Macroalgae

[NaH2O]

What is the best mix of macroalgae to have in a refugium? How often do you need to do maintenance and what type of maintenance do you do on a refugium?

[Icebox]

oh great questions... Tagging along to see where this goes. I am about to incororate a refuge into my tank.

[EdgeKrusher]

Just tagging along, as some of you know, I'm planning on upgrading from my 12 gallon to a 20L. The 12 will become my refugium.

EK

[LuckyInk]

Ya know...
I have a 10gal refugium on my current setup. I have some live rock, caulerpa and several small ghost shrimp living in it right now. 24 hour photo period, but no sand.
When I upgrade to the larger tank (this weekend hopefully), I am going to clean the glass a little and add a DSB.
Right now I do no maintenance other than reach in and pull out a handful of caulerpa and hair algae every now and again. Also, when I pull the algae out, I give it a good shake in my main tank to get most of the pods and such off of it before it goes into the trash.
I would also like to add a more diverse algae population. Any ideas would be appreciated!

[achilles]

NaH20
Unfortunately it has been my experience that when I tried a mix of algae, one would eventually become dominate and take over. The others would live, but they really wouldn't grow much and so I assumed they were not an effective export. I have kept different types of caulerpa without a problem, buy anything else couldn't compete.

[NaH2O]

Anyone use Chaetomorpha sp. with their Caulerpa?

[Curtswearing]

I'm swamped right now so I'm going to do a little cut and paste. My last meeting went over by 1 hour and I now have a Mantis sitting in a black bag on my desk that I want to get home.


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Quote:

Ours wouldn't grow at all under NO shop lighting (the Caulerpa had grown fine under it) - it seems to grow relatively well under VHO's, but still nowhere as quickly as Caulerpa.

This is me typing

I would like to discuss this a little. I think that I'm the oddity. Everybody seems to have moved to chaeto. I have quite a bit of chaeto and I like it for the benefits it provides. Amphipods love the stuff and seem to breed in it as well. It doesn't go sexual, and releases very little gelbstoff.

Caulerpa can go sexual if not trimmed regularly and when trimmed will produce gelbstoff. A lot of times people say their caulerpa went sexual when what it really did was die due to malnutrition. This malnutrition can be due to not having enough food or light for photosynthesis, or both. I don't think that people provide enough lighting for their refugiums or they don't trim enough.

Here is what I want out of my refugium. I want a place where critters can grow without predation. I want a place where some of these safe critters can also provide plankton for my display tank (coral food). I also want a form of nutrient export.

I keep BOTH macro's in my fuge. IME, chaeto provides an excellent habitat for critters to reproduce. It also absorbs some of the nasties we want to get rid of but is not nearly efficient at it as caulerpa's.

Caulerpa's have some downsides but they absorb a lot more phosphates and nitrates and grow readily (at least in my tank). Then I trim to export the nutrients. The gelbstoff issue is solved by running carbon after trimming so that is a non-issue IMO. When everyone says that it will go sexual, I believe that this is caused by improper lighting or they didn't trim enough.

As you can see, I have more than one goal out of a fuge. I want nutrient export, a way to insure safety for a number of critters, and I want coral food from plankton. I think that using both types is a good thing.

Feel free to disagree with me. I'm still learning too.


This is another RAGger typing

I tend to agree with you. I do like Chaeto. (works awesome for packing frags for shipping!), but I'm not sold on the fact that it's a good nutrient export. I used to pull boatloads of Caulerpa out of our 'fuge every week - it would probably double it's volume weekly. Chaeto, OTOH, barely doubles it's volume in 8-10 weeks. IMO, that's simply not enough growth for nutrient export.

I also tend to agree that good pruning practices go a long way toward keeping Caulerpa from going sexual. FWIW, I think that the *pruning* is closely tied to the 'sufficent food' issue. If pruned back regularly, there is less volume of algae which need nutrients - it doesn't have to 'share' with a larger volume. Less algae = less food needed = sufficient food for existing algae.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure I'm brave enough to attempt to keep it (Caulerpa) when it's not lit 24/7. I'd like to hear experiences of ppl who trim their Caulerpa regularly, light it well, but don't light it 24/7. Our tank adds considerably to our electricity bill as it is. I'm not whining, but I'd prefer to avoid the cost of lighting a 'fuge 24/7 - also considering replacing the VHO's every 6 mos if used 24/7. Also, I like to light the 'fuge at night only - to balance pH.

Again, I'm not thrilled with the Chaeto. It's great for the reasons you stated, but I don't necessarily view it as a good nutrient export. I've been sitting on the fence with the idea of adding some Caulerpa, and some other macros back into the 'fuge. However, I would like to avoid lighting 24/7.

[EdgeKrusher]

The first thing I saw when I read that post was that you got another Mantis. Yay!
I'm happy for you Curt, let us know how it takes to it's new home.

Thanks for the info too, now I just have to figure out what Kind I have, it's red and seems to be one big peice connected in the middle. I'll post a pic tonight.

EK

[NaH2O]

Thanks, Curt...that was great info!

[achilles]

True, the jump to chaeto seems to have been mostly to avoid the noxious chemicals released by caulerpa. They do release those chemicals when pruned and a ton of them if they go sexual or die.

From my reading on chaeto, it has been kind of hit or miss with the growth rate. It seems it is not very competitive and will be out performed by other macros, but when alone in a tank it can grow at a high enough rate for nutrient export.

My pods love my caulerpa to breed in too, but only because of the shelter it provides. I bet you would get the same type of breeding if used filter floss instead of chaeto.

I don't think anyone has come up with the magic formula of macros for a refugium. It is mostly about understanding the species you have know it strengths and weaknesses and how to maximize its potential.

[Icebox]

thanks kurt

[Curtswearing]

Originally posted by achilles
I don't think anyone has come up with the magic formula of macros for a refugium. It is mostly about understanding the species you have know it strengths and weaknesses and how to maximize its potential.

I agree. I copied and pasted that post and provided it because I thought it showed both sides of the issue pretty well. Spaghetti Mac does grow faster if it is the only macro. I was just having to give it so much iron and I said to myself, "Why should I be dosing another chemical, let's just get some more caulerpa". That's why I have both.

[Curtswearing]

BTW---

EdgeKrusher. Mojo set up this site for his local reefers group and there are pictures of different types of macro's there. You should be able to identify the type you have. The PSAS.ORG

He is allowing us to put reviews in on products and utilize his resources. Thanks Mike!!!!

[jks1]

Great info Curt, I just put in a HOB CPR ref.

[Woodstock]

I keep both chaeto and caulerpa in my sump under 12 hour/day NO lighting. They're both doing well but the caulerpa seems to grows faster than the chaeto. Although, this may be misleading due to the chaeto's growing pattern being intertwinning within itself. It can grow into a dense thick mat unlike the caulerpa that grows out and away from itself..... ya know?