HELP! First Anemone

rmud

Member
How is your Anemone / hermits?
Zoas? (algae)....

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Its been pretty busy at school this week so I haven't been able to do a whole lot with the tank!

I've kept the salinity at 1.023sg and I am feeding my chromis 6-7 mysis shrimp a day.

Everything else seems to be doing fine although we have had problems with Cyanobacteria. After some research, I decided to siphon our gravel to see how much debris was buried at the bottom of our tank- there was a lot. I even managed to find bits of hermit crab :(

I'll attach a photo of how cloudy the water become after I siphoned the bits I could reach.

However, I feel like bits of debris will still be able to settle at the bottom of the tank. Any ideas to completely clean the gravel? Taking all of it out will be difficult to do without upsetting the anemone and zoa so I was thinking of siphoning every day and letting our protein skimmer do it's job..

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DaveK

Well-Known Member
...
However, I feel like bits of debris will still be able to settle at the bottom of the tank. Any ideas to completely clean the gravel? ...

Actually, all you want to do is get rid of the worst of the muck. There is no need to try and get it all. In fact that can actually make things worse because you remove a lot of good bacteria if you take things too far.

The stuff you see will usually clear up in a day.

BTW, your tank looks a lot better. Much less problem algae.
 

ApolloRoma

New Member
Syphon gravel with each weekly water change will allow bacteria levels to regulate with your bioload for your Nitrogen cycle.
Patience is key, stable parameters over time will reduce algae growth. Dosing to fight Cyano is effective if red slime out of control yet circulation and light levels usual cause to consider..... Keep it up, tank is looking good.

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jringold

Member
I actually just now read your thread from beginning to end. Looks like you have made some great progress. I am certainly no expert, but here are a few things that I have found to be successful:

1. Rather than just topping off each day, get an ATO. I use a Tunze Osmolator and a 5 gallon bucket (that’s 19 liters for you folks on the other side of the big pond).

2. When setting up the ATO, first get your protein skimmer dialed in just right. Then install the float switch from the ATO at just the point that it starts pumping water. Then lower it just a “frogs hair’ down so it cuts off. Now, your tank will have a consistent water level and your skimmer will always be optimized. My skimmer is very finicky to water level. I actually installed the float switch right next to the skimmer.

3. Let me be the poster boy for ‘don’t let this happen to you’. Right before you do a water change - UNPLUG your ATO!!!! Or you are going to start pumping salt free RO onto your tank. This caused me to learn a new art to profanity.

4. I have a sand bottom. I used to vacuum the salt bed. All this did was silt it up and make a mess (and screw with my good bacteria). So now I have a good sized clean up crew with snails that live in the sand bed and keep things nice. Now, when I do a water change, I just hold my siphon hose a few mm above the sand to get any crap. If you start sucking up sand, you are too close…

5. I do a 20% water change every week. That may be overkill, but my tank crashed a few months ago so now I try to keep the water pristine.

6. I used to get premix salt water from my LFS. Now I mix my own. That way I have total control of what goes in the tank.

7. When feeding, go easy. Ever hear the phrase “leave the table a little hungry?” The fish will act like they are starving after you have fed them (at least mine does). Here is my recipe:

in a small plastic cup I add:
1 cube of frozen Marine Cuisine
1 small amount of vegetable flake food
5ml of liquid garlic
Top off with about 20ml of aquarium water

For my tank, this gives me about 3 days of meals. I store the excess in the fridge (not the freezer). The next time I have to make up food, I follow the same recipe but trade out the Marine Cuisine for frozen Mysis shrimp. Gives them a little variety.

8. LFS’ have their place but keep in mind that the person waiting on you could be a 20 year veteran of the hobby and the next time you go there, you are being helped by someone that just started working there that day and has little clue about the hobby.

I have to say that I was shocked to read that the guy that tested your water on the refractometer added the sample with his finger???? That is a lot like trying to determine if a bullet is a dud by using a hammer!

Anyway, like I said, I’m certainly no expert. But I have been doing this a couple of years and learned from mistakes as well as all the great advice you find on forums like this.

Good luck!
Morgan
 

spiraling

Well-Known Member
Hey Morgan - you forgot
3.5 Remember to turn your ATO back on after the water change! That one has tripped me up a few times :eek:
 

rmud

Member
I actually just now read your thread from beginning to end. Looks like you have made some great progress. I am certainly no expert, but here are a few things that I have found to be successful:

1. Rather than just topping off each day, get an ATO. I use a Tunze Osmolator and a 5 gallon bucket (that’s 19 liters for you folks on the other side of the big pond).

2. When setting up the ATO, first get your protein skimmer dialed in just right. Then install the float switch from the ATO at just the point that it starts pumping water. Then lower it just a “frogs hair’ down so it cuts off. Now, your tank will have a consistent water level and your skimmer will always be optimized. My skimmer is very finicky to water level. I actually installed the float switch right next to the skimmer.

3. Let me be the poster boy for ‘don’t let this happen to you’. Right before you do a water change - UNPLUG your ATO!!!! Or you are going to start pumping salt free RO onto your tank. This caused me to learn a new art to profanity.

4. I have a sand bottom. I used to vacuum the salt bed. All this did was silt it up and make a mess (and screw with my good bacteria). So now I have a good sized clean up crew with snails that live in the sand bed and keep things nice. Now, when I do a water change, I just hold my siphon hose a few mm above the sand to get any crap. If you start sucking up sand, you are too close…

5. I do a 20% water change every week. That may be overkill, but my tank crashed a few months ago so now I try to keep the water pristine.

6. I used to get premix salt water from my LFS. Now I mix my own. That way I have total control of what goes in the tank.

7. When feeding, go easy. Ever hear the phrase “leave the table a little hungry?” The fish will act like they are starving after you have fed them (at least mine does). Here is my recipe:

in a small plastic cup I add:
1 cube of frozen Marine Cuisine
1 small amount of vegetable flake food
5ml of liquid garlic
Top off with about 20ml of aquarium water

For my tank, this gives me about 3 days of meals. I store the excess in the fridge (not the freezer). The next time I have to make up food, I follow the same recipe but trade out the Marine Cuisine for frozen Mysis shrimp. Gives them a little variety.

8. LFS’ have their place but keep in mind that the person waiting on you could be a 20 year veteran of the hobby and the next time you go there, you are being helped by someone that just started working there that day and has little clue about the hobby.

I have to say that I was shocked to read that the guy that tested your water on the refractometer added the sample with his finger???? That is a lot like trying to determine if a bullet is a dud by using a hammer!

Anyway, like I said, I’m certainly no expert. But I have been doing this a couple of years and learned from mistakes as well as all the great advice you find on forums like this.

Good luck!
Morgan

Thanks for the advice!

Unfortunately, we had already ordered the RO unit before this post was made! However, I think it will be better for us to get a grip with basics so that we can learn more about how to control salinity and other tank parameters in general.

The RO system (to be more specific, it's a 4 stage RO/DI system- 90gpd) was delivered today and we installed it. I used my TDS meter on the water it produced an hour after letting it purge and got a 000ppm reading. I was worried that the meter wasn't working so I tested our regular tap water and got a 337ppm reading so it's fair to say that our RO system is working well. I also tested our 'homemade' RO water for nitrates (just for fun) and got a 0ppm reading.

After talking to the guy who gave us the anemone (who regularly mixes water for his 180L tank), we are now looking into buying the right equipment to mix our saltwater. Our friend recommended that we buy some sort of mixer and a heater as well as salt (he uses the brand Red Sea). My dad and I are planning to order these things this week so, hopefully, by next week, we'll be able to do some much needed water changes.

An update on the tank in general:

We are currently being plagued by cyanobacteria and I've been trying to stop it from killing our zoa by gently siphoning (so that the red sheets fly off of the coral). Hopefully once we get our nitrates down this will clear up, although I'm not sure if it's works like that..

We are down to 7 hermits- I'm not entirely sure how two of them died but it was sad to see bits of dead hermit crab buried underneath the gravel (and I haven't been able to find their empty shells!)

I'm currently feeding our chromis every other day and I think I might try preparing food in advance (as recommended by Morgan)- it's been pretty time consuming waiting for tiny bits of mysis shrimp to thaw and separating it from the 'juice'.

We feed the anemone every Monday and it's seems to be doing very well- it's bioluminescence seems to be more vivid now that we've been giving it some proper food.

Again, thanks for all the support and advice! Hopefully things will only get better from now on. :)


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spiraling

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the advice!
We are currently being plagued by cyanobacteria and I've been trying to stop it from killing our zoa by gently siphoning (so that the red sheets fly off of the coral). Hopefully once we get our nitrates down this will clear up, although I'm not sure if it's works like that..
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New tanks seem to go through several stages, one often being cyano. I'm not sure I have an explanation, but nitrates could be fueling it. Keep blowing it with a turkey baster and siphoning it off and it eventually should go away. I still get a bit time to time in my 3 year old tank, but not the sheets of it like before.

Glad everything is going well!
 

rmud

Member
7. When feeding, go easy. Ever hear the phrase “leave the table a little hungry?” The fish will act like they are starving after you have fed them (at least mine does). Here is my recipe:

in a small plastic cup I add:
1 cube of frozen Marine Cuisine
1 small amount of vegetable flake food
5ml of liquid garlic
Top off with about 20ml of aquarium water

For my tank, this gives me about 3 days of meals. I store the excess in the fridge (not the freezer). The next time I have to make up food, I follow the same recipe but trade out the Marine Cuisine for frozen Mysis shrimp. Gives them a little variety.

Thank you so much for the advice! I just tried out food that I prepared in advance- it's so much easier to separate the tiny mysis shrimp from all the 'juice'! I can actually see my chromis eat individual pieces of shrimp rather than just clouds of juice which also makes me feel better about feeding her every other day. :)

Another update:

My dad and I went and bought the equipment for mixing saltwater and we are getting a plumber to tidy up our RO system set up (so that there aren't tubes flying everywhere) so we'll probably start water changes tomorrow.

I'll attach pictures of our set up and the mixing equipment we got.

One quick question- the mixing tank we got didn't come with a tap so my dad is installing one himself but bought a brass tap- will that affect the salt water we plan to mix? I'm not sure is metal and saltwater go well together...
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rmud

Member
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Here's also a picture of our tank at 9 weeks now. I siphon the gravel and rock every other day now as that's how long it takes the cyano to grow in sheets again. The anemone and zoa are still doing very well.
 

jringold

Member
One quick question- the mixing tank we got didn't come with a tap so my dad is installing one himself but bought a brass tap- will that affect the salt water we plan to mix? I'm not sure is metal and saltwater go well together...
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Don't use the brass tap at all. Brass is an alloy of copper and zinc. Copper is bad news in a marine aquarium for a bunch or reasons. 1) Copper will corrode in salt water. 2) Copper is toxic to marine inverts.

You would be much better off getting a PVC tap at any home improvement store.

Morgan
 
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Frankie

Well-Known Member
RS STAFF
Hey there!
Breezed through your thread here. Nice rock work.
From what I've read it seems your going to keep the anemone.
You got great advice here so far and I have to say keeping it will be a mistake in the end. It's going to die in your setup. Your water is not ready yet. Or your level of experience.
I suggest rethinking things.
You have some very experienced people on this thread (and some not so much) and I would take advantage of it if I were you.
You seem to have the fire for the hobby, take it slow.
All the hard work you are putting into learning and getting your water parameters correct are going to blow up when that thing dies.
The title said Help so that i's what I suggest.
Good luck!
 

rmud

Member
Hey there!
Breezed through your thread here. Nice rock work.
From what I've read it seems your going to keep the anemone.
You got great advice here so far and I have to say keeping it will be a mistake in the end. It's going to die in your setup. Your water is not ready yet. Or your level of experience.
I suggest rethinking things.
You have some very experienced people on this thread (and some not so much) and I would take advantage of it if I were you.
You seem to have the fire for the hobby, take it slow.
All the hard work you are putting into learning and getting your water parameters correct are going to blow up when that thing dies.
The title said Help so that i's what I suggest.
Good luck!

I understand what you and others have told me and if it were up to me, the anemone would have been gone a long time ago.

I've had 'heated discussions' with my dad about keeping the anemone but I think it's hard for him to understand that- yes the anemone looks great now -but it could die at any given time. He is the one that pays for everything so I don't have much say I'm afraid.

I'm honestly trying to make the best out of a bad situation. Hopefully everything will turn out alright but if it doesn't then at least we'll learn that we can't have everything at once.


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Frankie

Well-Known Member
RS STAFF
Ok no worries.
I guess we will have to prepare then.

Are you using carbon?
What is the current status of the water parameters?
How's the salinity doing and temperature?
Those two things being stable all the time, 24/7 is crucial.
 

ApolloRoma

New Member
Did Fortnightly water Test,
1.025 Salinity
25C Temp
Calcium 420 ppm
KH 9
Phosphate 0
Nitrate 5 ppm
Magnesium 1200
Think I will slowly increase Magnesium while continuing dosing for Calcium increases and Nitrate removal doses. ( every other day each )
Highly recommend looking into Coral varieties for beginners.
Lobophylia are great, all the large polyp stony corals are a great way to decorate your tank and enjoy your new hobby.
Awesome RODI, mixing your own Saltwater as well, you are going leaps and bounds .
Think your Anemone might surprise you how tough it may be..... Chillax.... It won't explode overnight!

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Frankie

Well-Known Member
RS STAFF
No, it's not going to explode. It will shrink and hide into a rock and die there polluting the water.
Just going off My 20+ years of experience. ;)

No need to dose ca++ or anything.
you have nothing that's going to uptake it. Yet.
Basic water changes will provide all that is needed for now.
Salt brand does matter. What salt are you using?
 

rmud

Member
We were going to use Red Sea but we went to another aquatics centre and they gave us Tropic Marin. After mixing, I tested our homemade water and nitrates were less than 2ppm (a VERY faint pink) so I think the brand is fine.

I did a full test on our tank water (after one 10% water change with our homemade water):

Nitrates 50ppm (still very high but not as deep in colour as it used to be).

Nitrites less than 0.05ppm (the colour was leaning more towards 0 than 0.05)- I'll attach a picture so you can try and determine the colour for yourself as I think I'm being picky!

Ammonia 0ppm

pH 8.2

Alkalinity 9dKH

Salinity 1.023s.g.

Temperature is always at 25C

I don't have a phosphate test kit but I am looking into buying one in the near future!

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rmud

Member
Update:

I've been doing 10% (8L) water changes everyday for 3 days now. It's still early days but I'll attach photos of nitrate tests I've done so you can see the (very small) reduction in nitrates. It's hard to tell on camera, but the pink is becoming a little less deep in colour.

The anemone still seems to be doing well. We tried feeding it a little less (because we felt it was struggling to 'swallow' the pinky sized pieces of mussel) and it seemed much happier having a smaller piece this week. Our chromis is doing well and I haven't lost any more hermits.

We are still dealing with pretty bad cyanobacteria but I'm siphoning the gravel and rock every other day to stop it from taking over our tank.

My dad and I decided we would carry on with these daily water changes until the nitrates get to around 5ppm. I have a feeling that this process will take a lot longer than the theoretical 10 days it should take but our nitrates have been over 50ppm for such a long time that I don't want to 'shock' our tank with a sudden nitrate reduction.

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DaveK

Well-Known Member
As you can see, a 10% water change only makes a small dent in nitrate. To be more effective, you really need to change 30 to 50% of the water. However, to do this you really need to be careful about matching up water parameters.

Consider slowly rampping up the amount of water your changing and see how your anemone reacts to larger water changes. As long as it opens up soon after the water change, your doing ok. If it retracts and doesn't come out for a day or so, you should back off on the amount of water your changing.
 

ApolloRoma

New Member
G'day, just curious rmud how often you clean your filter?
Have you removed and cleaned your filter pump impeller?
How strong is the water circulation in your tank?


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rmud

Member
I just finished doing a 30% water change and the anemone seems fine (it was already a bit deflated before the water change and has stayed the same).

We will probably stick with 30% water changes from now on because we our mixing bucket can only hold 25L (so 50% changes are out of the question).

In response to ApolloRoma and Frankie:

Our tank has three filtration chambers. The first is filled with bioballs, the second holds the protein skimmer and the third has filtration combs with filter fleeces.

After reading through the tank instruction manual again, we cleaned the whole of the skimmer (impeller and all) for the first time last weekend- 3 months after setting up the tank. There wasn't a lot of muck, just a very thin layer of green slime here and there but we still plan to clean the whole of the second chamber every two weeks from now on.

We haven't cleaned the first chamber yet but are planning to do so this weekend.

Our powerhead is on its highest setting and provides the tank with a constant, strong flow- enough for the siphon to be blown across the tank if it isn't being held!

Frankie asked if we are using carbon- we aren't but I am interested to know the benefits of using it and which chamber we would put it in..

My next post will probably be an update on nitrate levels.



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rmud

Member
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Here is a photo of our nitrate levels a day after the 30% water change. We ran out of salt so we'll do another 30% tomorrow.

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The anemone and zoa seem to be doing very well after the water change. :)


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