Question about pump purchase....

AngelLeah1981 · 02-25-2008, 03:55 PM

I am needing a pump for a 120 gallon aquarium and I need it to be powerful enough so that I won't have to buy another one later but also keep in mind I'm not wanting to waste money either. lol. This is a tank that is not set up yet but I am wanting to put fish and reef in it. One lfs is suggesting I get one that pumps 1400-1500 gallons per hour and I don't know the price or brand but I'm sure it's ridiculous just like all his other equpiment prices; he is going to call me and let me know today..... and the other lfs suggests a GenX that pumps 1800-2000 gallons per hour and the cost is $120. Is this a good deal? This store usually has good prices but has other issues. lol. Do I need a better brand? Does it matter if it's internal or external? I think he may have said it's internal but I can't remember. How many gph do you suggest and what are your thoughts on this? Also, the lfs with high prices says the GenX only has 6000 which pumps 1600 and a 8500 that pumps 2250 and said the 8500 was probably what the other lfs store was talking about and his price is $199.00. He said this pump can be used as internal or external but he would use it internally because he would be afraid of it overheating ?? Any thoughts and suggestions on this would be GREAT.
Thanks.

2 internal overflows
30-40 gallon sump
probably going to do a fuge (macro algae and rock in sump)

BigAl07 · 02-25-2008, 04:05 PM

First thing you need to decide how much gph you want in the tank and then apply the head height (height the pump has to push water up and into the tank).

My Mag18 (1800gph) pushes a lot of water but when you calculate the amount of head height it goes down to 1300gph (if memory serves me well). You also need to do this according to how much water will be coming FROM the tank. I wish it were an easier answer but there are a lot of variables involved.

good luck and check out our online sponsors. That's where I got mine.

Allen

CAVINCA · 02-25-2008, 04:11 PM

is this for flow in the display?
Ive been told to keep a 7 to 10 times your tanks volume turn over rate for flow. thats 840 - 1200 turn over rate. instead of one big pump look for multiple small ones. they add up. it really depends on what you want to keep.

Saltycritters.com is a good place to shop...

Brand wise... You get what you pay for. i couldnt tell you whats best...

EDIT- Listen to Al hes older and wiser :-)

BigAl07 · 02-25-2008, 04:34 PM

Thanks Carl! I think...

I don't figure "total tank flow" through my sump fuge system. I figure what my over flow will carry down to the sump and go from there. No sense in having a 2000gph pump when the over flow can only handle 1000gph (I'm making these numbers up for comparison only). What you want to do is get your over flow rating, figure your head height and get a pump that's rated for a bit more than that (not double or anything like that). Then you can add a "Closed Loop system" or power heads in the tank to create additional "In Tank" flow.

I hope this doesn't create more confusion.

AngelLeah1981 · 02-25-2008, 04:44 PM

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0337.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0336.jpg

48X24X25
I was told the next piece of equipment to buy after the tank would be the pump so I'm just assuming this is for the water that goes from the tank to the sump and back to the tank again. Here's 2 pics of the tank and the holes that are almost as big as a tennis ball. There is a plastic "box like thing" on both sides for the internal overflows each with two holes. ...just thought this info might be helpful.

rmlevasseur · 02-25-2008, 04:46 PM

Need more info. Do you have a sump and skimmer already? How many overflows and how big are the holes?

I recently compared an order between Marine Depot and Dr Fosters and Smith. Even though Marine Depot had free shipping, Dr. F&S won by $40.
Order included salt, nets, 4 koralias, carbon, selcon and some other misc. stuff. All the items were identical.

BigAl07 · 02-25-2008, 04:48 PM

That's very helpful! Those "Boxes" are the OverFlows and that's where surface water is skimmed off. Inside each over flow will be plumbing to take water FROM The tank to the sump as well as plumbing to take water from the sump and RETURN it to the Display Tank (DT). What you need to find out is how much water will those two over flows drain into the sump. I don't have a calculator to figure that out but you'll need to know what size each hole is and then come back here. When the hole size is known then someone can tell you what size bulkhead is used. A bulkhead will return a specific amount of water due to gravity. We use THAT information to figure how much water is in your sump and match that amount for the return pump size.

See it's not THAT difficult!! Well actually it CAN be but you have a whole TEAM or Reef Enthusiasts here on your side.

Good luck!

AngelLeah1981 · 02-25-2008, 05:48 PM

I'm thinking of going witht he Wave2K for flow. I think this is for return. I only need one pump, right? Why would I need multiple small pumps instead of one?
How do you know how many gph your overflow can handle? How do I get my overflow rathing?

I have a 40 gallon tank and I'm either going to use that as the sump and get some baffles made or get another 30 gallon sump. I'm probably going to go with the 40 gallon though. No skimmer....that was actually going to be the next question after I buy the pump.

Geez you guys are so smart I get confused easy. LOL. I am going to try to measure the holes right now. I don't even know if it's possible but I'm going to give it a shot. Wish me luck.

AngelLeah1981 · 02-25-2008, 06:21 PM

Well, that was painful. LOL. They look to be 1 5/8 inch around.....I'm mostly sure it isn't 1 6/8 around. Here is a pic.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0338.jpg
I'm going to put macro algae and rock in the sump eventually.

sebastian · 02-25-2008, 06:23 PM

i have Wave 2k ...way to go for movement in the tank but for your sump...120g with one overflow should be able t cary about 1000-1200gph Mag drive 12 will be perfect

klm2500hd · 02-25-2008, 09:43 PM

on a 120 gallon with 2 internal overflows, figure 600 to 800 gph each. (1" drain lines, the bigger of the two holes). at least thats how my 120 is. GenX is an external only pump. I've been running a GenX MAK 4 on mine for 8 years. this returns to each overflow (through the smaller of the two holes) using 3/4" pipe and line-loc. my suggestion is to put a ball valve in the return line to regulate flow to match the drain rate (the drains will be regulated by the height of water in the tank). I also have a T and ball valve on one of my returns to feed water to the fuge, which gravity feeds to the sump

Don't know where your at, but if you're in IL area you're welcome to come by and see my setup for plumbing ideas, chicago suburbs

AngelLeah1981 · 02-27-2008, 09:38 PM

I WISH I lived in Illinois now !! lol Thanks so much you guys !

BigAl07 · 03-04-2008, 08:09 AM

You have replies over at

How many pumps do I need?

Triggerjay · 03-04-2008, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AngelLeah1981

Well, that was painful. LOL. They look to be 1 5/8 inch around.....I'm mostly sure it isn't 1 6/8 around. Here is a pic.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0338.jpg
I'm going to put macro algae and rock in the sump eventually.

I had to drill 1 5/8" holes in mine for 1.5" bulkheads. I bought my bulkheads at a pool supply store.

Jason

02-25-2008, 03:55 PM	#1 (permalink)
AngelLeah1981 Tunicate Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21 View Gallery Karma Komment	Question about pump purchase.... I am needing a pump for a 120 gallon aquarium and I need it to be powerful enough so that I won't have to buy another one later but also keep in mind I'm not wanting to waste money either. lol. This is a tank that is not set up yet but I am wanting to put fish and reef in it. One lfs is suggesting I get one that pumps 1400-1500 gallons per hour and I don't know the price or brand but I'm sure it's ridiculous just like all his other equpiment prices; he is going to call me and let me know today..... and the other lfs suggests a GenX that pumps 1800-2000 gallons per hour and the cost is $120. Is this a good deal? This store usually has good prices but has other issues. lol. Do I need a better brand? Does it matter if it's internal or external? I think he may have said it's internal but I can't remember. How many gph do you suggest and what are your thoughts on this? Also, the lfs with high prices says the GenX only has 6000 which pumps 1600 and a 8500 that pumps 2250 and said the 8500 was probably what the other lfs store was talking about and his price is $199.00. He said this pump can be used as internal or external but he would use it internally because he would be afraid of it overheating ?? Any thoughts and suggestions on this would be GREAT. Thanks. 2 internal overflows 30-40 gallon sump probably going to do a fuge (macro algae and rock in sump)

02-25-2008, 04:05 PM	#2 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,549 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Question about pump purchase.... First thing you need to decide how much gph you want in the tank and then apply the head height (height the pump has to push water up and into the tank). My Mag18 (1800gph) pushes a lot of water but when you calculate the amount of head height it goes down to 1300gph (if memory serves me well). You also need to do this according to how much water will be coming FROM the tank. I wish it were an easier answer but there are a lot of variables involved. good luck and check out our online sponsors. That's where I got mine. Allen __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

02-25-2008, 04:11 PM	#3 (permalink)
CAVINCA Harlequin Tuskfish Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 964 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... is this for flow in the display? Ive been told to keep a 7 to 10 times your tanks volume turn over rate for flow. thats 840 - 1200 turn over rate. instead of one big pump look for multiple small ones. they add up. it really depends on what you want to keep. Saltycritters.com is a good place to shop... Brand wise... You get what you pay for. i couldnt tell you whats best... EDIT- Listen to Al hes older and wiser :-) __________________ Chronicle Marina del Filon de los Carlos (CLOSED) Carl's 55 Gallon Underwater Inn CARL Last edited by CAVINCA : 02-25-2008 at 04:12 PM. Reason: Al was quicker

02-25-2008, 04:34 PM	#4 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,549 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Question about pump purchase.... Thanks Carl! I think... I don't figure "total tank flow" through my sump fuge system. I figure what my over flow will carry down to the sump and go from there. No sense in having a 2000gph pump when the over flow can only handle 1000gph (I'm making these numbers up for comparison only). What you want to do is get your over flow rating, figure your head height and get a pump that's rated for a bit more than that (not double or anything like that). Then you can add a "Closed Loop system" or power heads in the tank to create additional "In Tank" flow. I hope this doesn't create more confusion. __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

02-25-2008, 04:44 PM	#5 (permalink)
AngelLeah1981 Tunicate Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0337.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0336.jpg 48X24X25 I was told the next piece of equipment to buy after the tank would be the pump so I'm just assuming this is for the water that goes from the tank to the sump and back to the tank again. Here's 2 pics of the tank and the holes that are almost as big as a tennis ball. There is a plastic "box like thing" on both sides for the internal overflows each with two holes. ...just thought this info might be helpful.

02-25-2008, 04:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
rmlevasseur Acropora Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Minnesota Posts: 1,849 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Question about pump purchase.... Need more info. Do you have a sump and skimmer already? How many overflows and how big are the holes? I recently compared an order between Marine Depot and Dr Fosters and Smith. Even though Marine Depot had free shipping, Dr. F&S won by $40. Order included salt, nets, 4 koralias, carbon, selcon and some other misc. stuff. All the items were identical. __________________ Robert http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/...ufas-tank.html

02-25-2008, 04:48 PM	#7 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,549 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Question about pump purchase.... That's very helpful! Those "Boxes" are the OverFlows and that's where surface water is skimmed off. Inside each over flow will be plumbing to take water FROM The tank to the sump as well as plumbing to take water from the sump and RETURN it to the Display Tank (DT). What you need to find out is how much water will those two over flows drain into the sump. I don't have a calculator to figure that out but you'll need to know what size each hole is and then come back here. When the hole size is known then someone can tell you what size bulkhead is used. A bulkhead will return a specific amount of water due to gravity. We use THAT information to figure how much water is in your sump and match that amount for the return pump size. See it's not THAT difficult!! Well actually it CAN be but you have a whole TEAM or Reef Enthusiasts here on your side. Good luck! __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

02-25-2008, 05:48 PM	#8 (permalink)
AngelLeah1981 Tunicate Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... I'm thinking of going witht he Wave2K for flow. I think this is for return. I only need one pump, right? Why would I need multiple small pumps instead of one? How do you know how many gph your overflow can handle? How do I get my overflow rathing? I have a 40 gallon tank and I'm either going to use that as the sump and get some baffles made or get another 30 gallon sump. I'm probably going to go with the 40 gallon though. No skimmer....that was actually going to be the next question after I buy the pump. Geez you guys are so smart I get confused easy. LOL. I am going to try to measure the holes right now. I don't even know if it's possible but I'm going to give it a shot. Wish me luck.

02-25-2008, 06:21 PM	#9 (permalink)
AngelLeah1981 Tunicate Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... Well, that was painful. LOL. They look to be 1 5/8 inch around.....I'm mostly sure it isn't 1 6/8 around. Here is a pic. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...m/PIC-0338.jpg I'm going to put macro algae and rock in the sump eventually.

02-25-2008, 06:23 PM	#10 (permalink)
sebastian Scopas Tang Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: lake zurich, il Posts: 423 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... i have Wave 2k ...way to go for movement in the tank but for your sump...120g with one overflow should be able t cary about 1000-1200gph Mag drive 12 will be perfect __________________ Sebastian member of CMAS 125G AGA + 30G sump (home made) 750W MH + 390W PC light =1140W Wave 2K (4,000 g/h), mag-drive 12 (1,000 g/h) Euro reef skimmer RS 135 Hammer corals, zoo's, green star polyps, neon green button polyps, frogspan, leathers, xenias, 100's mashrooms, ricordias, fungias, green oxypora, snake polyps, brown Caribbean zoanthid (palythoa carribaeorum) regal tang, yellow tang, six line wrasse, cleaner wrasse, (2) lyretail anthias, eibli angel, ocellaris clowns

02-25-2008, 09:43 PM	#11 (permalink)
klm2500hd Bryozoan Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: IL Posts: 40 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... on a 120 gallon with 2 internal overflows, figure 600 to 800 gph each. (1" drain lines, the bigger of the two holes). at least thats how my 120 is. GenX is an external only pump. I've been running a GenX MAK 4 on mine for 8 years. this returns to each overflow (through the smaller of the two holes) using 3/4" pipe and line-loc. my suggestion is to put a ball valve in the return line to regulate flow to match the drain rate (the drains will be regulated by the height of water in the tank). I also have a T and ball valve on one of my returns to feed water to the fuge, which gravity feeds to the sump Don't know where your at, but if you're in IL area you're welcome to come by and see my setup for plumbing ideas, chicago suburbs

02-27-2008, 09:38 PM	#12 (permalink)
AngelLeah1981 Tunicate Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Question about pump purchase.... I WISH I lived in Illinois now !! lol Thanks so much you guys !

03-04-2008, 08:09 AM	#13 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,549 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Question about pump purchase.... You have replies over at How many pumps do I need? __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

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