump/refugium

[AQTCJAK]

IMO the Refuge should be separate from the sup with the skimmer you want very slow water flow through the refuge so to filer the excess nutients & allow for pod growth.

[Triggerjay]

This is what I did for my old 55g tank:


Jason

[koffee]

I have the return in the middle. However, instead of sending the overflow into the fuge, I have a small pump in the return chamber that feeds the fuge. It means another pump to maintain, but easy to control the flow rate. The fuge dumps back in to the return chamber, which means some of the water just cycles back into the fuge. But it all mixes around, so I guess it is OK.

If possible, I think you would be better off with a longer tank, though. It will be hard to squeeze everything in 30". One mistake I made with mine is that the return chamber is narrow, and that's where evaporation really hits. The narrower this chamber is, the quicker your pump can run dry.

I don't like the designs that put the fuge in the middle because I agree with slower flow through the fuge. Ultimately, if/when I move to a bigger tank, I will go with an isolated fuge above the DT that just gravity feeds into it. AFAIK, that's the best method. At that point, I'll use bulkheads and external pumps too.

[Rcpilot]

Originally Posted by AQTCJAK

IMO the Refuge should be separate from the sup with the skimmer you want very slow water flow through the refuge so to filer the excess nutients & allow for pod growth.

I'm running a closed loop for circulation.

The entire sump/refugium will only be run about 300gph.

I was thinking about running dual overflows (1.5") on back corners of the tank. I will run one overflow to the refugium on the left side. This line would have a valve in it to slow down the flow. I will run the other overflow to the skimmer on the right side. Put the return pump in the center section. Is there any reason why you shouldn't put a valve on an overflow line and shut it back a little to reduce flow into the refugium? I don't see how this could back up with another overflow and oversized pipes on both sides. It would just cause more water to flow into the skimmer side.

OR:

I could run a single 2" pipe out of a single overflow and just split it off with a TEE. Put a valve on the line going to the refugium to throttle it back on the flow. The rest would automatically go to the skimmer compartment. The refugium supply could even be reduced in size to a 3/4" or even 1/2" piping.



I guess anything will work. I just want it to be completely functional and a clean layout. I hate messy sumps and plumbing under a tank. Looks ghetto. I want mine to look clean.

[lcstorc]

Originally Posted by Rcpilot

I'm running a closed loop for circulation.

The entire sump/refugium will only be run about 300gph.

I was thinking about running dual overflows (1.5") on back corners of the tank. I will run one overflow to the refugium on the left side. This line would have a valve in it to slow down the flow. I will run the other overflow to the skimmer on the right side. Put the return pump in the center section. Is there any reason why you shouldn't put a valve on an overflow line and shut it back a little to reduce flow into the refugium? I don't see how this could back up with another overflow and oversized pipes on both sides. It would just cause more water to flow into the skimmer side.

OR:

I could run a single 2" pipe out of a single overflow and just split it off with a TEE. Put a valve on the line going to the refugium to throttle it back on the flow. The rest would automatically go to the skimmer compartment. The refugium supply could even be reduced in size to a 3/4" or even 1/2" piping.



I guess anything will work. I just want it to be completely functional and a clean layout. I hate messy sumps and plumbing under a tank. Looks ghetto. I want mine to look clean.

That is exactly what I have done except I have separate tanks for the sump and the fuge. The return is split and I can control how much water goes each direction. Then the fuge gravity feeds to the return area of the sump so it only goes though the one pump.

[framerguy]

Depending on what you want to grow in the fuge you will need around 5x turnover "in the fuge", meaning if the fuge holds 10 gallons then you want +-50gph through it. I like the idea of having a center return with two different overflows feeding each end.

Look through this thread, it may give you some ideas.power heads in the fuge

[Rcpilot]

Originally Posted by framerguy

Depending on what you want to grow in the fuge you will need around 5x turnover "in the fuge", meaning if the fuge holds 10 gallons then you want +-50gph through it. I like the idea of having a center return with two different overflows feeding each end.

Look through this thread, it may give you some ideas.power heads in the fuge

Great thread about flow. I'm on page 3. Planning to read the whole thing.

I think I might use dual overflows and put the return section in the middle. I am going to use a Tee and a valve on the main overflow line to control flow out to my refugium. Excess water in that overflow line can go to the skimmer compartment.

I may run some tubing from the skimmer outlet over to the refugium and set it up on a spraybar. Or just dump it in there. That would help oxygenate the water in the refugium. Might be overkill. Thoughts?

[framerguy]

Originally Posted by Rcpilot

Great thread about flow. I'm on page 3. Planning to read the whole thing. It's a good read and I learned a lot from it.

I think I might use dual overflows and put the return section in the middle. I am going to use a Tee and a valve on the main overflow line to control flow out to my refugium. Excess water in that overflow line can go to the skimmer compartment. I think this would work to perfecton, in fact my current setup is like this.

I may run some tubing from the skimmer outlet over to the refugium and set it up on a spraybar. Or just dump it in there. That would help oxygenate the water in the refugium. Might be overkill. Thoughts? I would rather put the spraybar on the overflow line feeding the fuge and have the skimmer water flow into the center return section. There should plenty of bulk flow and oxygen without the skimmer feeding the fuge IMO

[Rcpilot]

Okay, sounds like the idea about dual overflows into different ends of the tank would work. Use a valve to control flow in the refugium.

Now I'm wondering just how I want to dump the water into the skimmer and refugium sections. Do I just terminate the pipes 1" above the surface of the water? Or do I box out a corner and fill it with rock rubble. Run the drain tube 1" under the water level and let it disperse through the rock rubble?

Seams to me either would work, but method 2 would be less splashing. Less salt creep. I think I'll get plenty of gas exchange with the tank overflows.

Is a 30g tank big enough for the refugium? I'm setting up a 90g reef with closed loop for circulation.

[Rcpilot]

I have a 5.5g tank here and was looking at how to place it inside my 29g sump/refugium. It would be nice to use this as my refugium. It's 16 long x 8 wide x 10 tall. I'm thinking setting it in the 29g tank (possibly on a stand?) I would most likely fill it up with about 8" of sand. Drill it on one end and let the water flow out into the skimmer section.

It would work, but I'm having trouble figuring out how much water I should have in the return section. I'd much rather have a larger sump that would be less effected by a long absence. Trying to figure out a way to use this 29g tank as a sump/refugium, but it just doesn't seam like it's large enough. Maybe it's just me?

I don't want to run it really high. I want to make darn sure it has enough to take up the overflow in the event of power failure.

Look at this picture. With this layout, I'm using the 5.5g tank turned sideways and setting on the bottom of the 29g tank.

Remember, this 5.5 g tank is 16" long and 8" wide. It's 10" tall. The 29g tank is 30" long x 12" wide x 18" tall.

With the 5.5g tank sitting on the bottom of the 29g, there is still 8" of space above it. The skimmer section is going to be 6" wide by 14" . Not sure how high to make the baffles, as I've never done a skimmer like this.

That would give me a 4" x 30" return section. I calculated the cubic inches and it will take 2" of vertical height to get 1g of water in the sump. If I run the skimmer baffles at 8", I could get 4g in the return section.

OR:

I could set that 5.5g tank on a stand. If it was 6" off the bottom of the 29g tank, it would still be 2" from the top of the 29g tank.

An extra 6" of water under that 16 x 8 tank would be an additional 3.25 gallons in my sump. Add that to 4g if I run it 8" deep. 7.25g sump.

Is that big enough? Would it be okay if I just set the 5.5g tank on the bottom and only ran 4g in my sump? I'd still have a BUNCH of room on top in case of a power outage. I doubt it would ever overflow. It would still have a capacity about 22g reserve for an overflow.

Should I go ahead and set the 5.5g on a stand? I'd have about 7.25g in the return section and about 17g reserve for an overflow.

Sorry for all the questions. I'm sure this is old news to most of you. I've just never done it before and I like to plan stuff out before I spend money or modify a piece of equipment permanently.

[fishnu]

I am building mine with two 1.5 inch overflows coming from my tank to the sump. One pipe goes right to the skimmer section on the right. The second has a 3/4 inch ball valve teed off the pipe allowing me to drop about 100-200 gph into the fuge before continuing to the skimmer. The middle section holds the return pump.

[framerguy]

Originally Posted by Rcpilot

I have a 5.5g tank here and was looking at how to place it inside my 29g sump/refugium. It would be nice to use this as my refugium. It's 16 long x 8 wide x 10 tall. I'm thinking setting it in the 29g tank (possibly on a stand?) I would most likely fill it up with about 8" of sand That would only leave 2" of water, 5" of sand is more than plenty. Drill it on one end and let the water flow out into the skimmer section. Good idea

It would work, but I'm having trouble figuring out how much water I should have in the return section. It needs to be higher than the intake to the return pump is all. Probably 6"? I'd much rather have a larger sump that would be less effected by a long absence. Trying to figure out a way to use this 29g tank as a sump/refugium, but it just doesn't seam like it's large enough. Maybe it's just me?

I don't want to run it really high. I want to make darn sure it has enough to take up the overflow in the event of power failure. Just test it several times by turning off power to the pump.

Look at this picture. With this layout, I'm using the 5.5g tank turned sideways and setting on the bottom of the 29g tank.

Remember, this 5.5 g tank is 16" long and 8" wide. It's 10" tall. The 29g tank is 30" long x 12" wide x 18" tall.

With the 5.5g tank sitting on the bottom of the 29g, there is still 8" of space above it. The skimmer section is going to be 6" wide by 14" . Not sure how high to make the baffles, as I've never done a skimmer like this.I think raising the fuge to the top of the sump is a good idea. Even have it completely above the level of the sump would be best. Then no sump space is taken up.

That would give me a 4" x 30" return section. I calculated the cubic inches and it will take 2" of vertical height to get 1g of water in the sump. If I run the skimmer baffles at 8", I could get 4g in the return section.I have mine at 8"

OR:

I could set that 5.5g tank on a stand. If it was 6" off the bottom of the 29g tank, it would still be 2" from the top of the 29g tank.Again, totally above the level would be best but at least have the top of the fuge level with the top of the sump for more water volume room under it.

An extra 6" of water under that 16 x 8 tank would be an additional 3.25 gallons in my sump. Add that to 4g if I run it 8" deep. 7.25g sump.

Is that big enough? Would it be okay if I just set the 5.5g tank on the bottom and only ran 4g in my sump? I'd still have a BUNCH of room on top in case of a power outage. I doubt it would ever overflow. It would still have a capacity about 22g reserve for an overflow.

Should I go ahead and set the 5.5g on a stand? I think so I'd have about 7.25g in the return section and about 17g reserve for an overflow.

Sorry for all the questions. This is fun I think! I'm sure this is old news to most of you. I've just never done it before and I like to plan stuff out before I spend money or modify a piece of equipment permanently. Smart!

[framerguy]

Originally Posted by Rcpilot

Okay, sounds like the idea about dual overflows into different ends of the tank would work. Use a valve to control flow in the refugium.

Now I'm wondering just how I want to dump the water into the skimmer and refugium sections. Do I just terminate the pipes 1" above the surface of the water? Yes, but drill holes in a section of PVC to make a spray bar and have it parallel to the water slightly above the level of the water. Tie wrap nylon window screen along the legth of the pipe so that one side is attached to the pipe and the other end is in the water and the water coming from the spraybar flows over the screen and falls into the water quietly and without splashing. Or do I box out a corner and fill it with rock rubble. Put the rock rubble on the sand, or better yet do without it. You aready are limited on space with the depth of the sand bed. Probably a better scenario would be to put the DSB in a bucket in the fuge, and use course crushed coral in the fuge instead, fairly shallow (2-3") for the pods to have refuge. That also leaves water volume room for cheato. The shallow bed of CC won't be deep enough to trap detritus if you stir it routinely and is the best bet for pod production. Run the drain tube 1" under the water level and let it disperse through the rock rubble? Naw man, takes up to much room.

Seams to me either would work,It would but method 2 would be less splashing. Less salt creep. I think I'll get plenty of gas exchange with the tank overflows. yep

Is a 30g tank big enough for the refugium? Do you mean sump? Your fuge is 5.5g right? Sump rule of thumb is minimum 10% DT volume, you are well over that. I'm setting up a 90g reef with closed loop for circulation. Excellent!