New RedSea 650 and new to saltwater advice please

T

Tariq

New Member
I've just signed up and I've read the very helpful new started post by wrangy which was very useful.

We have a small fresh water aquarium and it's great. So good that my better half has decided she wants another one but bigger and sea water because of its awesomeness. However it needs to be feng shui compatible which means 8 gold, yellow, red, orange, bronze fish and one black one. The yellow ones (gold, yellow, red, orange, bronze ) must not have any other colours (blue, black etc). She is being very struck about this although I think some white is OK. We are planning on getting the biggest and best aquarium we could and settled on the RedSea S Series 650 LED. So the second requirement is that we should have quite large fish as we only plan to have 9 in total. In order to make up for restrictions on fish we planned on having lots of bright coral and little cleaner card things.

So to recap:
1 Fish 8 gold, yellow, red, orange and 1 solid black
2 Big fish as tank is quite big and we are only having 9 fish in total.
3 lots of interest in other things (coral, star fish,cleaner crab things etc)

Would be very please with any comments advice etc.


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SPR

SPR

Well-Known Member
Hi Tariq

My 650 LED has been running for a few weeks and from bitter experience with fish you need to decide what types you are going to want and assuming you are going down the Feng shui route I assume you want it to be peaceful. I'd don't buy a lion fish, eels etc. Also you need to decide if you want a reef tank with corals as many of the fish eat corals or nip at them and can easily kill a coral you have just spent £80 on. If you want corals the fish have to be reef compatible as once it's in a 650 it ain't coming out easily once your rocks etc are in.
There are loads of web site that will point you at the types of fish and what they are like and from experience don't go to the shop and buy the most pretty fish just because it looks good as it might be a reef knightmare before you have read up on it

Also start you reading on water chemistry etc as I think marine is completely different to fresh water but loads of fun. I know all of this as I bought my first tank in February 2016 having been diving in the Maldives and new nothing about fish keeping of any kind and it's been a very steep learning curve building my basic knowledge. There is however a lot of experience on here to help out.

Oh and you had better start making RO water and store it unless you want to be visiting the LFS for the initial fill. It's a beast. Infact I don't actually know we're all the water went as when the storage buckets were lined up I thought know way would they all go in. But they did!

Another tip for later is measure how many litres of water you put in being offset by any rocks sand etc. It helps if and when you start dosing stuff. Mine had around 573 litres added

Best wishes
 
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T

Tariq

New Member
Hi SPR

Thanks for that, very useful. I have done a bit of reading up and am starting to find my feet with the various issues that need addressing. We have decided on a reef tank and so will have to avoid all the coral bitters which limits our choice but I think the corals will more than make up for that. I will avoid those fish as mentioned, sounds like good advice. Hopefully the tank will arrive next week. I've asked for water, sand, salt, water filter thing and live rock to be delivered at the same time. I've also given my fish shop chap my requirements and he has come back with a suggested list.

yellow / orange fish

yellow goat fish 1'8" x1
yellow tang 8" x3-4
dispar anthias 4" x4
line spot flasher wrasse 3" x1
big eye black bar soldier fish 8" x3-4
Midas blenny 6" x1
lemon peel angel 6" x 1
yellow angel 4" x 1
blue spotted rabbit fish 11" x1

black fish

achilles tang 8.5" x1
ehite cheek tang 8" x1

corals

hammer coral
torch coral
frogs spawn coral
trumpet coral
brain coral
plate coral
flowerpot coral
mushrooms (various colour)
xenia (various colours)
green star polyp

Like you I'm also a diver and am quite keen to get this up and running. I'll post some photos.

Thanks
Tariq

One question, did anyone have problems with unwanted critters in live rock? Did anyone cure their rock?


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SPR

SPR

Well-Known Member
Also make sure your ready for the weight of these beasts. I have mentioned it on my thread and elsewhere they are very very heavy. You will struggle even with 4 big chaps! I would consider maybe getting a trolley or something depending on your home setup etc. The cloth on the floor and dragging along works very well for me and I used this method when I moved my E260 to my sons house with some very tight turns.

Oh and if you haven't seen one built up yet the photos or web pages etc don't do them justice. The tanks are stunning and you get exactly what you pay for with these. Really good quality glass, frame etc. They are expensive but worth every penny.

On the live rock I got the Real Reef Rock which is basically man made copy but eco friendly etc. I don't think you get the unwanted critters with this and it's already cured as far as I am aware. The main thing I did was use Colony to cycle instantly so it was ready to go straight away although I left it a day before adding the fish. I know some may frown on this but it's 2016 so embrace modern technology I say. Oh and I am very impatient!
 
T

Tariq

New Member
Thanks again. We have just been given the delivery day as Tuesday so looking forward to it arriving. My other half has already started thinking of a smaller tank for sea-horses! We shall see how that goes. I've already ordered the live rock unfortunately, my local shop recommended it. Does anyone have a view of sand vs crushed coral? I guess the crushed coral is less ethical. What is colony? Is that a bio booster? We are just going through the fish choices now.
 
SPR

SPR

Well-Known Member
On the sand I originally had the Red Sea Live White but although it's very nice it's also very fine and I found it tended to get blown around a lot so in my 650 I went for the Red Sea Live Pink version (it's not pink before you ask). It's basically a larger grain and doesn't get blown around a lot. I looked at loads of different grain sizes, makes etc and finally settled on this one and bought from eBay shop and got 4 x 10 kg bags which I would say is minimum you need depending on how much rock. I did look at crushed coral as well which again is bigger size and I suppose it's personal choice although I have also just bought a bag of this for areas of the sand were the sand just won't stay due to the pumps. I have around 70-75kg of live rock which all came from the online people who supplied the tank. The eBay price for the bulk order on the sand was better than LFS who couldn't easily get it anyway and due to the mounting costs any savings were welcome. You will by now be aware of the cost of live rock etc!

ATM Colonoy cycles the tank immediately rather than having to wait weeks for this to happen. It contains all the Bacteria needed and comes in both Marine and Freshwater versions I assume you know you have to cycle the tank to make it safe for the fish. You can look at their web site, videos etc and I also bought this from eBay shop as again I got a better deal on the amount I needed which was 2 x 32oz bottles which is enough for 200 gallons which is slightly more than needed but that's ok. Originally the oneline people were I got the tank from recommended this when I bought my original 260 and for the 260 the price was fine but with the bigger one I needed a lot more.

On the sea horses my wife said exactly the same about them but I thought I would have my hands full enough with the main beast so have left that idea indefinitely. I have read loads about sea horses but although you can put them in the main tank they would probably starve at best (the fish get to the food faster than they can) so not a good idea and all the advice is to keep them in seperate tank with suitable conditions so I won't be doing that for the time being.
 
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T

Tariq

New Member
Thanks SPR. Very useful. I've changed my order to live sand to help. The tank arrived and I've set it up but there were problems. We didn't have enough water! So I can't run main pump only the flow pumps. I'm getting more water delivered but I'm worried that the live rock and live sand will suffer.

Also looks like it's a bit too close to the wall for easy access. Has anyone ever managed to move a full tank? It's on a wood floor with felt sliders so I may try a car jack. I only need a few inches. If that fails I'll have to empty and move and refill :(

And finally the stock cock was broken ( either in transit or unpacking) so I've emailed Red Sea for a replacement. Anyone had good or bad experience with Red Sea support?

And so begins my journey with three things going wrong before I even started!

Oh almost forgot the skimmer instructions were only in German and French!

Four things.
Things can only get better. Currently getting sour looks from other half.


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D

DaveK

Well-Known Member
It is not possible to move a full large tank. The water in your tank alone weighs about 1500 lps (679 kg).

To move it you will need to remove all the rock, drain all the water, remove all the sand, and then with the help of several people you can move the tank.

On your fish selection list, you have several difficult to keep fish. The achilles tang is one. The dispar anthias have a requirement for almost constant food. Check the requirements for each fish and make sure you can meet them. Also check that they are compatible with each other. Multiple tangs or angles will often fight.

Large fish require a lot of room. 9 fish doesn't sound like much, but at their full size of many you have selected, your tank will be way over stocked. If you must have 9 fish, choose ones that have a maximum size of about 4 inches or so. Keep in mind, all other things being equal, an 8 inch fish is going to have a body mass of about 6 to 8 times that of a 4 inch fish.
 
SPR

SPR

Well-Known Member
I would think the rock and sand should be ok until you get it circulating and get some heat into it all.

You need to be a MINIMUM of 6 inches from the back wall as you need access to the down flow valve as this needs adjusting once up and running as per the instructions. You also need to gain access for possible cleaning/repairs etc

I have to say i would not try moving when full. Even my e260 wouldnt budge when fill and that was only 260 litres not 650.

My instructions for the skimmer were also french/german but i had got them emailed from Red Sea before it was delivered so i could study them ready

Not sure what you mean about stock cock but i can only say my experience with Red Sea in response to help has been first class so just get in touch with them. I assume you mean the flow valve.


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T

Tariq

New Member
Thanks all
I did manage to move it .. After taking out most of the water. Still a bit in the tank and sump was full but it was enough to move it a few more inches from the wall. All set up now. So now the water is running properly through it and the live rock and sand look like they are doing their job.
BTW well done Murray!
Anyway, started testing and found a high phosphate, after I bought a rock with some soft coral on it. So did a water change and bought some rowa pros and its down to .07 from .25. Hopefully will come down more. Used 250g in the sock it came with and plonked it on top of the carbon. Running ok except the flow was a bit restricted but I think it's ok now.
My skimmer is bubbling over and has been since I started it, I assume it will settle down.
Bought some cleaning crew chaps (stripped blue legged crabs) and they are down well. Latest is some brown algae appearing so hopefully cleaning crew and rowa phos will help with that.
One thing I have is a temp at 27 -28. I've turned the heater off but I'm sure it hasn't run yet as the setting was 25. I think it's the lights and warm day we have had, the tank is next to the window.
We also bought our first fish, a Midas blend, who after going through a bit of a freak out settled down and is doing well. He has been christened Tomen, well meaning but bit dim.
I'm waiting for my triton kit to arrive then I'll get precise measurements and see what's what a bit.


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SPR

SPR

Well-Known Member
Hi Tariq

Assuming it is a new tank, just filled etc I am just wondering why you have phosphate as its a new tank with fresh RODI water and had nothing in presumably? If this is the case did you test the water from the shop with a TDI meter to check the quality. It should ideally have a reading of 0 although my LFS sells it at 6 which is why I bought my own RODI unit. I would have thought phosphate nitrate ammonia nitrite and everything else would have been 0 at this stage as even if you had some livestock it would take a few days for these to show up, following the tank being fully cycled ? How did you cycle it then in the end as its only been set up for a few days if the thread is correct?

On the skimmer make sure you have the inlet flow valve (the red one that feeds the skimmer from the main pump via the green pipe) initially set to about 1/3 (on advice from Red Sea). I had mine fully open so the skimmer was getting the full flow from the main pump and that was causing similar issues if I opened the air inlet valve anything more than slightly and I also got micro bubbles. This solved the problem straight away for me. It is in the instructions about the correct settings but easy to overlook when settings these things up

My tank is also running at similar temps at the moment due to the temp in the UK. Mine is near a window and I bought a black out blind as its a window we don't need to use and it makes the tank look better and helps prevent any algae issues from sunlight.
 
DaveR11

DaveR11

Well-Known Member
Despite changing to LEDs on my 650 the chiller is still kicking in at the moment here in the UK. I didn't record how much it came on last year with the T5s so no numbers to back up my impression. It seems less (as you would expect) with the LEDs but still needing it. It also seems to only come on for short periods.
 
T

Tariq

New Member
SPR said:
Hi Tariq

Assuming it is a new tank, just filled etc I am just wondering why you have phosphate as its a new tank with fresh RODI water and had nothing in presumably? If this is the case did you test the water from the shop with a TDI meter to check the quality. It should ideally have a reading of 0 although my LFS sells it at 6 which is why I bought my own RODI unit. I would have thought phosphate nitrate ammonia nitrite and everything else would have been 0 at this stage as even if you had some livestock it would take a few days for these to show up, following the tank being fully cycled ? How did you cycle it then in the end as its only been set up for a few days if the thread is correct?

On the skimmer make sure you have the inlet flow valve (the red one that feeds the skimmer from the main pump via the green pipe) initially set to about 1/3 (on advice from Red Sea). I had mine fully open so the skimmer was getting the full flow from the main pump and that was causing similar issues if I opened the air inlet valve anything more than slightly and I also got micro bubbles. This solved the problem straight away for me. It is in the instructions about the correct settings but easy to overlook when settings these things up

My tank is also running at similar temps at the moment due to the temp in the UK. Mine is near a window and I bought a black out blind as its a window we don't need to use and it makes the tank look better and helps prevent any algae issues from sunlight.
Click to expand...

Thanks
Yep, pretty sure cycle is done, ammonia and nitrite at 0 in tests and I have nitrate at 6. I got a rodi unit and have been using it. Not sure where the high phosphates came from I had assumed from the live rock and sand. We cycled for about a week or less, mainly with the Rock and sand. We were having a bit of a brown algae growth which the rowaphos halted. We got some turbo snails and hermit crabs to begin with and they helped clean it up.

Thanks very much for the inlet flow info that filmed my problem immediately!

I'll watch the temp but I guess it's not as vital as I thought.

I got home to find an anthia had been purchased, has been bought whilst I was at work! Anyway Blenny is happier now it has a friend.

I'm going to rearrange the rocks a bit tonight and over the weekend, try and get them into a tower structure. I've made perspex structure to put them on, shall see how it looks.

Also just got an email from the triton lad so should have more accurate figures for water composition soon.
Cheers
Tariq


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T

Tariq

New Member
DaveR11 said:
Despite changing to LEDs on my 650 the chiller is still kicking in at the moment here in the UK. I didn't record how much it came on last year with the T5s so no numbers to back up my impression. It seems less (as you would expect) with the LEDs but still needing it. It also seems to only come on for short periods.
Click to expand...

Thanks Dave
I'm going to keep an eye on it, I would rather avoid a chiller if possible but may be its necessary.


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T

Tariq

New Member
T

Tariq

New Member
BTW Here is the aquarium in situ

aa5fb5eaaf84c3bdd387da62478840d6.jpg




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