What return pump should I get

lcstorc · 11-02-2009, 10:34 AM

Ok, we are re-doing all of the plumbing on our 125 and in the process want to get a new return pump. Right now we are running a Mag 18 externally, but apparently we have had trouble with leaks running it externally so Frank wants to go with a true external pump. The current plumbing takes a lot of angles that I know are cutting things down a lot. With the new set-up, I will have about 5 feet vertical head, a T to send part of the flow to the fuge, and I am not sure what we will need to get the water into the tank. Right now there are 3 90s to go over the overflow and down back into the tank. I know that sounds strange. I'll try to draw a picture so you can get an idea.
Since we are tearing apart all of the plumbing I don't have answers to a lot of the normal questions like what size PVC and stuff like that.
I have a 6ft 125g tank and have 4 Koralia #3s for additional flow. Right now the reef is softies and LPS but we would like to add a few SPS.
We are going to be re-arranging the sump and fuge but the sump is separated into 3 areas. Pretty standard setup except the fuge is a separate tank that right now feeds into the return area of the sump.
What I am looking for at the moment is recommendations for a good return pump that is going to be reliable but is not going to kill the bank account. I know you get what you pay for and I am not looking to go with super cheap at the expense of reliability but something that is a good value.
So, let me know what you think.

DaveK · 11-02-2009, 10:59 AM

My choice for external pumps is Iwaki. Yes, they are more expensive, but not outrageously so. They will last forever, and are easy to maintain. Also, replacement parts are available.

There are several other similar brands available. I think these would also be fine, but I've never used any.

Lastly, the return pump is the heart of your reef system. This is one area you don't want to skimp on.

BigAl07 · 11-02-2009, 11:05 AM

So I assume running it "Internal" isn't an option?

lcstorc · 11-02-2009, 11:39 AM

The problem with internal is the heat. With my systems heat is a constant battle so that is the reason for the external.
I agree that I don't want to skimp. Just looking for a good value. I would much rather pay a few dollars more up front and get something reliable.
Iwaki is one of the ones I have been looking at and they seem to have a good reputation. Lasting forever and easy to maintain are definitely positives and easily found replacement parts is another good thing.

BigAl07 · 11-02-2009, 11:44 AM

External go IWAKI! You'd be hard pressed to get a better pump without paying a LOT more $$.

I don't have any indication that my Mag18 puts much heat into the water. Maybe I'm just kidding myself but I can't tell any difference in tank temps with or without it. I can run my tank without the sump (during big changes, cleaning the sump or fuge etc) and looking back at my charts the heater didn't run any more without the Mag18 as they do with it and the temps remained constant +/- 2 degree. The ONLY time I noticed a heat problem with my Mag18 is when a "rip cord" for a media net got sucked into it and seized the pump. Yeah I saw a TEMP increase that day....

Woodstock · 11-02-2009, 11:54 AM

The size of the pump you need will be determined by the overflow and drain size and how much water flow they can handle.
As far as recommendations, I currently use one Iwaki and two Gen-X external pumps. Both work great.

lcstorc · 11-02-2009, 12:53 PM

I don't know how to determine the rate of the overeflow. Basically one end of the tank is sectioned off and overflows into the small section.
I am almost certain the drain is 1 1/2 though I can verify that when I get home.

Hemlock · 11-02-2009, 04:35 PM

I have a blue line HD100 pump that's been working really well for the last few months, the only con to it is that the fan is a little loud other than that I'm happy with it (but it's in the basement anyway LOL)

DrHank · 11-03-2009, 05:46 PM

For that size tank I'd probably use a Gen x Mac 4 pump. Especially since you were thinking of a Mag 18. It should give you close to 600 gph at 5' head which is good turnover for a tank your size.

If you want to compare some others, you might want to use this:

Head Loss

P.S. - Don't tell anyone but it's what I'm using on my 200 gallon and it works great. Don't confuse flow and turnover and don't try to use a return pump to generate flow. Your power heads are the key there as I'm sure you know. I went from Korallias to Sure flow modded Maxijets. What a difference!

lcstorc · 11-03-2009, 08:42 PM

Well, the Mag 18 is what I have now, but I know I can reduce the head loss from what I have now and end up with more flow from the same size pump. I am not necessarily looking for more flow from the return though a bit would be nice. I am more looking for something effecient that is going to last.
As things usually go, this system started as one thing and has morphed over time with things being added and changed etc. The result is plumbing all over the place that can definitely be condensed as well as replace Ts with Ys and 90s with 45s etc.

BigAl07 · 11-03-2009, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lcstorc

...... The result is plumbing all over the place that can definitely be condensed as well as replace Ts with Ys and 90s with 45s etc.

Poor Frank!!

11-02-2009, 10:34 AM	#1 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 26,437 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	What return pump should I get Ok, we are re-doing all of the plumbing on our 125 and in the process want to get a new return pump. Right now we are running a Mag 18 externally, but apparently we have had trouble with leaks running it externally so Frank wants to go with a true external pump. The current plumbing takes a lot of angles that I know are cutting things down a lot. With the new set-up, I will have about 5 feet vertical head, a T to send part of the flow to the fuge, and I am not sure what we will need to get the water into the tank. Right now there are 3 90s to go over the overflow and down back into the tank. I know that sounds strange. I'll try to draw a picture so you can get an idea. Since we are tearing apart all of the plumbing I don't have answers to a lot of the normal questions like what size PVC and stuff like that. I have a 6ft 125g tank and have 4 Koralia #3s for additional flow. Right now the reef is softies and LPS but we would like to add a few SPS. We are going to be re-arranging the sump and fuge but the sump is separated into 3 areas. Pretty standard setup except the fuge is a separate tank that right now feeds into the return area of the sump. What I am looking for at the moment is recommendations for a good return pump that is going to be reliable but is not going to kill the bank account. I know you get what you pay for and I am not looking to go with super cheap at the expense of reliability but something that is a good value. So, let me know what you think. __________________ Peace LYNN Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g of sunshine Lynn's frag tank experiment A reef tank is like a race car. The faster you go the harder you crash.

11-02-2009, 10:59 AM	#2 (permalink)
DaveK Reef Lobster Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Philadelpahia, PA Posts: 1,370 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: What return pump should I get My choice for external pumps is Iwaki. Yes, they are more expensive, but not outrageously so. They will last forever, and are easy to maintain. Also, replacement parts are available. There are several other similar brands available. I think these would also be fine, but I've never used any. Lastly, the return pump is the heart of your reef system. This is one area you don't want to skimp on.

11-02-2009, 11:05 AM	#3 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,551 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get So I assume running it "Internal" isn't an option? __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

11-02-2009, 11:39 AM	#4 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 26,437 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get The problem with internal is the heat. With my systems heat is a constant battle so that is the reason for the external. I agree that I don't want to skimp. Just looking for a good value. I would much rather pay a few dollars more up front and get something reliable. Iwaki is one of the ones I have been looking at and they seem to have a good reputation. Lasting forever and easy to maintain are definitely positives and easily found replacement parts is another good thing. __________________ Peace LYNN Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g of sunshine Lynn's frag tank experiment A reef tank is like a race car. The faster you go the harder you crash.

11-02-2009, 11:44 AM	#5 (permalink)
BigAl07 Do I look as lost as I am Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waynesville, North Carolina Posts: 21,551 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get External go IWAKI! You'd be hard pressed to get a better pump without paying a LOT more $$. I don't have any indication that my Mag18 puts much heat into the water. Maybe I'm just kidding myself but I can't tell any difference in tank temps with or without it. I can run my tank without the sump (during big changes, cleaning the sump or fuge etc) and looking back at my charts the heater didn't run any more without the Mag18 as they do with it and the temps remained constant +/- 2 degree. The ONLY time I noticed a heat problem with my Mag18 is when a "rip cord" for a media net got sucked into it and seized the pump. Yeah I saw a TEMP increase that day.... __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~ *Live Rock Rubble will do the SAME thing as Bio-Balls and is NOT a suitable replacement for BIO-BALLS in a Reef System! It's ALL gotta go!!* Nitrate (NO3) reduction is directly proportional to percentage of Water Change. Allen's home-made formula...currentNO3-((%WC.01)currentNO3)=finalNO3 (thanks Luukosian) This means if you change 50% of your total water volume (That's EVERYTHING) you'll get a net reduction of (NO3) somewhere around 50%. Ask me about how to increase your REEF budget without going without FOOD!!* Big Al's 10g Julie's (BigAl's Gal) 6g NanoCube Gone but not forgotten BigAl's Slow 90g Tank Chronicle Allens OFFICE 12g Nano-Reef

11-02-2009, 11:54 AM	#6 (permalink)
Woodstock The Wand Geek was here. ;) Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 25,502 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get The size of the pump you need will be determined by the overflow and drain size and how much water flow they can handle. As far as recommendations, I currently use one Iwaki and two Gen-X external pumps. Both work great. __________________ ~Doni Marie~ *GOT ICH???* *My Victorious Battle with ICH* 120 Reef Chronicle ~ *Breeding Picasso Clownfish~* *Massive 300 gal growout~* *My Anemone & Picasso Tank ~* *Picasso & Snowcasso for sale~* "Energy and persistance conquer all things." Benjamin Franklin __________________________________________________ ______________________________________________

11-02-2009, 12:53 PM	#7 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 26,437 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get I don't know how to determine the rate of the overeflow. Basically one end of the tank is sectioned off and overflows into the small section. I am almost certain the drain is 1 1/2 though I can verify that when I get home. __________________ Peace LYNN Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g of sunshine Lynn's frag tank experiment A reef tank is like a race car. The faster you go the harder you crash.

11-02-2009, 04:35 PM	#8 (permalink)
Hemlock Bryozoan Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: New Jersey Posts: 53 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: What return pump should I get I have a blue line HD100 pump that's been working really well for the last few months, the only con to it is that the fan is a little loud other than that I'm happy with it (but it's in the basement anyway LOL)

11-03-2009, 05:46 PM	#9 (permalink)
DrHank Golden Moray Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Crestview, FL Posts: 2,758 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: What return pump should I get For that size tank I'd probably use a Gen x Mac 4 pump. Especially since you were thinking of a Mag 18. It should give you close to 600 gph at 5' head which is good turnover for a tank your size. If you want to compare some others, you might want to use this: Head Loss P.S. - Don't tell anyone but it's what I'm using on my 200 gallon and it works great. Don't confuse flow and turnover and don't try to use a return pump to generate flow. Your power heads are the key there as I'm sure you know. I went from Korallias to Sure flow modded Maxijets. What a difference! __________________ Doc Dr Hank's 210 Build: http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/...nks-tanks.html

11-03-2009, 08:42 PM	#10 (permalink)
lcstorc Sunshine Reefer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Cocoa Fl Posts: 26,437 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: What return pump should I get Well, the Mag 18 is what I have now, but I know I can reduce the head loss from what I have now and end up with more flow from the same size pump. I am not necessarily looking for more flow from the return though a bit would be nice. I am more looking for something effecient that is going to last. As things usually go, this system started as one thing and has morphed over time with things being added and changed etc. The result is plumbing all over the place that can definitely be condensed as well as replace Ts with Ys and 90s with 45s etc. __________________ Peace LYNN Lynn and Franks saltwater adventure Lynn's 20g clown tank Lynn's 90g of sunshine Lynn's frag tank experiment A reef tank is like a race car. The faster you go the harder you crash.

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