Sub floors & preparing for your new aquarium

[cioutlaw]

Great topic & perfect timing...I am getting ready to upgrade tanks to a 225gallon & the tank will sit where the current 120G sits which is on a carpeted concrete slab. The plan was to replace the carpeted area where the tank is with ceramic tile that matches our kitchen that is connected but elevated & on a crawlspace. Tile is discontinued & the wife has decided she wants hard wood in this room. Do you guys see a problem with putting a tank this size on hardwood above concrete? Any advise is appreciated. Also I would apreciate any advice on my stand building/hacking job . Cioutlaws 225 gallon

[Frankie]

The first thing i would check for is how level the concrete is and make the correct adjustments. If you are planning for wood over concrete I would rule out a floating floor. They need to float and an aquarium will prevent this from happening. Floating floors need to move a lot for contracting and expansion. If you put a tank that large on it, it could cause the floor to buckle.
Now a glue down laminate true wood floor would be great. This is an engineered floor made up of 7 layers just like plywood. The woods used are hard woods. very durable. Manninton makes an awesome glue down floor. The finishes are very strong and resistant to water. You can check out there web site for info.

[Woodstock]

Hehehe... I did move it once from Off Topic to General Reef Discussion

Great thread!!

[BigAl07]

Excellent suggestions Frankie! The floating floor would be very bad in this instance but I would bet you many "remodelers" would suggest and even install that product here. It seems that anytime someone mentions hardwood and concrete in the same sentence they say "Floating floor". I think this comes from media hype and the Floating Floor commercials on all of the DIY channels. The engineered hardwood is hands down a much superior product in every respect and ESPECIALLY in this one. These floors are very strong and durable and can be refinished several times if need be.

cioutlaw your stand it looking SHARP!! I'm tracking your build closely as I HOPE to be following in your footsteps ONE day!!

Allen

[cioutlaw]

One look at the pad that goes under the Pergo floors & I said no way. What should go between the "engineered hardwood" & concrete? I looked at Lowes the other night & from what I could tell they just put some black sheeting..vapor barrier maybe? Does this stuff just lay or does it need glued?

[Frankie]

No under lament with a glue down. You will want to use a good glue for a engineered floor like Bostik's best.Lumber Liquidators: Bostik Best Adhesive

[Canar]

I am having a hard time getting a straight answer or finding someone that can help me figure out how much weight my current floor can support. I also want to know the most cost effective way to make it more then strong enough to support my new monster of a tank soon to be installed.

The floor of the room it is going in uses 2X10's spaced 16 inches apart.

The tank will be 10- feet long. The first two 2x10's are doubled up. Also the last one the tank will rest on is doubled up.

The tank will cross them.

The tank will be dead in the middle of the room and be about 38 inches wide. The span of the 2X10's is 15.5 feet.

I have a filter room built under this that cuts the span down some but it is made with metal 2X4's and I am told that will not help at all.

I am thinking of getting a couple posts with an I beam for under the tank. I dont want to guess at this though.

The new tank full will weight about six thousand pounds

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

Ted

[Woodstock]

Originally Posted by Canar

I am having a hard time getting a straight answer or finding someone that can help me figure out how much weight my current floor can support. I also want to know the most cost effective way to make it more then strong enough to support my new monster of a tank soon to be installed.



Ted

Ted,
I recommend calling an engineer to inspect the floor.

[Frankie]

Canar, are the 2x10's on hangers or are the sitting on a wall? If on a wall you should be ok with the weight. The big problem i see happening is sagging in the middle of the room. If it was mine i would put the beams in the center of the room below. And is that lower room on a slab or over a basement? 2x10's on 16 center can hold a lot of weight. It really comes down to how there installed and what lies beneath. I would get a structural engineer to come sign off on this one just to be safe. Its hard to tell with out looking at your situation.

[Canar]

The room below the tank is the basement.

The 2X10's are sitting on a wall on one side and on cement foundation on the other.

I think when I figure it out there would be about 750 pounds per 2X10

That is taking the 6k weight and dividing it by the number of 2X10's it sits on.

I thought about just adding an I beam in the middle of the room with a couple posts. Someone told me if I did that I would be putting all 6k pounds on the two posts and could punch holes in the cement.

Ted

[BigAl07]

You've been given some very good advice here. One thing I want to stress to EVERYONE here is that you have to figure into the factor in what ELSE is applying weight/load to your floor system and how this is being abated into the foundation. Yes those 2x10's will usually carry more load than you'd put onto them just in a floor system. But you have to also factor into the equation what's above this floor and how that load is being transferred into the foundation. Is there another floor above? I assume there's a roof system? Is the roof loading the floor system? Has it created a "point load" that we can't add to? The questions and information that are needed to figure this will seem over whelming but they are pretty easy to figure and calculate if you know what's going on. There was a time when a contractor would look at it, squint, rubs his hands together and say "Yeah that will work." Those days are LONG gone! You need someone who is licensed and trained to make these decisions and don't do any guessing. Better safe than sorry!


On a side note..... many moons ago I wanted a hot-tub. Had a contractor come inspect my deck to make sure it would work (Mistake #1). He said that hand railing needed to be replaced but other than that you could drive a CEMENT truck on the deck. So I paid him to replace the handrail (Mistake #2 over paid to be exact) and then ordered the Hot-tub. Mind you it was ONLY a 90g "Soft-tub" (which is a VERY light weight economical system) and when they delivered it I started filling it up right away! After about 15 minutes I noticed that the hot-tub was NOT level. I thought that's strange.. the deck LOOKED level!! I let it keep filling (Mistake #3) and went back into the house. About 20 minutes later I heard someone yelling for me from outside. It was my neighbor! She wanted to know why my deck looked so funny and what's all the water running into her driveway about! The deck had given way slowly and was now pouring gallons of water over the edge of the half full hot-tub down my yard and over the neighbors drive way. What happened was the deck LOOKED structurally sound from ABOVE!! [B]In fact it was anything BUT![/b] The wood was water logged (rental house and it had NOT gutters so all rain water was running onto deck) and the nails that attached the joists to the ledger board was so algae and mildew covered that they simply pulled out releasing the joists!! This happened gradually over several minutes so there wasn't any noises, cracks and BANGS to alert me. We had to drain the tub, replace the majority of the deck and then 2 weeks later filled the hot-tub for a summer I will take a LONG time for forget!! *Grins*

Just because it "looks" structurally sound by NO way means it is! Lucky this deck was only 18" off the ground but every one here can see where this COULD have been a terrible story!!

So always err on the side of safety and you'll never regret it!!

Sincerely,
Allen

[BigAl07]

Originally Posted by Canar

The room below the tank is the basement.

The 2X10's are sitting on a wall on one side and on cement foundation on the other.

I think when I figure it out there would be about 750 pounds per 2X10

That is taking the 6k weight and dividing it by the number of 2X10's it sits on.

I thought about just adding an I beam in the middle of the room with a couple posts. Someone told me if I did that I would be putting all 6k pounds on the two posts and could punch holes in the cement.

Ted

Yes you will be doing that! Your foundation has to be reinforeced for "point-loads" like that. It's called a "thickened slab". There are MANY ways to redistribute loads and most aren't that expensive or elaborate. You just really NEED someone to come calculate what's already loading where and then add in your new tank. It sounds a LOT more complicated and EXPENSIVE than it usually is. I tend to over complicate EVERYTHING but then again that's what I DO!! I'm a NERD!!

Hang in there and don't get your hopes down! It's all good!!

Allen

[boozeman]

[Frankie]

LOL Booze.
Al is right. You need to have this looked at. This thread is in no way a cure to structural integrity in any situation. I want this to be a safe and serious thread to answer things just like this. The end result will usually be "get an engineer over". It dose not cost to much to have someone to come look and advise. If any one here ever has trouble locating the proper inspectors please pm me with your location and i will help to set it up. In the end it will save you money and possibly a life.
Tomorrow i will be answering Woodstocks questions about care and protection for wood floors and some interesting information on plywoods i found.

[BigAl07]

Keep up the good work Frankie!!

Allen