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Originally Posted by fishcrazy You better believe it!!!
BTW...I love your tank. I'm also curious if at one time you were the same person doing a draw through a plenum in your tank some time back. If so, I applaud you and I'm sorry that people can sometimes be not be so nice. Also, Kudos for showing how to do the Zeovit system "on the cheap"
There are great risks if you overdose or quit dosing quickly. ..........
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Assuming you don't accidentally overdose, the affects on N and P are temporary. Bacteria are primarily food limited (but also somewhat housing space limited). There are bacteria that are motile and run around the water column that you can skim out as well as bacteria growin on his floss, but for the most part, they live in biofilms on a surface. After the bacterial bloom, how many of the bacteria are we really skimming out vs creating thicker biofilms? What do you think is going to happen once you stop adding a Carbon source? The nutrient-limited bacteria will die and release N and P into the water column but it will be all in one day (most bacteria don't live more than 24 hours). Yikes...would you collect skimmate for a couple of months and then dump it into your tank all at once?
.............. Ldrhawke has found ways of addressing these issues in his/her tank but make sure you have enough knowledge before willy nilly start dumping Carbon in your tank.
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Yes I am the same guy that started CPW ( controlled plenum wasting), which does work. I stopped using CPW when I realized that by improving on methods to physically export waste and nutrient laden bacteria just made more sense, plus it was easier to control. It is more efficient, and less apt to get unbalanced than trying to biologically treat waste inside the system. But, thanks for the nice comments.
Most all of your comments about adding any external carbon source are correct and should be heeded. It is easy to over dose and is the primary reason failures have occurred. It is why I mentioned it is important to have a high degree of control and patience, like the methods used in apply the ZEO process.
Your comments on it's potential negative effects on other types of bacteria within a DSB are also well taken. The potential for bacterial upset in a DSB can also be caused many other things, which will bring on the same problems you described alcohol causing, which is a large part of my reasoning for becoming a BB advocate.
My recommended Vodka dosing is much lower than most have prescribed in using alcohol in the past and much closer to how the ZEO process is applied. Your comments on producing bacteria and then simply allowing the bacteria to die is exactly why I say to remove the bacteria laden floss after 8 hours and don't simply shake it to break it loose and allow the skimmer to do.
Most everyone acknowledges that phosphates, in some form, does slowy saturate DSB and even live rock (reason for cooking live rock) in all reef tanks. Using only conventional process only, and not also keeping up with phosphate removal, is also walking a tightrope. The potential for phosphate being slowly or even suddenly released; caused a temperture,pH, or DSB becoming unbalanced, is also a very real danger. In my mind the question is, not will it happen,but when will it happen. To address it you can go bare bottom and every couple of years cook all your live rock, but I'm hoping to find a better answer.
I disagree that EverClear alcohol is any more pure than Vodka, it is just a higher proof. It is cheaper where I live to buy Vodka than EverClear, even taking into account it's higher proof.
I believe adding a clean carbon source properly administered will help keep phosphates under control. I'm hoping the increased bacteria film that develops on the live rock helps to slowly extract phosphate or at least keeps them from becoming an unwanted source of increase nutrient release. The success of the ZEO process by many advocates demonstrates carbon addition and increased bacteria extraction has merit in maintaining a low nutrient tank.
Maybe NPR can take it another step.....maybe not. At this point it works for me. As you so well stated, using alcohol with a DSB may cause other issues I have not taken into account. I believe using NPR to extract phosphate has more potential reward than risk if done cautiously. Unlike the ZEO process, I have no commercial interests in the Vodka or filter floss business. I'm only trying to stimulate thought and advance the hobby.
