HELP! Need help with identifying this outbreak (corals dying)

Discussion in 'Marine Algae & Plants' started by s1ngle, Apr 7, 2019.

  1. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    Could you help me identify this 'algae' please?
    My 3 corals have already been suffocated by this [​IMG]
    I tried methods for cyano and for dino but both were futile.

    https://i.imgur.com/cIlKBJn.jpg
    https://player.vimeo.com/video/328970393


    I tried:
    - lowering parameters
    - raising parameters
    - scrubbing it off
    - GFO in/out
    - VSV
    - dosing bacteria (MicrobeLift Special Blend)
    - frequent water changes
    - infrequent water changes
    - increasing/lowering food

    Parameters history in the attachment.

    It's hard to pull it out and seems like it's been worse when I started to scrub it off with a toothbrush.
    It's 190G so it would be a huge amount of manual work. Any chemistry? But I'd need to identify it somehow :(
    It's like purple in colour and pretty thick (not slime).

    It's really hard to remove, I basically cannot do it with fingers, only toothbrush helps.
    No long strings rather turf.
    And do not produce air bubbles (no photosynthesis?).

    https://i.imgur.com/GgaK9wU.jpg
    https://i.imgur.com/FHJEJAi.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/2XjxPIg.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

    #1
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
  2. DaveK

    DaveK Well-Known Member

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    It seems you have an issue with cyano and also another nuisance red algae.

    First off, what are your test result readings for nitrate and phosphate? Algae control usually means reducing these to very low levels. However algae also consumes nitrate and phosphate, so a low reading does not, by itself, mean that you don't have a problem. Also include any other water parameters you test for. Please post exact readings, since statements such as "all parameters are good" don't tell us anything. What seems ok to you might indicate a problem to someone else.

    Also could you answer these questions?

    What are you using for filtration and skimming on this system? Also include what media you are running.

    Are you dousing anything? If so please include how much and what of.

    What kind of lighting are you using? Include models of fixtures, and what the specs are on the bulbs your using or the settings for LED lighting your using.

    How long have you had the tank set up?

    What fish do you have in the system, and what size are they?

    How do you obtain or mix your SW?
     
    #2
  3. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    Screenshot 2019-04-08 07.10.17.png


    Screenshot 2019-04-08 07.10.59.png

    Filtration:
    - JBL Symec Filter Floss
    - 2L Sera Siporax
    - 1 kg Nano-Tech Bio-Sphere
    - Chaetomorpha Filter 3L, 3.5m LED (5 red + 1 blue) 50W, 1000 L/H
    - Live rock 37kg [81 lbs]
    - GFO (currently out)
    - DSB
    - AquaNova NUV-18 (UV filter) 22.5W

    
Skimmer:
    - 1 x Tunze DOC Skimmer 9410.04 Water flow: 900 L/H Air flow: 600 L/H

    
Lights:
    - 3x65W Jecod/Jebao Ak-70
    - 8x80W ATI T5 Sun Power
    - 4 x Blue Plus
    - 2 x Coral Plus
    - 1 x AquaBlue Special
    - 1 x Purple plus

    Saltwater: 10% weekly:
    RO-DI:
    - Sediment 5μ -> Carbon -> Sediment 1μ -> Membrane -> Resin
    - TDS: 001
    + AquaForest Reef Salt 34-35 ppt

    Dosing:
    - Daily:
    - Vodka/VSV/currently just vinegar (10 ml) + rarely few drops of lime juice
    - Weekly:
    - AquaForest NitraPhos Minus (10 ml)
    - MicrobeLife Special Blend (10 ml)

    Tank has been set up for 11 months now and stabilised around January (no algae).
    Then the aiptasia came, so I nuked 1 rock with boiling water and put it back in.
    I think then it started to occur.
    Some more aiptasia appeared so I bought Chelmon (and 2xpeppermint shrimp and Bristle-tail Filefish) and therefore I increased feeding heavily cos after aiptasia was gone Chelmon would not eat anything else.
    Chelmon died and the algae just started to spread like crazy, late February.
    So I started messing with increasing nutrients etc. but nothing helps and it is getting worse day by day.

    Tank size: 190G.


    Fish (20):
    - 5 x Chrysiptera parasema (Yellow-tail blue damselfish) | 2.5 cm / 1’’

    - 4 x Monodactylus argenteus (Silver moonyfish) | 5 cm / 2’’
    - 1 x Pseudocheilinus hexataenia (Six-line wrasse) | 5 cm / 2’’
    - 1 x Zebrasoma scopas (Brown tang) | 5 cm / 2’’
    - 1 x Zebrasoma flavescens (Yellow tang) | 10 cm / 4’’
    - 1 x Siganus vulpinus (Foxface rabbitfish) | 10 cm / 4’’
    - 1 x Rhinecanthus aculeatus (Lagoon/Humu Picasso Triggerfish) | 10 cm / 4’’

    - 1 x Acreichthys tomentosus (Bristle-tail Filefish) | 5 cm / 2’’

    - 2 x Amphiprion ocellaris (Ocellaris Clownfish) | 1 cm / 0.5''

    - 1 x Paraluteres prionurus (Blacksaddle filefish) | 5 cm / 2’’
    - 1 x Neocirrhites armatus (Flame Hawkfish) | 5 cm / 2’’
    - 1 x Ctenochaetus tominiensis (Tomini surgeonfish) | 10 cm / 4’’

    I also have 17 softies and 4 LPS. (of which 1 softy and 2 lps are covered in this algae)
    Oh I also have tons of feather dusters (~40) and sponges (120) in the sump.
     
    #3
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  4. Uncle99

    Uncle99 Well-Known Member

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    6 Mexican Turbos will remove what appears in the video to be reddish hair algae.

    Make sure you have no outside light hitting your tank.

    If your lights are T5 or MH, make sure they are not more than 1 year old, they do colour shift and algae loves the reddish spectrum....
     
    #4
  5. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    I wish I could have CUC. Triggerfish won't let it last.
    All aqua covered in blankets. Lights for 2x3 min daily to feed fish.
     
    #5
  6. DaveK

    DaveK Well-Known Member

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    Well, normally they would, but with a picasso trigger in the tank, the op will have one very happy and well fed trigger.
     
    #6
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  7. DaveK

    DaveK Well-Known Member

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    First off excellent reply to my original post. So many people leave out critical information.

    In going over everything I don't see anything really wrong, but I do have some thoughts on some areas you might want to rethink.

    The obvious, is (duh) you have an algae problem. This means the system is getting too much in the way of nutrients in there. So this is the area that needs to be worked on.

    I'm not a big fan of Sera Siporax or Nano-Tech Bio-Spheres because they are a biological filter media. Note how porous they are, This allows bacteria to grow all over and inside them. And at the same time they trap dirt, and often turn into nitrate factories.

    At the same time you have only about 81 lbs of live rock, where typically you would have about 190 lbs of rock. In your specific case the slack is being taken up by the Sera Siporax and Nano-Tech Bio-Spheres. I can't really call this wrong, but if I were setting up the tank, I;d have the recommended rock and no Sera Siporax and Nano-Tech Bio-Spheres. If your going to try to change to this, it's a long term switch, where you add about 20 lbs of dry reef rock, wait a couple of months and remove about 1/5 the bio media, then repeat until the bio media has been removed.

    I'm also no longer a fan of DSBs. They also tend to trap a lot of dirt. This could make them a factor in your algae problem. If you have not done so, it's worth vacuuming the top layer to clean it. Only go down about 1 inch, as you do not want to disturb the deep anaerobic areas. If you actually want to remove a DSB, it is a very delicate operation, unless you want to completely tear the tank down.

    Since you have algae issues, using UV is usually a good idea. Check when you last replaced the bulb. They usually need replacing about once a year.

    Your skimmer may be too small. Tunze is a good product, but manufacturers tend to be way "optimistic" when it comes to rating their skimmers. I usually recommend using a skimmer that is rated for a tank about double the size they plan to use it on. In your case, if the skimmer is always producing a lot of skimmate, you likely need something larger. If not, you should be ok as things are.

    The lighting looks good for corals. As usual check when the T5 bulbs were replaced. While your getting the algae under control, you might want to cut the amount way down. Another thing that sometimes helps is a 3 day total black out of the tank. This is where you let no light into the tank at all, you even cover the top, and sides with a blanket or something else to totally block the light.

    Personally I don't do much in the way of dousing, since I feel it's way too delicate a balance to maintain. If you want to stop it to see if it's a factor in the algae problem, it will need to be ramped down slowly.

    BTW, never boil rocks to remove aiptasia or other unwanted anemones. This can be very toxic to you, and there have been some major medical issues with people that have done it.

    Livestock. The tangs, foxface, and trigger are all big dirty fish in that they eat a lot and create a lot of waste products. This is all stuff the system needs to deal with. You might want to remove some of them, and/or remove some of the other fish. Less fish = less waste to deal with. Fish are a major source of nitrates and phosphates.

    Lastly, only change one factor at a time and see what that does. If you change a bunch of things at once, you never know what helped and what hurt.
     
    #7
  8. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    Thank you very much for all the replies.

    > At the same time you have only about 81 lbs of live rock, where typically you would have about 190 lbs of rock.
    This is what the company who set up the tank told me but I've got full sump of live rock and live rock takes around 1/3 of the aquarium so I cannot see a way of putting any more rock inside.



    > If you actually want to remove a DSB, it is a very delicate operation, unless you want to completely tear the tank down.

    I am waiting to get more money to get a full new sump without DSB.

    > Since you have algae issues, using UV is usually a good idea. Check when you last replaced the bulb. They usually need replacing about once a year.

    UV is 11 months old but wasn't used for the first 6.
    T5 is just 4 months old and is lighten up for 5 hours daily.

    > Your skimmer may be too small.
    Some people don't even use skimmer. But thank you, I'll think about it.

    > BTW, never boil rocks to remove aiptasia or other unwanted anemones. This can be very toxic
    Oh. Wow. I did not know that.

    > The tangs, foxface, and trigger are all big dirty fish in that they eat a lot and create a lot of waste products.
    TBH the Monodactylus argenteus is the biggest waste producer. While triggerfish grew from 9 cm to 10cm in 5 months they grew from 4cm to 8cm in that period.
    I used to have 11 of them I was able to catch 7 in 3 days time (4 hours each day of effort, removing rocks, traps etc.). Still 4 to go.
     
    #8
  9. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    #9
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  10. Uncle99

    Uncle99 Well-Known Member

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    From what I see, your issue is an import and export one, that meaning there is more nutrients going in, than going out.

    -you likely have a high level of phosphate. It doesn’t make sense to me that your results are correct, it is more likely that the algae is using up phosphate which gives a low number. Consider using an LC for a bit to lower this number. GFO is good, but is used up quite fast. LC is much cheaper and faster, you will need a 10 micron sock to catch the floculent created by the phosphate binding to the LC.

    -your carbon dose looks really small to me.
    My DT is 1/3 your size and I do 15ml. I would use Nopox, vinegar did not work for me. Ensure your dosage is correct.

    -while some people claim no skimmer, they can if they have lower loads, in your case, you need more nutrients export, so skimmer for you is an absolute otherwise you need to double waters changes weekly.

    -Water changes are great exporters.

    Maybe something in the above might help

    One thing for sure, algae needs nutrients and light, or it will turn translucent, thin and die.
     
    #10
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  11. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    My Algae filter Chaetomorpha (Spaghetti) is being suffocated as well... most of it is dead I think
     
    #11
  12. Uncle99

    Uncle99 Well-Known Member

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    And will
    Just add to the nutrients problem
     
    #12
  13. s1ngle

    s1ngle New Member

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    This stuff is growing even on the cover of my chimney where there is almost no water, just drops of them... what is this curse :/
     
    #13
  14. Uncle99

    Uncle99 Well-Known Member

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    I watched the video.
    I just don't see what curse your talking about, some algae, but much of the Rock seems clean or with coraline algae growing.

    Looks rather normal to me, but lots of fish, big eaters and big waste makers.

    IN the pics I see some short red hair algae, I know only that I had this same and 5 Mexican turbos completely finished it in two weeks! I tried scrubbing fir months....nothing.....2 weeks finished and no return for 2 years now.

    Unfortunately that trigger renders that fix, impossible.

    Maybe I am missing the point.
     
    #14
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2019 at 10:25 PM
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