Salt!

Scooterman · 11-20-2003, 02:16 PM

IO

CA=350
PH=8.0
MG=1,200
ALK-3.86
AMMONIA=0
SG=.0245
TEMP=78df
Water RO/DI (new Filters)
Test kits Saliflert NEW!

Rubbermaid tub was cleaned and rinsed with RO/DI water, heated and circulated over night!

I'm currently doing more water changes to return my tank to normal levels, I will not state why because I want this post to be peaceful! This is just a reference Post!
I would like to have IO tested for Phosphates, (well Inorganic anyway)I'd also like to see if there is some consistency with IO!

Scott A.

wooddood · 11-20-2003, 03:02 PM

keep us posted on the results.

fidojoe · 11-20-2003, 03:51 PM

No wonder why my Ca is so low. My PH is higher, because I have southdown buffering it... I think

cazoo · 11-20-2003, 04:18 PM

wouldn't your values be more normal if you mixed it to 35ppt SG? Or did you follow a recipe with a specific wt to volume ratio? If so maybe there was absorbed water in the salt mix that threw the weight off.

Scooterman · 11-20-2003, 04:27 PM

http://trmrcoon.mybravenet.com/Aquaria/salinity.htm

My edit is only to fix broken links....curt http://web.archive.org/web/200306220...a/salinity.htm

cazoo · 11-20-2003, 05:28 PM

Scooterman-

forgive me- the missing "1" in front of your value for SG got me confused between SG and salinity.

cazoo

cazoo · 11-20-2003, 07:17 PM

scooterman-

is your alk number in meq/l or dKH? I am also very interested in the consistancy of the IO batches. Having had a bad experience switching salts recently made me realize that all salts are not equal and has made me more concerned about batch to batch differences. I will also be monitoring my newly made batches- maybe we can get a database going. As you know, small differences in measured SG (below the accuracy of most hydrometers) can result in fluctuations as much as 10% if not more in total salt concentrations. In your data here, 10% more Mg will put it within range of where it should be. As far as Ca , 10% more would put it within the desired range of 380-420 ppm. I am hoping that the your alk number is in meq/l or we really have a problem. We also should decide at what salinity we should be measuring at as this will obviously effect all of the numbers. From the table you posted it seems you are between 33-34 ppt total salinity. I'll be doing a water change soon and will add to your data. Good Luck.

Curtswearing · 11-20-2003, 08:46 PM

Cazoo

This is a continuation of an old thread. Here were the ground rules on that thread if I remember them correctly.

You mix up a batch of salt. You must identify the following parameters in order to post----

Brand of Salt
Specific Gravity
Temperature
Type of water (RO Water, RO/DI water, or whatever other type of water you are using).
How long you mixed it and what your mixing procedure is.
Brand of Test kit
Calcium level
Power of Hydrogen level
Alkalinity level
Magnesium level
Phosphates (if known)
Any other level that you have a test kit for.

And as you have succinctly pointed out Cazoo, we should state dKH vs meq/l and salinity vs SG.

This is not a scientific study. Obviously someone mixing up a batch of a brand of salt with de-chlorinated tap water is going to have higher calcium levels than if they mixed that same batch of salt with RO/DI water. The purpose is to identify trends. This is an important issue.

Craig Manoukian · 11-21-2003, 02:29 AM

Also, remember to include the instrument used to measure SG, ie. hydrometor or refractometor, or any other testing equipment used.

Thanks

Scooterman · 11-21-2003, 09:35 AM

My Alk was in meq/l!
I don't have a refractometer, I used a deep six, so there is room for some error! Sorry this is the best I can do but tomorrow I'm doing another 25g water change with IO again, I'll post here the results under the same conditions, eventually we can determine a consistancy factor. I'll try and do it exactly the same way.

Craig Manoukian · 11-21-2003, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Scooterman
eventually we can determine a consistancy factor. I'll try and do it exactly the same way.

That's the key. It's too bad that al hyrometors can be off .002 in SG when they are well calibrated. It can be worse than that! Can't wait to get a refractometor!

cazoo · 11-21-2003, 01:31 PM

If there is enough interest, I can compile and normalize the data that is submitted using curtswearing's rules. I personally would be very interested in the results from a lot of different people for different salts. While it may not be perfect, I think it would still be fairly relavent. The more different salts and measurements, the better, as long as everyone is careful with the measurements and reports as many parameters as possible. I think it would be valid to normalize all the measurements to 35ppt. Any interest?

Craig Manoukian · 11-21-2003, 01:40 PM

That would be great!

Remember that ppt is the measurement for NSW and SG for synthetic sea water. Can we all agree on 1.025 SG for testing purposes?

You can add salt or dilute your mix if you need to add more or less SG to your tank, eh?

cazoo · 11-21-2003, 01:47 PM

Good- lets see those measurements- If we go with a standard of 1.025 SG than it is critical that we report the temperature so I can normalize

Scooterman · 11-21-2003, 02:43 PM

I'm not sure by the Power of Hydrogen level he was talking about? 1.025 SG is good number to go for, the only problem I see is consistancy, unless each test done was done again and again by the same person the very same way. Otherwise you throw in other unknown variables. Even though this is true, I'd still like to see a total compiled data sheet & maybe an Individual data sheet.

11-20-2003, 02:16 PM	#1 (permalink)
Scooterman Elegance coral Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lafayette, Louisiana Posts: 1,239 View Gallery Karma Komment	Salt! IO CA=350 PH=8.0 MG=1,200 ALK-3.86 AMMONIA=0 SG=.0245 TEMP=78df Water RO/DI (new Filters) Test kits Saliflert NEW! Rubbermaid tub was cleaned and rinsed with RO/DI water, heated and circulated over night! I'm currently doing more water changes to return my tank to normal levels, I will not state why because I want this post to be peaceful! This is just a reference Post! I would like to have IO tested for Phosphates, (well Inorganic anyway)I'd also like to see if there is some consistency with IO! Scott A. __________________ Scott Ardoin (Ard-Dwan)

11-20-2003, 03:02 PM	#2 (permalink)
wooddood the wood dude Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: marion. INDIANA Posts: 3,457 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	keep us posted on the results. __________________ 120 gal/in wall tank/starboard substraight/2 250 watt 10k xm metal halides/ 4 55watt 03 actinics/150lbs lr/scwd on return/scwd on a closed loop/aquaclear aquatics 200 pro wetdry w/skimmer. ask all the questions you have if we cant answer it we'll make up some thing. remember patience is the key to a kick ass reef. dave.

11-20-2003, 03:51 PM	#3 (permalink)
fidojoe Fish Addict Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,584 View Gallery Karma Komment	No wonder why my Ca is so low. My PH is higher, because I have southdown buffering it... I think __________________ *Member "Crabs Are Evil" Society* My Tank: 90g AGA, 18g tall sump, CSS 220 w/ meshmod impeller, 4x54w Tek T5 retro w/ IC reflectors, Kalk reactor w/ aquamedic niveaumat system, a few SPS, LPS, zoos, and a few softies, 2 Ocellaris Clowns (hosted by both a RBTA and GBTA), Yellow Watchman, Potter's angel, Yellow Tang, Foxface, Midas Blenny, Purple Pseudo, huge brittle star, 2 tigertail cukes, fire shrimp, snails, and unfortunately two emerald crabs (the bubble algae got out of control).

11-20-2003, 04:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
Scooterman Elegance coral Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lafayette, Louisiana Posts: 1,239 View Gallery Karma Komment	http://trmrcoon.mybravenet.com/Aquaria/salinity.htm My edit is only to fix broken links....curt http://web.archive.org/web/200306220...a/salinity.htm __________________ Scott Ardoin (Ard-Dwan)

11-21-2003, 02:29 AM	#9 (permalink)
Craig Manoukian Regular Guy Moderator Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Marina Del Ray, CA Posts: 19,012 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Also, remember to include the instrument used to measure SG, ie. hydrometor or refractometor, or any other testing equipment used. Thanks __________________ Currently tankless. 20 Gallon mini reef with mated pair of Maroon Clowns given to Rougiem! 80 gallon reef given to Rougiem/Wooster HS.

11-20-2003, 04:18 PM	#4 (permalink)
cazoo Tunicate Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Castro Valley, CA Posts: 17 View Gallery Karma Komment	wouldn't your values be more normal if you mixed it to 35ppt SG? Or did you follow a recipe with a specific wt to volume ratio? If so maybe there was absorbed water in the salt mix that threw the weight off.

11-20-2003, 05:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
cazoo Tunicate Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Castro Valley, CA Posts: 17 View Gallery Karma Komment	Scooterman- forgive me- the missing "1" in front of your value for SG got me confused between SG and salinity. cazoo

11-20-2003, 07:17 PM	#7 (permalink)
cazoo Tunicate Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Castro Valley, CA Posts: 17 View Gallery Karma Komment	scooterman- is your alk number in meq/l or dKH? I am also very interested in the consistancy of the IO batches. Having had a bad experience switching salts recently made me realize that all salts are not equal and has made me more concerned about batch to batch differences. I will also be monitoring my newly made batches- maybe we can get a database going. As you know, small differences in measured SG (below the accuracy of most hydrometers) can result in fluctuations as much as 10% if not more in total salt concentrations. In your data here, 10% more Mg will put it within range of where it should be. As far as Ca , 10% more would put it within the desired range of 380-420 ppm. I am hoping that the your alk number is in meq/l or we really have a problem. We also should decide at what salinity we should be measuring at as this will obviously effect all of the numbers. From the table you posted it seems you are between 33-34 ppt total salinity. I'll be doing a water change soon and will add to your data. Good Luck.

11-20-2003, 08:46 PM	#8 (permalink)
Curtswearing Golden Moray Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 2,597 View Gallery Karma Komment	Cazoo This is a continuation of an old thread. Here were the ground rules on that thread if I remember them correctly. You mix up a batch of salt. You must identify the following parameters in order to post---- Brand of Salt Specific Gravity Temperature Type of water (RO Water, RO/DI water, or whatever other type of water you are using). How long you mixed it and what your mixing procedure is. Brand of Test kit Calcium level Power of Hydrogen level Alkalinity level Magnesium level Phosphates (if known) Any other level that you have a test kit for. And as you have succinctly pointed out Cazoo, we should state dKH vs meq/l and salinity vs SG. This is not a scientific study. Obviously someone mixing up a batch of a brand of salt with de-chlorinated tap water is going to have higher calcium levels than if they mixed that same batch of salt with RO/DI water. The purpose is to identify trends. This is an important issue.

11-21-2003, 09:35 AM	#10 (permalink)
Scooterman Elegance coral Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lafayette, Louisiana Posts: 1,239 View Gallery Karma Komment	My Alk was in meq/l! I don't have a refractometer, I used a deep six, so there is room for some error! Sorry this is the best I can do but tomorrow I'm doing another 25g water change with IO again, I'll post here the results under the same conditions, eventually we can determine a consistancy factor. I'll try and do it exactly the same way. __________________ Scott Ardoin (Ard-Dwan)

11-21-2003, 01:31 PM	#12 (permalink)
cazoo Tunicate Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Castro Valley, CA Posts: 17 View Gallery Karma Komment	If there is enough interest, I can compile and normalize the data that is submitted using curtswearing's rules. I personally would be very interested in the results from a lot of different people for different salts. While it may not be perfect, I think it would still be fairly relavent. The more different salts and measurements, the better, as long as everyone is careful with the measurements and reports as many parameters as possible. I think it would be valid to normalize all the measurements to 35ppt. Any interest?

11-21-2003, 01:40 PM	#13 (permalink)
Craig Manoukian Regular Guy Moderator Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Marina Del Ray, CA Posts: 19,012 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	That would be great! Remember that ppt is the measurement for NSW and SG for synthetic sea water. Can we all agree on 1.025 SG for testing purposes? You can add salt or dilute your mix if you need to add more or less SG to your tank, eh? __________________ Currently tankless. 20 Gallon mini reef with mated pair of Maroon Clowns given to Rougiem! 80 gallon reef given to Rougiem/Wooster HS.

11-21-2003, 01:47 PM	#14 (permalink)
cazoo Tunicate Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Castro Valley, CA Posts: 17 View Gallery Karma Komment	Good- lets see those measurements- If we go with a standard of 1.025 SG than it is critical that we report the temperature so I can normalize

11-21-2003, 02:43 PM	#15 (permalink)
Scooterman Elegance coral Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lafayette, Louisiana Posts: 1,239 View Gallery Karma Komment	I'm not sure by the Power of Hydrogen level he was talking about? 1.025 SG is good number to go for, the only problem I see is consistancy, unless each test done was done again and again by the same person the very same way. Otherwise you throw in other unknown variables. Even though this is true, I'd still like to see a total compiled data sheet & maybe an Individual data sheet. __________________ Scott Ardoin (Ard-Dwan)

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