White powder-like spots on my yellow tang

[Petrichor1]

Hello, new to this thread and new aquarist as well.
Things have been functioning really well, until my yellow tang appeared with white powder-like spots all over his fins, body and face area(pretty much all over). I have had him and a few other fish for about 3 to 4 weeks now. He has been eating really well, however I have noticed he has been rubbing against the sand and substrate. Yesterday he woke up covered in the powdery substance, however today, it's all gone. I have read horror stories about ich and I am praying this isn't what is going on in my 2 month-newly set up tank. I have a six foot -180gl tank and 1200lbs of rock. it will be close to impossible to fish him out... I have attached a picture here to give an idea.

Other inhabitants are:
1 sailfin (seems to bully my yellow tang a bit) they were introduced to the tank together.
2Chromis
1diamond gobie
1lawn mower blennie
1sleeper gobie
1yellow tang

1

 

[DaveK]

The image isn't showing up but from your description it sure sounds like SW ick (Cryptocaryon irritans). Here are links to threads that deal with the subject in depth -
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/curing-fish-of-marine-ich.52236/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/marine-ich-myths-and-facts.23132/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/fish-with-white-spots-that-went-away.57175/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/copper-treatment-use-problems.23130/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/a-hyposalinity-treatment-process.23131/

To summarize all this-
You must treat in a quarantine tank
You must treat all the fish in the tank
The only really effective treatments that work are copper or hyposalinity
There are no "reef safe" cures that work
Treatment time is 8 to 10 weeks. It takes that long for the parasite to die from lack of a host

And very important - There is a lot of bad information our there on treating this disease. Don't fall into the trap of thinking there are shortcuts.

 

[Petrichor1]

The image isn't showing up but from your description it sure sounds like SW ick (Cryptocaryon irritans). Here are links to threads that deal with the subject in depth -
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/curing-fish-of-marine-ich.52236/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/marine-ich-myths-and-facts.23132/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/fish-with-white-spots-that-went-away.57175/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/copper-treatment-use-problems.23130/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/a-hyposalinity-treatment-process.23131/

To summarize all this-
You must treat in a quarantine tank
You must treat all the fish in the tank
The only really effective treatments that work are copper or hyposalinity
There are no "reef safe" cures that work
Treatment time is 8 to 10 weeks. It takes that long for the parasite to die from lack of a host

And very important - There is a lot of bad information our there on treating this disease. Don't fall into the trap of thinking there are shortcuts.

Dave, thank you for your quick response and all links to help us through this mess. We are currently working in getting all our fish into the QT. We were notified that our snails may be hosts for this ich as well?? is this true? I have four snails currently in my DT.

 

[DaveK]

Generally snails do not host ick. You should not attempt to treat them for ich, because the treatments that will will also kill ick. You should be safe leaving them in the display tank.

 

[mr_tap_water]

If you can't quarantining him here's a couple of things you could try.
Feeding heavy with added vitamins supplements. adding a UV and introducing a cleaner Wrasse or shrimps Will help to a degree but is not a cure in my experience I have found a mixture of all these has worked for me, but if it's velvet that's another story and is extremely hard to get rid of Good luck[emoji846]


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[Oxylebius]

Please be aware that it is well documented that cleaner wrasse do not eat Cryptocaryon irritans. Based on looking at stomach content of these fish, these cleaners eat necrotic tissue, damaged scales and scabs for the most part and some have been documented eating isopods and non-parasitic copepods.

Now as for the cleaner shrimp, there is some documentation based on stomach content that they would eat crypto, but not to the extent where they would eliminate your tank of the parasite. Given time the cleaner shrimp might help a little bit, but this is not the answer to treating an already infected fish or a tank that already has the parasite in it.

The problem with Crypto is that this parasite embeds under the scales and skin, thus it is hard for the cleaner wrasses and shrimp to get to them. Unlike other parasites (isopods and copepods) that attach to fish but stay external, thus easier to pick off by the cleaners. The researchers hypothesize to some extent that during part of the crypto life cycle, where the parasite comes out from under the skin, is when the cleaners can get them.

Again, this is not a treatment option when a full on outbreak occurs.

References:

Grutter, A.S. "Ontogenetic Variation in the Diet of the Cleaner Fish Labroides dimidiatus and its Ecological Consequences." Marine Ecology Progress Series, 197, 241-246, 2000.
http://www.int-res.com/articles/meps/197/m197p241.pdf

Grutter, A.S. "Parasite removal rates by the cleaner wrasse Labroides dimidiatus". Marine Ecology Progress Series, 130, 61-70, 1996.
http://www.int-res.com/articles/meps/130/m130p061.pdf

Becker, J.H. & Grutter, A.S. 2004 Cleaner shrimp do clean. Coral Reefs 23, 515–520.

Becker, J.H.A., Curtis, L.M. & Grutter, A.S. 2005 Cleaner shrimp use a rocking dance to advertise cleaning service to clients. Curr. Biol. 15, 760–764, (doi:10.1016/j.cub.2005.02.067).

Bunkley-Williams, L. & Williams, E. 1998 Isopods associated with fishes: a synopsis and corrections. J. Parasitol. 84, 893–896.

Bush, A.O., Fernandez, J.C., Esch, G. & Seed, J.R. 2001 Parasitism: the diversity and ecology of animal parasites. 1st edn. Cambridge University Press.

Combes, C. 1996 Parasites, biodiversity and ecosystem stability. Biodivers. Conserv. 5, 953–962, (doi:10.1007/BF00054413).

Feder, H.M. 1966 Cleaning symbiosis in the marine environment. Symbiosis (ed. Henry, S.M.), vol. 1. pp. 327–380, New York: Academic Press

Grutter, A.S. 1996 Parasite removal rates by the cleaner wrasse Labroides dimidiatus. Mar. Ecol. Prog. Ser. 130, 61–70.

Grutter, A.S. 1999 Cleaner fish really do clean. Nature 398, 672–673, (doi:10.1038/19443).

Grutter, A.S. 2002 Cleaning symbiosis from the parasites perspective. Parasitology 124, (Suppl. S), S65–S81, (doi:10.1017/S0031182002001488). [CrossRef]

Grutter, A.S., Murphy, J. & Choat, H. 2003 Cleaner fish drives local fish diversity on coral reefs. Curr. Biol. 13, 64–67, (doi:10.1016/S0960-9822(02)01393-3).

Nicolette, P. 1990 Symbiosis: nature in partnership. London: Blandford.

Sikkel, P.C., Fuller, C.A. & Hunte, W. 2000 Habitat/sex differences in time at cleaning stations and ectoparasite loads in Caribbean reef fish. Mar. Ecol. Prog. Ser. 193, 191–199.

 

[DaveK]

If you can't quarantining him here's a couple of things you could try.
Feeding heavy with added vitamins supplements. adding a UV and introducing a cleaner Wrasse or shrimps Will help to a degree but is not a cure in my experience I have found a mixture of all these has worked for me, but if it's velvet that's another story and is extremely hard to get rid of Good luck[emoji846]


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I will simply state that I totally disagree with this post. If you don't have a quarantine and need to treat ick, get one, even if it's just a large rubbermaid container. The big problem with these methods that "you could try" is that they delay treatment by methods that have a reasonable chance of working.

 

[mr_tap_water]

I will simply state that I totally disagree with this post. If you don't have a quarantine and need to treat ick, get one, even if it's just a large rubbermaid container. The big problem with these methods that "you could try" is that they delay treatment by methods that have a reasonable chance of working.

That's your opinion and I'm just giving the guy a few options if he can't get quarantine it. And things that have worked for me ,but hey what do I know I've only been doing it for 40 years LOL and like I stated in my post it's not a cure just a few options[emoji846]


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[DaveK]

That's your opinion and I'm just giving the guy a few options if he can't get quarantine it. And things that have worked for me ,but hey what do I know I've only been doing it for 40 years LOL and like I stated in my post it's not a cure just a few options[emoji846]


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This is exactly why I disagree with your post. I have found that not using a quarantine tank is not a serious option. By your own admission you admit it's not a cure.

Throwing out how many years your in the hobby doesn't really cut any ice with me. You see, I have had SW systems even longer than that, about 50 years now. So let's not try to compare time in the hobby as being meaningful, because it's changed so much in that time.

 

[mr_tap_water]

This is exactly why I disagree with your post. I have found that not using a quarantine tank is not a serious option. By your own admission you admit it's not a cure.

Throwing out how many years your in the hobby doesn't really cut any ice with me. You see, I have had SW systems even longer than that, about 50 years now. So let's not try to compare time in the hobby as being meaningful, because it's changed so much in that time.

It's sad that some people only want to post when I disagree with someone wanting to try to help someone else rather than try to help that person in the first place.
The options I have given him well just that that have worked for me my work for him been in the first place he said he couldn't catch the fish.
And you saying quarantine the fish you really believe that ends it you still have the parasite in the main system so soon as you put it back what's the say it doesn't catch it again Plus what about the remaining fish surely or fish would have to be taken out and the tank to remain dormant for a number of months before the parasite disappears, in my opinion and this is just my opinion I believe it's better to fight the course in the main system reasons being I believe it stresses the fish more by taking it out putting it in a quarantine tank, and by leaving it in and feeding heavy with added vitamins soaked into the food can help build its immune System up to keep the parasite at bye and by having some cleaner shrimp or cleaner fish helps to some degree as well even though I don't believe they eat the parasite They help clean the fish. So whether you can except what I say that's entirely up to you. As the original post was not for you in the first place.

And the person that was asking for help I hope it works out for you which ever you decide to do[emoji846]
And I hope this hasn't complicated things with you you're always gonna see these type of disagreements as some people just can't understand how something can work that doesn't work for them and are very textbook orientated in my opinion all options are worth a go.



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[Oxylebius]

The problem with many treatment methods is that they are anecdotal or extrapolated. There is one sure way to eradicate Cryptocaryon irritans from a tank and that is allowing the tank to go w/out a fish host for the life cycle of the crypto. To do this, you need to medicate your fish in a separate tank and allow the main tank to be fishless. Then to keep from introducing crypto back into the main tank all fish should be medicated in a QT prior to introduction in the main tank. If this is not done, you risk an outbreak happening anytime a new fish is added to the main tank.

Here are some very good reads on the topic:

From the Univ. of Florida: http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fa164
"A minimum quarantine period of 3–6 weeks at 24–27°C (75.2–80.6°F), is advised, and longer time frames (e.g., 7–11 weeks) may be necessary."

Advanced Aquarist
Aquarium Fish: News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans: Part One of Five
Aquarium Fish: News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans: Part Two of Five
Aquarium Fish: News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans: Part Three of Five
Aquarium Fish: News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans: Part Four of Five
Aquarium Fish: News from the Warfront with Cryptocaryon irritans: Part Five of Five

And I highlight these threads:
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/marine-ich-myths-and-facts.23132/
http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forum/index.php?threads/curing-fish-of-marine-ich.52236/

 

[Oxylebius]

We are currently working in getting all our fish into the QT.

BTW - it is easier to catch the fish when they are a sleep. Allowing the lights to be off for an hour or so, use a red light or red headlamp (torch) as the red light won't wake the fish up, then net them and place them in QT.