Need help with plumbing

taklein65 · 03-03-2008, 07:33 PM

I need help with return piping on mag 9.5. My plan is to run this in 1.50" PVC. Right out of the pump into a 45 degree ell run 20" (in this 20" run i will put in a 1.50" ball union valve) into another 45 degree ell to go up the back, run 33" (in this 33" run up i will put in a 1.50" union) up into a tee to run along the back top of the tank and break off into 2 to 5 outlets to the tank(these will be 3/4" 90's and or 45's for the outlets). Iam going for turn over in the tank. Should i change anything or will this be good? Any help is welcome

JoJo · 03-03-2008, 07:53 PM

i'm a beginner myself so take my suggestions with a bag of salt. I would only go as big as a 1", i think if its any bigger it may have too much air & not enough pressure to feed the outlets(i would make the outlets 1/2).

I would put the union as close to the pump as possible & the valve directly behind it(opposite of the pump) because that less water that would drain out when you seperate the union.

i'm sure others will chime in, i hope, i dont want you to rely soley on my suggestion

tbittner · 03-03-2008, 08:02 PM

53" total? All uphill?

Great choice to use 45's though. That really helps keep the head pressure down. JoJo is right about having a ball valve as close to the pump as possible. But this is a dilema because you don't want a ball valve that close to the pump BUT you do in case you need to remove the pump.

I always use two ball valves. One as close to the pump as I can get so I don't create too much of a mess when I need to get the pump out for maintenance. Another ball valve closer to the top of the tank in order to control flow so I can match the flow from the overflow box.

As far as pipe size, it depends on if you are wanting forceful flow or not. The volume will be the same.

NATIVEVAMAN · 03-03-2008, 08:14 PM

It seems to me that what youare trying to do is run a sort of closed loop.Doing that with a sump is only partially effective.Before you get the flow you want you will surpass the returns capapbility to keep up.If it was me I would consider a true closed loop.Simply put you drill a hole in the back of the tank that feeds the suction side of a pump,then goes back to outlets in the tank.Closed loop systems can generate some amazing flows.They are not without there problems but they arnt rocket science either.

taklein65 · 03-03-2008, 10:09 PM

My bad its call a union ball valve all one unit. Its a ball valve with a union fitting on each end plus i also have a true union to put in this. So i should change the pipe size to 1" and make my outlets 1/2" than. You think this would be best. I had it in 3/4" with 2 1/2" outlets once but i had to close the ball valve on the overflow down by a third to half to keep an equal flow. The head loss calculate showed i was only pumping around 220 gph. When done in 1.50" it showed 729 gph. I would like to hit the 600+ gph mark. my overflow is the CPR 1200 it has 2-1" pipes out of it. 1 outlet has a piece of 1" PVC about 5" tall to act as on emergency overflow in case there is a blockage in the other. No water on the floor is my goal(the wife would kill me

).I'll watch for a few more days before i do anything don't want to change it again if i don't have to.

Scouter Steve · 03-03-2008, 10:18 PM

Stay with the 1 1/2 for the mag pump output. Magdrives like the bigger pipe, some pressure pumps are better with a 1 inch-not the case with Mag Drive. Check the manufactures site for more reasons. Keep your output nozzels at least 3/4 or else you may get a jet like spray cutting a hole in the other side of the display tank!

JoJo · 03-04-2008, 02:37 AM

Steve, I have heard about bigger diameter on the Mags but didnt know how true it was. Taklein, you aiming for 2-5 outlets(3/4"), as Terry stated it may work depending on the type of pressure you want of them & the exact amount you will have.

Terry i will be using double ball valve now, great idea.

taklein65 · 03-04-2008, 06:18 PM

Do you think 2 will be to strong of a flow i don't want a sand storm. If so do you think 5 is to little flow maybe 3-4 i don't know. I just want to get good flow thur out the tank at all levels. I don't want to have to do this again. Maybe buy another pump to replace the 9.5 with like the 12 or 18 was trying to get about 5X the tank in turn over before i put anything else in there.

03-03-2008, 07:33 PM	#1 (permalink)
taklein65 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 22 View Gallery Karma Komment	Need help with plumbing I need help with return piping on mag 9.5. My plan is to run this in 1.50" PVC. Right out of the pump into a 45 degree ell run 20" (in this 20" run i will put in a 1.50" ball union valve) into another 45 degree ell to go up the back, run 33" (in this 33" run up i will put in a 1.50" union) up into a tee to run along the back top of the tank and break off into 2 to 5 outlets to the tank(these will be 3/4" 90's and or 45's for the outlets). Iam going for turn over in the tank. Should i change anything or will this be good? Any help is welcome

03-03-2008, 08:02 PM	#3 (permalink)
tbittner Watch this Ma! Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern VA Posts: 5,562 View Gallery Karma Komment Add yours!	Re: Need help with plumbing 53" total? All uphill? Great choice to use 45's though. That really helps keep the head pressure down. JoJo is right about having a ball valve as close to the pump as possible. But this is a dilema because you don't want a ball valve that close to the pump BUT you do in case you need to remove the pump. I always use two ball valves. One as close to the pump as I can get so I don't create too much of a mess when I need to get the pump out for maintenance. Another ball valve closer to the top of the tank in order to control flow so I can match the flow from the overflow box. As far as pipe size, it depends on if you are wanting forceful flow or not. The volume will be the same. __________________ Terry 150g predator tank full of killers. Soon to be upgraded to a 360g. 450g reef 300g sump.

03-03-2008, 08:14 PM	#4 (permalink)
NATIVEVAMAN Serpent Star Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Richmond va Posts: 209 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Need help with plumbing It seems to me that what youare trying to do is run a sort of closed loop.Doing that with a sump is only partially effective.Before you get the flow you want you will surpass the returns capapbility to keep up.If it was me I would consider a true closed loop.Simply put you drill a hole in the back of the tank that feeds the suction side of a pump,then goes back to outlets in the tank.Closed loop systems can generate some amazing flows.They are not without there problems but they arnt rocket science either.

03-03-2008, 10:09 PM	#5 (permalink)
taklein65 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 22 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Need help with plumbing My bad its call a union ball valve all one unit. Its a ball valve with a union fitting on each end plus i also have a true union to put in this. So i should change the pipe size to 1" and make my outlets 1/2" than. You think this would be best. I had it in 3/4" with 2 1/2" outlets once but i had to close the ball valve on the overflow down by a third to half to keep an equal flow. The head loss calculate showed i was only pumping around 220 gph. When done in 1.50" it showed 729 gph. I would like to hit the 600+ gph mark. my overflow is the CPR 1200 it has 2-1" pipes out of it. 1 outlet has a piece of 1" PVC about 5" tall to act as on emergency overflow in case there is a blockage in the other. No water on the floor is my goal(the wife would kill me ).I'll watch for a few more days before i do anything don't want to change it again if i don't have to.

03-03-2008, 10:18 PM	#6 (permalink)
Scouter Steve Neon dottyback Join Date: May 2006 Location: Somers Wisconsin (Kenosha County) Posts: 683 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Need help with plumbing Stay with the 1 1/2 for the mag pump output. Magdrives like the bigger pipe, some pressure pumps are better with a 1 inch-not the case with Mag Drive. Check the manufactures site for more reasons. Keep your output nozzels at least 3/4 or else you may get a jet like spray cutting a hole in the other side of the display tank!

03-04-2008, 06:18 PM	#8 (permalink)
taklein65 Tunicate Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 22 View Gallery Karma Komment	Re: Need help with plumbing Do you think 2 will be to strong of a flow i don't want a sand storm. If so do you think 5 is to little flow maybe 3-4 i don't know. I just want to get good flow thur out the tank at all levels. I don't want to have to do this again. Maybe buy another pump to replace the 9.5 with like the 12 or 18 was trying to get about 5X the tank in turn over before i put anything else in there.

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