long term algae problem

jaguar_uk

New Member
Hi Everyone, firstly i have to confess to being a "lurker" of forums rather than a contributor, this is mainly because even after 4 years i still don't feel qualified enough to offer advice to others when i still have problem that i can't solve.

I have an Aquaone reef 400 mk2 with a nyos quantum skimmer and i use a maxspect gyre for water movement.
I replaced the original return pump with an aqua medic dc runner 5.1.

Readings for nitrate, phosphate and silica are all very low but i have never been able to stop the sand from being covered with a thin layer of light brown algae and the rocks with green algae/slime.
All the fish are seem happy and healthy, i don't keep corals although o would like to if i ever get the algae problem under control.
I used to run the light for around 8 hours a day but have recently cut this back to 6. For a few days i did turn the light off completely and the was definite improvement in the situation.
Surely 6 hrs light a day isn't too long is it?
I am wondering if the quality of the light i'm using is a factor in all this, the light is the led one that came with the Aquareef tank and perhaps isn't of a sufficient quality?
If anyone could point out were i'm going wrong i'd much appreciation it.
 

DaveK

Well-Known Member
We get more questions on algae issues than anything else. Here is something I have posted before on algae control to give you a good place to start.

DaveK's Standard Lecture #2 - Algae Control

Algae control comes down to controlling nitrates and phosphates. If you have a problem with algae it is because these two nutrients are out of control. Do not think that just because your test kits read zero or low values that you do not have a problem. In many cases the algae is removing the nutrients and growing. This is why there is a problem.

Here are possible sources of nitrates and phosphates -

Feeding, especially flake food and not rinsing frozen foods before feeding.
Using tap water to mix salt. Always use RO/DI water for this.
"Dirt traps" and "nitrate factories" in the system.
Low quality carbon can leach nutrients.
Low quality salt can sometimes add nutrients. This is unusual today.
Livestock load on the system

Here are possible ways to remove nitrates and phosphates -

Water changes. Change 1/2 the water and you reduce the nutrients by 1/2.
Skimming. Remove the waste products before the biological filtration need to break then down.
Nitrate and phosphate removal products.
Deep sand beds.
Refugiums.
Algae Scrubbers.

Each of these has advantages and disadvantages. Most people that control algae will use many of the above methods.

There are also other items that can effect algae growth rates.

Good clean up crew.
Other livestock that eats algae.
Low general water quality, especially when the readings are off.
Lighting, sometimes you can reduce it, especially in FO or FOWLR systems.
Old light bulbs. Colors change as they age and this can be a factor.
Water flow. More flow will often help keep algae down.
Manual removal. Very important, especially when there is a big problem.
 

SPR

Well-Known Member
You need to address the points above in particular make sure your using 0 TDS RODI water for water changes and when you say Phosphate is low, it should be around 0.03ppm so very low. At the moment some of the nutrients may well be tied up/being taken up in the algae so you may be getting false readings.

Besides the fundamental problems that need to be addressed, and I feel your frustration with the algae, take a look at Vibrant liquid which is readily available in the U.K. now and should give you a quick fix by destroying the algae. I used it in just 2 doses on some stubborn green hair algae and it killed it off easily and never came back. But I had already addressed the cause, which in my case was raised phosphate levels at around 1.6ppm. I now run Rhowaphos for phosphate along with Nopox for Nitrate control amongst other things.

My lights are on from 11.30am to 10.00pm so it’s probably excess nutrients rather than light that’s causing the prime problem, although I believe excessive green/red light in the spectrum may cause issues.

It’s might also help us if you tell us your water parameters, as we are guessing a bit without these.

PS you don’t need to be a lurker, just join in the chat and if you don’t know, don’t offer advice that’s fine but you can still join in so don’t worry. We are all here to learn.
 

StevesLEDs

RS Sponsor
Algae photosynthesizes dominantly red light. As fluorescent bulbs age, they emit more red light as the internal phosphor degrades.. When I used to run florescent, I would always know when it is a time for bulb changes when I was scraping off algae off the glass daily.
When I switched my 7 aquariums to quality LED lighting, it was a surefire way to eliminate algae, as well as allowed me to run the lights up to 14 hours a day for optimal coral growth.

Jeff
 

Squatch XXL

Well-Known Member
In many cases the algae is removing the nutrients and growing. This is why there is a problem.
regular (and sizeable) water changes.
I would always know when it is a time for bulb changes when I was scraping off algae off the glass daily.
This is all Great advice. I think all of us have had issues at one point or another. My issue the other year was fairly bad for me, and I have been doing this for decades. Regular and large water changes are part of it. Physical removal of algae is another part. Algae is like a bank account for Phosphates/nitrates. They store the minerals/chemicals as they grow. My view is that there should always be low levels in the water column, and that they will be absorbed into the algae. Even if you do some sort of "quick fix" that kills algae, it will release what it has already absorbed. A few months or more of weekly large water changes coupled with physical removal will sort it out. Seemingly simple things like adding a few fish too quickly can alter the balance of the tank. Most tanks can handle small changes, but larger changes cause an opposite reaction....usually bad.

Toothbrush into the water column as you suck out water for the change. Change your filter media regularly. Use activated carbon to remove any unwanted chemicals in the water column. It can be done without chemicals, and does take time....months is not unusual. I think my 90 gallon took about 4 months after over stocking too quickly.

Also, Lighting may be an issue. I don't know anything about the unit you are speaking of, but others with more experience may.
 

Uncle99

Well-Known Member
It tools about 5 months for me to eliminate the bad algaes. Two times had some cyno.
The info provided by the membership is really solid stuff which attacks at the core of the algae problem. As mentioned above, to eliminate algaes, one simply has to deprive it of its food, without food it slowly dies like any life form.

LIGHT
We can't turn out the lights, or at least, for long, because with the loss of light, algae starves, it can't perform photosynthesis process, but either can corals. But we can do two things, don't use and over excessive photoperiod and as pointed out above and probably overlooked, MH and T5 will turn more red. Very good advice!

Fresh MH and T5 every 9 months max. That's why many turn to LED, in which for many, we can manage the Colours through our cell phone, and I have been able to do SPS and maxima clams too.

WATER
The other overlooked nutrient provider is your water. It must start with source. If your source has high TDS, then your saltwater mix had high TDS, and this ends up in your DT. Feeds algae and I believe the silica feeds Cyno. (However, yes, I can't prove that, maybe coincidental)

Only make what you need for water change and top off, I make a fresh batch 25 for water change, 10 for top off, weekly.

Use only RODI filtered water, the "DI" part is critical. Out of my tap TDS is 156, after the RO part, 50 after DI, 1, provided the container was absolutely clean and dry, otherwise, month old water was 38.
For 15 bucks you can get a TDS meter, then you KNOW.

Once you know your starting point water going in is under 5 TDS, the limiting of nutrients as described in detail by other members will ensure algae has limited food for survival. Just keep up the water changes, weekly is what works for me.

I made the assumption for years that my filter was doing its job, and it was but after some time you have to replace the cartridges especially the resin. I spent a ton if money on removing from the water, what I was in essence putting in at the beginning. I was using RODI like all members suggest, why did I have GHA. Duh! When I finally got the meter, it was 38! Once I reduced to 1 (by making sure the bucket was itself clean and water new) algae started to reduce within 3 weeks. A scrub here and there sped it up

In addition, manage flow. Each tank is different but "dead" spots show up as brownish areas in the sand, I added and adjusted flow for months till no more dead area. Now sand stays white.
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