Fragging Madness . . .

[BigAl07]

A local reefer and I are VERY interested in starting a dedicated Frag Tank. Not for the sole purpose of selling frags but to be able to grow our own cultures from small inexpensive specimen and watch them grow and morph into new and exciting critters.

I have some questiosn for those who are more experience in fragging (more = ANY expereience fragging).

We are thinking of a 1' tall tank there by making it so much easier to work with the tank. Maybe something in the 20 gallon range... maybe more?

We want to keep it a standard dimension of length so we can use standard store bought lights. Right?

If it's only 12" deep can wereally justify MH lights? Aren't they more intended for better water penetration?

Since no fish will be introduced to this tank can we fore-go the LR and use another filter system?



If you were setting this up in a basement where "decor" wasn't an issue would it be:

Bare bottom
Live Sand
Live Rock
Canister Filtration
HOB Filtration
MH lights
PC lighting

I think we are going to attempt to utilize the "Egg Crate" shelfs with plugs

Now about plugs......

Any reason why NOT to use ceramic plugs as opposed to reef plugs that require soaking/cycling?

Thanks for your input.

Allenl

[kyle1284]

im gonna watch this one

[mps9506]

Water volume and flow are your friend here. I would suggest minimum of a 40 breeder with a sump. Ditch the canister filter and do a sump with either a fuge or protein skimmer. Depending on what frags you want to grow I would recomend either haildes or T5 HO's. The more I see T5's on tanks in person the more I'm growing fond of them. You can get into a very effcient t5 setup for the same price as a PC setup that won't provide the same efficency and require more bulb changes.
AFA as filtration, like I said go with the sump, and either use a protein skimmer or convert it to a fuge with live rock. The live rock will give you the stability needed from the bacteria to provide healthy water conditions for your corals to grow.
Most folks have frag tanks connected to display tanks or filteration setups with live rock. Not to much out there can provide the same conditions for good anaerobic denitrification.

You still want to put some type of invertabrate life in the tank such as snails/hermits etc to help reduce algae growth.

[BigAl07]

Sounds like a very good idea. I love the idea of a fuge to. We could have the frag tank up on the main level and add another tank below with the goodies and LR too. Would we be ok to run a thin layer of sand or would it be better with a DBS as well.

So are we on the right track with a short tank with a large foot print?? This would make it easier to move things around and actually WORK in the tank.

Now the idea of T5 HO's is something I didn't even think of. I was just thinking between PC and MH. That's why I am here! The more ideas and suggestions the better.

We would for sure have a CUC for obvious reasons.

Thanks for the input!!

Allen

[mps9506]

Yep, shallow tank with maximum surface area to maximize the number of frags you can grow. The shallow water will serve a couple of benefits. First and foremost, maximizes the light that gets to the frags, next like you say it makes it easy to get to the corals etc., finally I think the increased surcace area helps out a lot with gas exchange and can help maximize gas exchange.

Fuge can let you culture macroalgae and other goodies. I personally like going with no substrate, in a setup like you are going with. Saves money and there isn't much need for one, other than a place for macro algae to root in. Rubble rock or coarse substrate seems to encourage more pods to grow in, but also accumilates detritus more rapidly which can increase the nutrients in the water. Again, depending on the type of corals you want to grow that might not be a bad thing.

[BigAl07]

Not sure if this link will work but it looks something like what I am thinking about doing..

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...yofFragFTS.jpg

Allen

[mps9506]

Get to work. We need more frags in NC

[EagleEyes]

That looks like my LFS.. probably a good way to go too they have a sand bed for snails and the tanks along each wall are all connected. There are about three systems. They obviously dont need the LR because the water to livestock ratio is so great that they neednt do anything except test and make sure it is sustainable. Bioload probably doesnt give problems.

[jg2269jg]

great ideas i love RS keep us posted

[BigAl07]

Any input on the ceramic plugs as opposed to alternatives?

This is my first attempt at even contemplating an extensive filter set-up as I only have experience with HOB filters and the all-in-one system like in My nano cube. How do I get the water down into the sump without creating a potential for flooding during power outage? don't want to run dual pumps because if one fails the other keeps running and floods either display or sump. Maybe we should create/replicate the HOB system like I have on my 10g. We could create an elevated stand to have a 10g as a sump/fuge slightly higher and have it gravity feed back into the frag tank.

[EagleEyes]

You will have to drill the tank for plumbing. Let the water overflow back to the sump where you can have a pump feeding the sump water back to the display. Get a powerful pump so you wont need two. Then, if the pump fails, leave enough space so that the rest of the overflow water in the main tank wont flood the sump and subsequently the floor. Thats what im trying to do. The sump will have to be at a lower elevation than the main tank though.

[Cassette87]

I'm pretty interested in this too.. i've got a 20 long lying around doing nothing, but I don't have the resources available to a sump with overflow and all. I may try it just for the heck of it...

[EagleEyes]

I have the same thing and i am going to do a cheap ten gallon ($10 tank) sump. Theres a strong pump that is sold by Aquatic Ecosystems that we use at my lab. Has 250gph capacity and i think that is what i will be using.

[mps9506]

Originally Posted by BigAl07

Any input on the ceramic plugs as opposed to alternatives?

This is my first attempt at even contemplating an extensive filter set-up as I only have experience with HOB filters and the all-in-one system like in My nano cube. How do I get the water down into the sump without creating a potential for flooding during power outage? don't want to run dual pumps because if one fails the other keeps running and floods either display or sump. Maybe we should create/replicate the HOB system like I have on my 10g. We could create an elevated stand to have a 10g as a sump/fuge slightly higher and have it gravity feed back into the frag tank.

Eagle Eyes reply is correct, either drill the tank, or, you can purchase a quality hang on overflow, like a lifereef (I do not recomend the CPR). This will run you more than the tank most likely, usually $40-$60. Sometimes you can find em used for cheap. You might want to check with Asheville Aquarium to see if they drill tanks, I'm not sure if he does or not.
AFA as frag plugs, I honestly don't think it matters to much what you use, ceramic, aragonite, plastic, sea shells, rubble rock. Whatever works easiest for you and is easiest to get. I'm not sure what reef plugs you are refering to that require cycling/soaking.
I personally like receiving my frags on the smallest plugs possible so it is easy to cut them off or hide them when I place them in my tank. I HATE those big round plugs that have become popular with the reef farmers overseas, I'm sure it works great for them since the plugs are heavy, but they are hideous in the tank while you are waiting for your neon blue/green and pink tip grows 2 inches a year acro to fill in the space. Not that I have one.

[Triggerjay]

I am having a custom acrylic frag tank built. It will sit on a stand in the basement next to and above my sump. My sump will be a 150g rubbermaid stock tank. The main tank is a 125g, upstairs in the living room. circulation will be provided by a sequence barracuda, pumping water from the sump, to the main display upstairs. The main tank will have 4 1-1/2" drains, two of which will return to the sump, and the other two going to the frag tank. The frag tank will have 3 1-1/2 drains, draining directly into the sump. The frag tank will measure 4x4, and 1 foot deep, with a single 400w 6500k MH over it. Light cycle on the frag tank will be reverse from the main tank to help stabilize PH. I am also going to run a sequence dart on the main display for a CL. Flow from the main pump should be around 2750gph, at the main display (12 ft head), and the two drains going to the frag tank should be about 1/2 that,... which should be plenty of flow for a frag tank. (If not, I will re-route another drain). I had planned on using my 75g tank for a frag tank, but when I tried to drill the side, I found out the hard way it was tempered... so that tank no longer exists. I have also seen the ceramic frag discs, and would like to hear from someone using them...

Jason